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I know you are probably sick of this by now, but I have seen that some people are keen to make sure Nayars fall under the category of Sudra. We all know they were called Sudra, no one denies that, but they had Kshatriya qualities as well (whether or not they were ever classed as Kshatriyas is beside the point). The fact is: Nayars did the Kshatriya dharma and were called Sudra. Let this be stated in the article. It is only fair. Kshatriyan 10:34, 13 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yes Wikipedia is not the place for opinions. Nairs were warriors, administrators and in cases rulers. There are thousands of references to this fact. And there are thousands of references that link these occupations with the concept of "Kshatriya Dharma". This is not calling the Nairs "Kshatriya" but just making it clear what exactly their occupation was. (In case you are wondering this is not an indirect comparison between Nairs and "Kshatriya Dharma", but a direct link)

Kshatriyan 08:31, 15 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

But that inference is not supported by fact. If you have a reference from any reliable source that says that Nairs followed "Kshatriya Dharma", then we can include it. It is true that Nairs were rulers, administrators and warriors, but that they followed the "Kshatriya Dharma" is your conclusion and interpretation. --vi5in^[talk] 15:27, 15 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

As I have mentioned to you before, it is not my conclusion or interpretation, but in accordance with the Manu Smriti. The problem is that your reasoning doesn't seem to hold when it concerns Nairs being given the title of "Shudra". Just because Nambuthris and other authors of books called Nairs this, it should not be held as fact should it? They are entitled to their opinions, and as such it should be mentioned that Nairs were called "Shudra" but undertook the "Kshatriya Dharma" (in accordance with the Manu Smriti). This best explains their status, which is at best ambiguous, like many other non-Vedic communities. I am not seeking a one sided view point, I want the article to show the facts.

Kshatriyan 11:10, 18 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The reasoning that I have given for Nairs being called "Sudras" is that it is supported by history - Namboothiris called the Nairs Sudras. I also added a source that says the same thing, and also referenced O. Chandumemon's Indulekha. It is true that the Manu Smriti says that one's varna is determined by one's actions. But applying that logic to Nairs is still "original research". What we need is a reliable source that says the same thing (basically that Nairs have Kshatriya Dharma). We can't say it ourselves. --vi5in^[talk] 16:09, 19 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Reply

Hi - I've issued him a final and more detailed warning. If he continues, notify me or any other administrator and he will be blocked from editing. Btw, you may want to take a lead in resolving this content dispute by placing a notice and help request on WT:INB. Rama's arrow 23:21, 30 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hi - our userpages were vandalized by this user, who moved them to new titles. I've repaired the damage but lemme know if there is anything amiss. As for the vandal, I've blocked him indefinitely. Also, I am going to semi-protect your userpage and talkpage, so he can't vandalize again by using an ip address. Rama's arrow 04:49, 31 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest you make a list of the articles needing fixing, turn it sideways and stick it straight up at WP:RM! They should be able to fix it. :) Rama's arrow 17:14, 31 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Page moves

I'm trying to undo some of the damage. Some of the moves have been improperly done, and now article histories are scattered here and there. Is the content in Eezhava different from that at Ezhava? Which is the correct version? Both have over 500 edits. Shall I merge them to Ezhava?--thunderboltz^(TALK) 18:25, 31 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the guidance

Iam relatively a new user. Thanks for informing me that there is a Malayalam group for Wikipedia. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ARUNKUMAR P.R (talk • contribs) 11:45, 1 April 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Request for Help

Hi, I am new at Wikipedia. Can you please tell me how can I put letters of other languages, say Hindi or Punjabi, on Wikipages...Thanks. Jon Ascton

Thanks...and another Request

Kindly tell me the exact Wikipage where I can load a particular language i.e. Hindi (it's script is Devnagri, by the way)...and thanks for your last reply! Jon Ascton

reply

I've given my views, than you for the invitation.Baka man 22:49, 11 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Please Help

How did you create all those boxes? Please cteach me to create the box-Iam a keralite. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by ARUNKUMAR P.R (talk • contribs) 06:38, 16 April 2007 (UTC).[reply]

ABCD

Hi, I (lightly) copy edited the paragraph (in the South Asian Americans article). I must say you did a good job. I have temporarily added a fact tag. I think we should be able a citation for the identity crisis. Fowler&fowler «Talk» 14:40, 17 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Kochu Thomman Kottappadi

Roughly translated, the stuff looks like this: If the nairs do not like the use of "sudra", "savarnasudra" etc , why do you force feed these? There may be so many other ways of expressing the same matter.There's n't a need to quote text where it's offensive or unpleasant. The purpose of the article is to distribute relevent details to the public.This can be done in other ways also.It need not pin prick someone..well, it's upto you nairs what you write about yourselves. Similiar tactics with Christians/Muslims may generate violent reactions. Also i feel at ease with Malayalam, and my own brand of Malayalam.This is the dialect of the central travancore christians.I can express a lot with it.Please bear with it.I hope you understand malayalam.Language, after all, is little more than a means of communication.Kochu Thomman Kottappadi 05:09, 18 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Thanks!!! Pls help me on such issues in future too.

 :) -- ArunKumar P.R

Created my first box

I created my first box.... Thanks again......

This user hails from Kerala, India.

-Arun Kumar P.R

I do not remember to have deleted anything from yourtalk page.Please confirm it again.Lunchadmit 06:13, 19 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry for the trouble

Sorry for the inconvinience.I will look to it more carefully in future.

ArunKumar P.R

Page-Malayalee

Hello Vivin,

Iam here to say an urgent matter.The Malayalee page is so small (kind of stub) when compared to other ethinic group pages such as Kannadigas etc.So can you please help in expanding that page and making it a premiere one?

Please reply...

ArunKumar P.R(talk)

Malayalee

Hai,

Yes,we could use Kannadiga page as the template.I think we could add information about our folk arts and traditions.I think we should develop this page,after all we are the most industrious people in India.

) ---Arunkumar P.R

Please teach him

Hai,

My friend and Ayurvedic doctor Mr.Sarath Chandran has signed in Wikipedia in the user name drsarath.Can you please teach him the basics of Wikipedia such as editing an article....I cannot teach him properly because I itself am a new wikipedian.

Please write to him.He is available in ml-N user category.

) -----Arunkumar P.R

Adam's Bridge

Stop arguing with me when you are wrong. --Raghav03

See my comments on the article's talk page. --vi5in^[talk] 23:33, 25 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks

Thanks for introducing Sarath to Wikipedia.

Also I have made some changes to the page Malayalee,ie,I have introduced new titles.Please check it.If there is any wrong,please correct it.

) -----Arunkumar P.R

I do not understand your problem. Who are you to tell others what should be there. Defining the title Panicker is not your area of concern.

THANKS

HELLO VIVIN,

THANKS FOR INTRODUCING ME TO WIKIPEDIA.HOPE YOU WILL GUIDE ME THROUGH WIKIPEDIA.

Dr sarath —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Drsarath (talk • contribs) 09:26, 28 April 2007 (UTC).[reply]

Malayalee

Hello Vivin Chetta,

I have added three more topics to Malayalee page.Please read that and give your opinion.If there is any thing wrong, please edit it.If possible,Please give that page a good link and wiki link title.And also, don't forget to copy edit it.

Congratulations for that defender barn star...

{user ARUNKUMAR P.R}

Surprise!

		The Defender of the Wiki Barnstar
		I, thunderboltz award Vivin the Defender of Wiki Barnstar for tirelessly striving to maintain NPOV despite all the rogue opposition he had to face. Great job, dude!--thunderboltz^(TALK) 06:10, 29 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Well deserved! :-) --thunderboltz^(TALK) 06:10, 29 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Chittisinghpura massacre

Hi. Could you plz keep a watch on Chittisinghpura massacre? Several anonymous and redlinked users (possibly socks) with militant sympathies are reverting to misrepresented versions of the article. Thanks.128.83.131.124 23:22, 29 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Nair

References for "Kshatriya Dharma"? See the Manusmriti which says that the "Dravidian Warriors" were once "noble Kshatriyas" but since they did not observe Brahmin supremacy were "degraded to Shudra status" (X/43-44). The citation for Nairs being "shudra" as been a citation from works by C. Menon and K.M Parinikar (from Nair link), I think that the numerous citations of Nairs undertaking "Warrior duty" (directly translated to "Kshatriya Dharma" in Sanskrit) included in the bottom of the Nair article from various travellers, explorers, other authorities, do also carry some weight. Kshatriyan 10:31, 2 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not trying to be pedantic here, trust me :) There is no one other than myself that would like to see this issue resolved. Is there any explicit reference to Nairs being these Dravidian Warriors? We know that Ezhavas also took part in warfare. Also, what is the time period of the Manusmriti? The Dravidian Warriors they are referring to, could be Cheras. It's hard to say. The quotes themselves say that they were warriors and had a duty to be warriors. But like I said, we need something that says explicitly "Nairs followed the Kshatriya Dharma". I am not sure if the article currently talks about Nairs undertaking the Hiranyagharba ceremony to become Kshatriyas (like the Kerala kings). --vi5in^[talk] 15:09, 2 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

On the subject of sources, are there any references that Nairs were "Shudras" in the scriptures which actually states "Nayars of Kerala were Shudra"? Kshatriyan 08:05, 5 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Not scriptures. But I already have a cited source, and I've also got references from O. Chandumenon. I had it on the page originally, but it got lost during the edits. I have to add it again. --vi5in^[talk] 23:01, 5 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Help

Hi vivin i need some help

Can you please let me know whats the meaning of "vivin" and is it a hindu/sanskrit(desi) word?

thanks

Nair

Hello Vivin, I am not a Keralian but a Sangwan Jat of Haryana. But I have read enough about this unique caste of Nairs & its unique warrior customs. No body (least of all U) can place them anywhere else or deny them their warrior origins or status. Manusmriti makes no mention of any Nambootri or Nair. So, by all counts Kerala & its people never existed in the Vedic Chaturvarna. MANU MAKES NO SPECIFIC CASTE MENTION, SO DONT USE HIM TO AUTHENTICATE YOUR NONSENSE. Regarding your Keralopathi, I repeat Gunderts famous quote on the same, "The keralolpathi is a farrago of lies". Lies spoken today, yesterday, or tommorow donot make the basis for informative discussion on Wikipedia or anywhere else. Sangwan Jats are also not specifically mentioned in Vedic literature, nor do the Rajputs consider them Kshatriyas. Well, like the Nairs, WE JATS DON'T CARE. The world knows we are warriors & we dont have to await bonafides from Manu or Keralolpathi or Haryanapathi written for Brahmins. In brief, get real & donot assume U are the one & only master of anthropology in the world.

My last edit, I forgot my name & e-mail ID Name: Shaligram Yadav E-mail: shaligramyadav@yahoo.com

I told you who I am & proudly give my name & if your greatness demands I will give you my Address & tele number where we can meet & talk in Delhi. You have no courage (intellectual or otherwise. Hence, you hide behind assumed identities & try to palm off non-sense on the internet. Tell me; Does your being a Nair & my being a Sangwan Jat make you a greater authority on the subject of Nairs? What are your "facts' based on? Are you the last authority on the subject in your Kerala itself or an unknown Vivin or whoever you are? Why do you also delete their "Hindu warrior" status. Every book from Fawcetts to Gunderts to the Malabar Manual addresses them so. So what is your problem? Lastly, you can claim to be a Nair. But I am sure it's as false as the claims you make. I have never been to Kerala, but there are many Nairs in Delhi & their mental and physical attributes distinguish them as warriors & Nairs. They are a proud, transparent people who donot hide behind Wiki stuff or pseudonyms. Get real man. Next, start writing on Jats & claim to be an authority on them also. I shall delete your non-sense there also. Shaligramyadav shaligramyadav@yahoo.com