User talk:Grutness: Difference between revisions

Please add new discussions at the bottom of the page!

Earlier talk

I've moved discussions prior to March 15, 2005 from this page to archive pages (as listed below). A few of the items I've simply got rid of - if I have, it's simply that it was trivial and/or stuff which has been dealt with, and is therefore no longer relevant. The deletion is not a reflection of my opinion of the writers!

My intention is to move any threads that have not been touched for four weeks to the archives. Grutness|^hello?

Archive pages

• User: Grutness/archive01 - October 2004 to January 2005
• User: Grutness/archive02 - February 2005
• User: Grutness/archive03 - March 2005 to early April 2005
• User: Grutness/archive04 - mid April 2005 to (yet to be created)

Stub Categories

The full plain-text list of stub categories (formerly at User:Grutness/Stubs) is now at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Stub_sorting/Stub_types, complete with links to the templates.

Adminship

I decided to test my strength. Do you want to nominate me for admin? Darwinek 16:29, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Motorcycle stub

I'll toss items here as I find them until you've established the stub, if that's OK with you. Courtland 16:16, 2005 Feb 26 (UTC)

Yeah, that's fine. I noticed a whole bunch under "Yamaha" at the end of Category:Stub, (about seven of them, IIRC. Grutness|^hello?

SM_125; Bimota; BMW_F650GS

Caribbean stubs

You started {{Caribbean-geo-stubs}} a couple months ago, and I was wondering if it might not be appropriate to complement it with a {{Caribbean-bio-stub}}. Just a thought - if bio-stubs are being broken up (as I see they are) might it not be a useful companion category? Thanks Guettarda 16:32, 21 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Possibly - it would make sense if bio-stubs were broken up the same way as geo-stubs. But it largely depends on how many Caribbean bio-stubs there are. It's worth you suggesting it at Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Criteria, though - that's where the stub-dividing's going on. There are people there working on bio-stubs far more than I am. Grutness|^hello?

Dn

Tomahawk, Kew (you shouldn't have missed that one - you pass it often enough), Corstorphine, Concord, Bradford, Brockville, Kaikorai, Balmacewen, Wakari, Glenleith... Did you mention Macandrew Bay, Broad Bay, Portobello...? I'll give you a while. Splendid as far as it goes. Robin Patterson 04:51, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Use of MINOR tag

I like your addition to Mana regarding political party names, but (IMHO) any addition like that should not be marked as "minor", that reserved for changes like editing correction spellings, fixing links, etc. That said, my visit to your user page got me into your art as shown on your web pages. I really like it! I assume you sell pieces. I'll explore your web page further and see what I can learn about techniques and prices. - Marshman 18:06, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You're right of course - I've been working on changing stub template messages so much lately that it's become automatic for me to click the button for "minor edit". I'll have to be more careful about it.

I'm glad you like my art! Yes, I do sell work, though I haven't got any prices listed on my site - they tend to range approximately from $US 250 to 500 (plus packing/postage), depending mainly on the size of the paintings. The site needs a bit of updating too, come to think of it - quite a bit of new art and quite a few of the older pieces have sold. If you're interested in any of it, let me know! Grutness|^hello?

Integrated Ocean Drilling Program

Thanks. I tried geology-stub, but that didn't exist.  :) RickK 06:32, Apr 9, 2005 (UTC)

It's getting very difficult to remember what is and isn't available in stub categories! Grutness|^hello?

Bucharest... in Bulgaria?!

Hi Grutness. I'd like to know why you labelled the article over at Titan, Bucharest as a Bulgarian geography stub. Bucharest is of course the capital of Romania! I'm not trying to be arrogant here, would just really like to know why you thought that article was related to Bulgaria. Cheers, Ronline 12:00, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Buna seara Ronline - put it down to tiredness. I sorted about 4000 geostubs over the course of a month; there was bound to be the odd error. So far, two people have spotted mistakes. Still too many mistakes and no excuse, but 2 in 4000 isn't too bad! Maybe I should check to see whether there are any articles about Sofia in the Romanian-geo-stubs! :) My apologies! Grutness|^hello?

Hello again! 4000 geostubs! That really is a lot, indeed, and of course at that level errors are bound to occur. I was just curious because there really have been people who have come up to me before and confused countries like that, and were really insistent about it :) That's great work you're doing by the way, since it's wonderful to see definite categories for stubs that editors can then work on in their certain "field of expertise". Have a nice day, Ronline 12:28, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

By the way, I see you're in New Zealand. I have just come back from visiting over there, since I'm on a one-month trip to Australia & NZ. I didn't actually go as far south as Dunedin, stopped at Christchurch, which is a great place. Loved the European feel of the city. I'm currently in Sydney, Australia, and going to return to Romania in a bit more than a week.

Thanks

Thanks for supporting my adminship nomination. Coincidently I finished my BSc at Otago, at this time of year I'm gald to be in Canberra :) --nixie 12:07, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I wasn't entirely sure about nomination etiquette, so I thought I'd thank people as they voted, if I don't get to the required number I still appreciate the vote of confidence. --nixie 12:23, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

My Welcome Message

Not to sound mean or anything, but why are you editing my welcome message template that's in my user space (that is linked to from all user pages I put it on)? — Ilγαηερ (Tαlκ) 22:59, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Mea culpa - tried to fix it as soon as I found out, but you'd beaten me to the revert button. Apologies. Grutness|^hello?

Okay...I had suspected it so, I just kind of got worked up about it...:( — Ilγαηερ (Tαlκ) 23:24, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Re: Alexander McNair

Oops. Sorry. I do get confused about different stub categories. I normally follow Wikipedia:Template messages/Stubs which isn't very helpful. I'll try to remember your advice in future. Thanks. P Ingerson 08:08, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Hist-stub vs Bio-stub

per your post >>Hi Feco - I notice a couple of your stub additions (e.g., Thomas Lucy) are to put biographies into the history stub category rather than the biography stub category. Category:Historical stubs has a note in it saying NB: For biographies of historical characters, use {{bio-stub}} or one of its subcategories, instead of {{hist-stub}}. (Don't sweat it too much - any stub categorising is useful, but bio-stub's a better one to use here!).<< I'll do that in the future. From time to time, an unregistered user goes on an article-creation kick and generates several related articles in a short time frame. I try to drop those into some useful stub category to make sure they don't get totally lost as orphans. I must have not paid attention to stub rules on that day... I'll pay more attention next time. Thx for the pointer. Feco 08:22, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Fair enough - you're doing a good job. As to stub rules, all the stub categories are slowly being streamlined to try to cut their sizes down - hist-stub's being worked on at the moment, leaving only bio-stub as a big "dump" category to go. That's the next job :) Grutness|^hello?

Daibhidh O Duibhghennain

Daibhidh O Duibhghennain, if you are interested. Fergananim

Possible Template

Hey James,

I was wondering if a template like this will be useful in Wikipedia. I had a template I maded put on VfD (my choice acutally) and I do not wish to go through that process again.

BTW, two things: I will mail your flag once I get yours and B, I would start to archive your page if I was you. Zscout370 14:11, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The template looks OK to me - the other option would be to do one of those "preceded by/followed by" type boxes. It's not a subject i know much about - would someone looking up one of these people be likely to want to look up one of the others as well? If so, then I'd say go for it. As to the flag, I mailed it out today, so it should be there by next Monday (or the weekend if you're lucky!). And yes, I already have two archived pages - it is looking like time for a third...

How to spot a sockpuppet

There is something called a "sockpuppet check" that only developers can do. You might want to ask one for help. See the page on sockpuppets for details. --cesarb 17:20, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Mount Edgecumbe, New Zealand

Sorry about that! I didn't realize that was the custom. You may want to make this explicit at Wikipedia:Naming conventions. Thanks! hike395 14:06, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Good idea - willdo. Grutness|^hello? 23:40, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

User:Starky/Stubbing

I just noticed that you protected several pages geo-stub-sorted by me and reverted by Starky, obviously especially the ones concerning Czechia; is there a problem which I could help to resolve? Lectonar 14:10, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the offer, and I'll definitely keep it in mind. At the moment I'm waiting for a developer's investigation of whether User: Starky is a sockpuppet.

Basically (to cut a long story short), new user User:NoPuzzleStranger starts getting into edit wars to do with European geography articles (notably about the term Czechia) skirting and occasionally exceeding the three revert rule. Then a new user appeared in Wikipedia - User:Starky. His total time on Wikipedia was two hours. During this timey, he created Template:Czech-geo-stub and replaced every use of Template:Czechia-geo-stub with this new template. Finally, he listed Template:Czechia-geo-stub on tfd - to be supported by NoPuzzleStranger. During the following two days NoPuzzleStranger has several times edited and/or reverted the two templates and their associated categories, only to be reverted by one of several other users. In the end I did the only thing I could think of - I protected the original template and category.

Understandably, if (as I suspect) Starky and NoPuzzleStranger are the same person it'll put a different light on things, so I'm waiting to find out whether that's the case before going any further - but, as I said, I'll keep your offer in mind! Thanks! Grutness|^hello? 23:45, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I would like to suggest that the Czechia-geo-stub be unprotected, because even if the edit war continues and escalates, it will not affect the readers looking at the articles with the stub message a great deal. The current protected message box is big and unsightly and may lead readers to think that the article itself is protected. What's even worse, the talk page link in the message box points to the article's talk page, instead of the template's talk page. I think this may confuse newcomers to Wikipedia, and for the sake of making their experience smoother, it may be best to just allow the edit war to continue. Alternatively, you could just remove the protected template, while keeping the page protected. Thanks. --Aramգուտանգ 18:32, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I belive the same. I find your massive protection ineffective and counterproductive. Czech vs. Czechia arguement is still alive and will remain so for a long time (I, for one, prefer Czech over Czechia ;-)) ), it vould probably be better to start a serious discussion on this matter right on Category_talk:Czechia_geography_stubs) and not to hide it here. --Unregistered:1OP, 13.04.2005 23:40 (UTC+2)

What the reader sees is irrelevant as far as stub templates and categorisatio are concerned. Repeated changing of stub categories requires a lot of work from stub sorters. For every edit that is being made by NoPuzzleStranger to change a stub category, 101 are currenlty required by stub sorters to revert it, since every article in the category requires a null-edit to m,ove it to the correct categorisation. Grutness|^hello? 02:50, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sorry, I didn't realise all the articles would need to be null-edited for the categorisation to update. Thanks for moving the protected notice to the template talk page, that takes care of the problem I was referring to. --Aramգուտանգ 03:02, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sock puppets

Replied to your request for sock puppet info at Village Pump (Misc.), but I see someone's already got there. :) — PMcM 16:08, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

William Dummer

Yeah, I noticed that, thanks. I had done it right after doing Dummer's War so I didn't even think to look up what stub it would be. Thanks for fixing it. Sholtar 19:48, Apr 12, 2005 (UTC)

Sandbox Help

James, I have a favour to ask of you. There has been users just dump over 140k of stuff into the Sandbox. I am thinking just one person is doing it, yet he takes on many personas (perhaps sock puppets). Can you watch the Sandbox and see what is going on please? Zscout370 02:00, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I'll have a go... but to be honest this is an area of Wikipedia I know very little about. I might put a general note out to one or two of the more experienced admins who know more, see if they know what's up. Grutness|^hello?

The codes being dumped on the page recently has to deal with Fonzie from Happy Days, Homosexuality, and every so often, Wiennie Hunt Jr's. I am not trying to get the Atlas Award, but it looks like I am bound to get it someday :) Zscout370 03:15, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Sandbox Header

Dear James, here is the header I have found inside the Sandbox:

<You go girl! We politely ask you to leave the line above alone during Easter Mass. As this page is for editing experiments, this page will automatically be cleaned every 6 hours. The sandbox is indeed a nice place to play! Let's add our junk and nonsense in here and create the nastiest place on Wikipedia! Let's go!>

I don't know about you, but this is a call for vandalism in the Sandbox. Zscout370 16:54, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Frank Petre (again!)

Hi James, thought you might like to know your great photographs and contributions are currently here [1] I think Bishonen has taken out all my English grammatical mistakes, if you find any left, I keep tweaking it after Bishonen has finished, could you remove them for me, thanks. Giano | Talk 12:23, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

About the stub templates...

• Oops - I did not know about the stub categories, or the need for popular support, and I have made a few others. I made a Uganda stub and an honor society stub as well - {{Uganda-stub}} and {{honor-stub}} . Is a stub category functionally the same as an article category? -- 8^D BDAbramson^gab 03:28, 2005 Apr 14 (UTC)

replied.

And again

James, copy edits and additions great, I had been meaning to ask you why Dunedin expanded so fast and quickly. I'm not a 100% sure about the new picture layout, bit I suppose it looks tidier (I live surrounded by pictures at various heights and mostly askew!) Someone has commented on it needing a footnote, I will have time later today to see to that. It all looks quite hopeful at the moment, I really want this one on the front page. I think the next one should be an architectural appraisal of Dunedin. looking for Petre's stuff has unearthed some other interesting buildings. People over here tend to think NZ is all sheep, bungee jumping and Lord of the Rings. Well at least the first two sound like fun!. I'll never get my toungue around English, I thought it was on an Island now it's in. I think its done to trip the rest of us up! Giano | Talk 06:26, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

1. The gold rush was what did it - Dunedin went from 2000 people in 1860 to 20,000 in 1865. By the 1920s it was up to 75,000.
2. I just wasn't that happy with the text weaving in and out of it, and pictures breaking through the headings.
3. There are a lot of them here. I wrote the articles on the Dunedin Railway Station and 'Larnach Castle, two of the city's gems. I don't know whether it's possible to get hold of a copy of the Knight and Wales book where you are, but if you can it's well worth it if you want an overview of the city's buildings.
4. :) NZ's use of the words for the two islands is a bit unusual. A rough rule of thumb seems to be that if it's small enough to still feel like an island you'd use "on" - if it's big enough to feel like a country then it tends to be "in". Grutness|^hello?

• I see what you mean with the pictures, just my personal taste is a bit erratic I suppose, we'll leave them as you have them as that seems to be the norm. I'll see if I can find the book here, there's some quite eclectic book shops in London, plus all the Oz. shops selling boomerangs and didgerogoos or whatever they're called.

Regarding the English I think I'll first try and master the idiosyncratic and mispronounced version spoken here, then buy a NZ phrase book.; anyway their seems to a Kiwi invasion here, so it should be quite easy to pick up!Giano | Talk 07:43, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Categories for deletion/Restructuring

Please revisit this and vote on #2C and #6 (variations on earlier proposals). Yours, Radiant_* 15:31, Apr 14, 2005 (UTC)

Administratorship

Thanks for your comments on Wikipedia:Requests for adminship/Wilfried Derksen. Your comment made me aware of the necesity of filling in the Edit Summary line in case of non minor edits. It made ma also ware of careful labeling an edit as minor or non minor. I will change my way of editing pages by clearly selecting minor and non minor edits and to fill in an edit summary in the last case. With this comment I would like to ask you to reconsider your vote. Wilfried Derksen = Electionworld 16:29, 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Jules Henry

Thanks for editing my Jules Henry stub. I hope you can save it and develop it further or give me suggestions for doing so.

I take it you're User:Norawright? All I did was change the stub template to a more precise one. That should enable people editing similar articles to find it and improve it. As to what to do to improve it, do a Google search, see if you can find something about him - dates of birth and death, when he was at Washington University, where he was born, where else he worked - that sort of stuff. General biographical background. That will add quite a bit to the article. It might also give you some ideas about who he was influenced by and who he influenced. He was involved in developmental and educational psychology - who else was working in that field at the time? Plus you should be able to add some links to other articles - at the moment the article has no links on it at all. Hope that helps. Grutness|^hello? 04:26, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)

And again!

Don't you lot ever go to bed down there? Yes, its a much improved image (better than the original) I have a software package that does it too, but I always get carried away and never know when to stop, you've obviously got the touch. Its looking good on FA isn't it, it would be great to see these buildings on the main page. We'll have to start a Kiwi campaign when it becomes Fa to get it there. I found another of his Dunedin houses today, but I suppose it would get to boring if it banged on for too long, there's only so much can be said about a house after all. I wish I could have found a picture of Dunedin's Royal Exchange for the evaluation section, there's one from a real estate company on the internet, but it would never pass the copyright test - Never mind. Giano | Talk 12:47, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)

It's only 12.45am :) FA is looking good. Shame you didn't mention about the Royal Exchange building when i was taking photos earlier - i actually know someone who works in that building... Grutness|^hello?

I didn't know about the Roylal Exchange then unfortunatly, but it seems to be going OK without it. 12.45, I'm dead by 11 pm! Giano | Talk 13:22, 15 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Get's better by the minute!Giano | Talk 07:16, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Australia-gov-stub & edit function

Sorry about creating a new stub without discussing it first; I hope I haven't caused any problems? In future, any stubs that I want to create I will propose on the Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Criteria page for discussion first.

About the edit function on my talk page, I have no idea what's going on, it was working fine yesterday. Do you know anyone who could help fix this problem? – AxSkov (T) 14:22, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

New O Duibhgeannains/Dignams

Saw you added a few more contempory members of the clan; how about writing at least short stubs on them? Ferganaim

Sadly I don't know enough about them. Don't know either whether Campbell Duignan would be big enough to warrant an article. The actors (Basil and Mark Dignam) probably should have articles - Basil anyway - he was a regular in a lot of British movies in the 1960s and 1970s - I might try to write something on him if there's nothing in Wikipedia. Katherine Duignan is already redlinked elsewhere on Wikipedia (Robert_Burns_Fellowship). Wasn't there a 19th century Irish politician involved in the home rule debates called Duignan? Grutness|^hello?

Thank you!

Thank you for your support on my RfA! I shall attempt to put the shiny new buttons to good use. Incidentally, I think I've seen your edits everywhere and then some; I admire your patience and hard work (or maybe just masochism?) with the stubs. Mindspillage (spill yours?) 00:46, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

China stubs

I hadn't realized what a mess I was poking my nose into in making a (in my mind) obvious and simple change when I encountered the "Mainland China" title on a stub I was looking at. IMHO it's as absurd as having separate "Alaska", "Hawaii", and "Mainland US" stubs, but I'm in no mood to be drawn into some sort of raging battle.

BTW, you wrote PLEASE do change it. Did you mean "PLEASE don't change it"? --Calton | Talk 07:37, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Yes I meant "please don't..." Personally I agree with you, but terms such as "China", "Mainland China", "Republic of China", etc can be very touchy for some, particularly those who live there. Grutness|^hello? 07:43, 19 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject Stub sorting/Criteria duplication

I've fixed duplication bugs like this before, and can do so without too much labor; I was about to go ahead and do it here, but noticed you'd already started. Your edit summaries look frustrated, so I'd be happy to take over, but two people trying at once is a worst-case scenario. Just give me the word. —Korath (Talk) 11:16, Apr 19, 2005 (UTC)

NC Flag

Around next week, I will send your flag. Yoru flag is sitting on my desk, right next to the flag of the Perm Region, Russian Federation. Zscout370 01:03, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Bangladesh stub

My apologies. I am sorry I haven't read the whole of the stub creation process. Actually, many of the articles on Bangladesh I have started are getting erroneously marked as India stub. This happened 4 times to an article in last 3 days. So, I created the stub related to Bangladesh. I again am very sorry for not following proper procedure in this, and I hope not to make the same mistake in future. I also hope the newly created Bangladesh stub would be kept, as many articles related to Bangladesh are now in stub stage. Thanks again for the constant watch for the benefit of wikipedia. --Ragib 06:33, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

it's all right :) As I said, I didn't propose this one for deletion, since it does look like a useful category, and it doesn't cover ground already covered by other categories. Bangladesh does seem a big enough subject to warrant its own stub category (let's face it, with 100 million people there should be a lot of things to write about!). Grutness|^hello?

Eletro-sub

Sorry for adding the sub out of term, thanks for your message to tell me how to do it correctly. I've added it to the Wikipedia:WikiProject_Stub_sorting/Criteria page and I won't continue to re-classify subs until I get some sort of conformation that I can. --ElectraFlarefire 10:05, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thank you

Hello, Grutness. I just wanted to thank you for supporting my RfA. I will do my best to live up to your expectations. Phils 19:33, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Draconity Stub Revert

May I ask why? That article is only 4 paragraphs, far from complete given what it's about. If you do happen to agree with me that it is in fact a stub, have I used the wrong kind? Do you have advice for what sort of stub I should use? Thanks in advance for responding kindly. -- Toksyuryel ^{talk | contrib} 15:26, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The length of an article is irrelevant as far as being a stub is concerned. An article can be quite short and still cover a subject in sufficient depth for it to be a reasonable article on the subject, as is the case here. Some subjects are successfully covered in far less text than this one has taken, in fact. If you think it's still a stub, then socio-stub is probably the best one to use. Grutness|^hello?

Mangateparu

Mangateparu is on vfd, if you have time could you use your infinite knowledge of New Zealand geography to stubbify it, it's pretty horrible as is. Thanks --nixie 10:35, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I've done what I can - which isn't much. It is a very small place! Grutness|^hello?

My adminship: thanks!

Hi Grutness. Thanks very much for your vote for my RfA. I promise to be prudent, wise, sagacious and totally unilateral in all my admin affairs. I should say that I am very pleased at the number of people who supported me – it's very nice to know I'm making a positive impact. Cheers again, Smoddy (Rabbit and pork) 20:57, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

My Signature

I just decided to read the FAQ about the signatures and went ahead with this. Will this work for you and others? Zscout370 (talk) 17:37, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

New Zealand rural/valley communities

ThanX for the tags, BTW Your portrait is terrible. Is that your desired effect?

Yes :)

Re: Wades Landing

Wades landing is on the junctions of two rivers. Indeed it belong more to the Whanganui River then to Retaruke River. I will see if I can dig out the names of all the landings, and create a page to match.

Put them on the pages relating to the rivers! They aren't really big enough for their own articles, but will add useful information about the rivers they are on. And if you do make separate articles for them, someone will only come along and put them up for deletion at the Wikipedia:Votes for deletion page.

Re: the Valleys, I think my mistake was no highlighting that "Upper and Lower Retaruke Valleys" are communities.

New Zealand traditionally (before urban "drift") was broken into communities, it was not always "town" centric. In the country these were called "Ridings", a riding was the distance that a community heads could travel on a horse in 1 day to meet at a common place to make community decisions. These Riding were then confererated into Councils. In this case the "Kaitieke Council". About 1950 the NZ Central Government basically started emasculating these small community by closing schools and merging the councils. First into the "Taumarunui Council", and then in 1990s the "Ruapehu Council".

Yes, I know all that. The communities are still too small for their own articles, though, and the information is far better listed alongside the river articles.

Re: The Mangapurua Signpost.

I suspect that the original posting was a correct quotation, directly from the actual sign. Changing the sign text is probably a mistake.

Probably right. The problem was you were risking linking to two different potential articles on the same subject as "Mangapurua Valley" and "Mangapurua valley".

Re: Mangapurua Valley or Mangapurua Valley Riding/Community?

This Valley has almost a mythical status, I suggest that you do a google, esp Bridge to Nowhere. Basically returning soldiers were given land which they tried to settle. Mean time the Central Government sent inspector "spies?" to quietly "check on progress". The Soldiers had not right of reply, no access to the Governement documents written about them. I will add some content to this page and put the xrefs back in (later).

All good information that should go on the article about the Bridge to Nowhere, which covers the community. Again, no separate article is needed.

xref convention

BTW: What is the convention if a "xref" apears many time is a page. Are all xref with Square braces, or only the first occurence of the xref?

Only the first reference, unless one of the references occurs in a list or table, in which case it may also be linked. Grutness|^hello? 02:44, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Stubbing

Hey you! You beat me to org-stub Jim Henson Foundation. Scanning stubs to put them in proper categories...like me! Ah, wiki. -- TheBlunderbuss 03:42, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The real pain are the SUB-stubs! Keep fighting, soldier. TheBlunderbuss 03:47, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thank you

Hello, Grutness. Thanks for your vote at my adminship nomination. I appreciate the support, and remain massively impressed by your work on geo-stubs and such. Cheers! — Trilobite (Talk) 13:39, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Actor Stub

OK, what's the issue? ---Isaac R 05:47, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I'm guessing this message crossed the one I just sent you! Grutness|^hello? 05:49, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I understand. Does this have anything to do with the fact that images often fail to appear? (Mostly on stub templates, but other places too.) If so, you should consider removing the image from the Anime stub template -- I was going to add one, then discovered it already had one that wasn't displaying. Maybe a lot of the stubs need to go image-free. ---Isaac R 06:00, 28 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Not sure, but that could be the reason. Some of the icons provide information (the maps on some of the geo-stubs do, where the regions being stubbed are a bit ambiguous, e.g., the North Africa stub template), but most of them don't. Most of the more frequently used stub templates are now icon free, though. Grutness|^hello?

• You removed my beautiful Vostok icon! (sob) Seriously though, maybe it would be a good idea to remove all the stub icons and put messages on the template pages asking people not to put them back. Otherwise, people will just keep adding new ones. Eliminating them all would cut server load a little, and make some of us feel a little less, uhm, slighted. ¶ In any case, you should probably replace icons you delete with an HTML comment explaining the problem -- people probably don't check the history before adding graphics.---Isaac R 23:46, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

NYC-stub

I've changed the wording to, I think, make it more useful— linking to the WikiProject rather than the "main" Wikipedia article. What's the point of more links to New York City anyway; maybe this should be a general practice with stub notices?--Pharos 03:35, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I don't think there's a standard practice, but quite a few stub templates link to both the article and the project (have a look at {{comics-stub}} to see what I mean). I'd agree that with a lot of stub categories the subject of the category is well-enough known not to need a link, though. Grutness|^hello?

Francis Petre

Kiwi back up is required here [2] can you not muster some troops? Giano | talk 21:39, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I'll see what I can do! Grutness|^hello? 04:19, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for that, and for spotting it was in the wrong place - I don't see why it should not be on the front page, it's as least as interesting as some of the other stuff that get there! Giano | talk 09:47, 30 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Dichtung_und_Wahrheit

Such are the risks taken when you do 12 stubs at a time. It's could've been more vague, like a germany-stub.

But thanks for the heads up on that. Subtlety. -- TheBlunderbuss 04:07, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Quis custodiet?

And I will try to live up to all that entails! Thanks so much for your confidence, it means a lot to me! Yours, El_C 00:55, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Sub-stubs

Hey there. I've noticed that just about every one-line stub I dump into sub-stub, you move back. I'm not looking to start an argument or anything, because I'm fairly new to this, but I was under the impression that extremely short stubs by definition are sub-stubs, and should be labelled as such--especially if you're not going to bother categorizing the stub when you revert its status like that. Care to explain this to me so that I don't continue to make whatever mistake it is that I've been making? --Jemiller226 05:26, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Quite simple really - Category:Substubs is slowly being emptied. I'm checking through about 150 of them per day. The vast majority are being categorised where they can be found by editors more easily (in one of the stub subcategories), or being merged, or vfd'd, or moved to wiktionary. There are bound to be a handful which don't quite fit into any of the currently existing categories, and about five or six per day are going back into the main Stub category for now. Grutness|^hello? 05:32, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the explanation, James. So, I guess my next question is one of practicality: is it better for me to toss a really short stub into sub-stub, or is it better for me to just leave it uncategorized in stub? --Jemiller226 05:45, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

If they look like they could grow into reasonable articles and you can find a suitable specialist stub category for them, I'd do that. Others, feel free to move them to substub (as long as they're not ones that have just been moved from there!). some of them are probably ones which are candidates for deletion or moving to wiktionary, and it's still easier to find them via substub. Don't be surprised if one or two of them turn up in category: Stub again, though! Grutness|^hello? 06:06, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Frank's moment is upon us

Well, we did it. He gets his moment on May 6. Giano | talk 19:40, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

Drawings

I went to your website, you did some pretty good drawings. I was wondering how much do they usually go for.

Also, about the drawings. There was one that caught me and my mothers eye, it was Nude Study II (Jessica). It was odd, since my cousin is also named Jessia. My mom smirked and said that she did know you :)

Also, I will try to mail your items this week, along with Bruce Berry's and a few others. I needed the money to pull it off and the time, since class and moving meetings are really filling up my time this week. Zscout370 (talk) 01:35, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

No hurry - you have got my address, haven't you? As to the drawings, sadly Nude Study II's been sold, but I do have a very similar one based on the same set of drawings (Jessica, BTW, is local actresss Jessica Sutherland, who was a model for the local art society's life drawing classes). As to how much they sell for, mounted they go for about $70-80NZ (that's around $50-57US). Unmounted they sell for about $60NZ (about $42US). If you're thinking of getting one, it would be much easier and cheaper to send it to the US unmounted and get it mounted there.

chile-geo-stub

thx for telling me. I work on geo worldwide, what would be nice is support of two-letter country codes for geo stubs. some countries have really long names. just an idea ... best regards Tobias Conradi (Talk) 03:00, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Some of the longer ones do have abbreviations (SM-geo-stub for Serbia-Montenegro, for instance), but for the most part the full name is seen as the easiest thing to remember rather than looking at a coding sheet every time. Grutness|^hello?

easiest thing to remember rather than looking at a coding sheet every time no problem for me - I know almost all two letter codes ;-) thx for the list Tobias Conradi (Talk) 03:11, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

My RFA

Thank you for your comments on my RFA. Although the voting period just ended with a 14-8-2 vote, I will admit once and for all that I used it more as an evaluation of myself. Being promoted would have been a plus. I was more interested in who voted, when they voted, who would change their votes and when, and the comments I would receive. Hopefully I will correct the main weakness that was raised by those who voted oppose -- that I was too eager to put articles on VFD. Also, I will try to interact more with those Wikipedians who did not vote at all.

As for next month, I don't know if I will nominate myself again. I might not think about it until somebody else puts me up there on RFA at a later date. Eventually, I see myself as an admin, especially as the number of articles and users continues to grow. Thanks again and good luck at improving this vast archive of free knowledge. Zzyzx11 (Talk) 09:15, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Sig image

Use if images in signatures is discouraged for several reasons. See Wikipedia:Sign_your_posts_on_talk_pages#Appearance. -Casito⇝Talk 04:53, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I know - I've actually done some editing work on that page. You might also note that it is not official policy, just a recommendation, as there is not a clear consensus supporting it. If there was any way that I could put my signature as a text item I would. Unfortunately, my signature is the picture - by which I mean that the Uffington White Horse is how I sign my name when writing or painting. To do otherwise here would feel as though it was not me doing the work. It's interesting, though, that after 25000 edits and a couple of months as an admin, I've had virtually no complaints (from memory, you are the second to mention it in the last six months). If there are many I'll definitely have to consider it, though. Grutness|^hello?

FWP

Its amazing isn't it how this page continues to grow, and hopefully after Friday, a lot more New Zealand edits and information will come along (we'll probably spend the weekend better incorporating them) This really is now one of the most informed studies on him on the internet. This has been so much more interesting and rewarding than the European subjects I've done, as this has been more discovery (for me anyway) I had never heard of him two months ago! Giano | talk 07:30, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Iwi==bones && Hapu==September?

Probably worth taking another look at the Hapu page.

 It translates roughly to sept, but can also be used to mean settlement. 
 The term colloquially also means "pregnant"..

I am not exactly sure that is what you intended to say.

re: Category:Iwi_and_hapu

Good idea, it means an automatic catalogue. I wonder, we could almost to this for an automatic NZ time line. Maybe create a page for each decade (or year), and the time line generates itself... Or do catagories only work on Headings?

Nevillednz 13:03, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Here is a really poetic description extracted from www.ngatiwhakaue.iwi.nz. It kind of puts it into perspective nicely...

The word whanau, family, means to give birth. "We are bound to our whanau, our family, by birth." The word hapu, extended family group, means to become pregnant. The hapu is made up of family groups bound together by marriage. The word for tribe, the word iwi, also means 'bones'.

MUCH more poetic and richer then either of us came up with.

• Ngati Whakaue

Nevillednz 13:32, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Morocco geo stubs

Hi Grutness. Thanks for mentionning that to me. I'll deal with it today and re-fix that the way your explained. Cheers Svest 05:58, May 5, 2005 (UTC) ^{Wiki me up}

Chinatowns in Australasia and Oceania

My edit, unlike yours, was completely objective and my nationality bore no influence on it. And at the risk of being undiplomatic, the pettiness and ignorance of your comment was truly surprising, especially when I consider you to be, on the whole, a very valuable contributor. The fact is Australasia is a term that encompasses New Zealand, and one that is used widely on either side of the Tasman. Anyways, there was duplication in terms, and given the scope, Oceania is preferred and the article was so moved. It can now be found at Chinatowns in Oceania.--Cyberjunkie 08:43, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

I retract the above (unintended) insult and apologise sincerely if I caused you any offence. --Cyberjunkie 08:47, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

Apologies if you took my comments personally (perhaps I should have added one of those horrible smiley things) - I have no wish to upset you, as my feelings on your edits are equally positive. However, the term is widely used in New Zealand to refer to Australia and Papua New Guinea, but not New Zealand. Checking the article's edit history would have revealed that New Zealand had already been moved from the Australasia section to the Oceania section in the past. Reverting it without checking the reasons for the earlier edit was hardly objective. Grutness|^hello?

Dear James, I won't tell Cyberjunkie (though he or she may read it here), but I can assure you that this is the first time in my 64 years in New Zealand that I have come across the idea that the term "Australasia" is widely used in New Zealand to refer to Australia and Papua New Guinea, but not New Zealand. That sounds more like "Austronesia". - Robin Patterson 12:43, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Read, and agreed. I've made further comments on my own talk page. (oh, and it is he) ;)--Cyberjunkie 12:51, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Stupid Deletion Question

Hi there! I did my first RFD about a week ago (OpenTalk). Since you seem familiar with the produce, I thought I'd ask -- since people seem to be voting to merge and redirect to Apple Bonjour, should I just go ahead and do that? Or do I leave it for an admin to do? And where am I supposed to ask stupid questions like this, anyway? --Steven Fisher 11:22, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Years in NZ

"hello?" too busy yet? have you noticed that Easter has long gone? is that thermometer properly calibrated?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Dramatic#Suggested_solution_to_one_of_Nevillednz.27s_questions

Robin Patterson 12:33, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

The thermomenter's still about right, but yes, the caption needs updating! Grutness|^hello? 00:46, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

Front page

Hi, I just dropped in for a mutual gloat and some back patting, then read the edits on Australasia, I think I've used the term in Petre and Benjamin Mountfort, its not clear from above is this right or wrong, cos' I'll change it if it is wrong. Giano | talk 12:52, 6 May 2005 (UTC)

Religious Image

Heyas, read your reply at Template:Reli-stub and agree with the actions taken for your reasons. Apologies for stepping on any toes. I was being bold, but boldness without attention to the community is never quite good. Thanks for reviewing my edit. -SocratesJedi | Talk 03:06, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

Nah - that's fine. being bold is often the best thing. Hope I didn't tread on your toes too hard! :) Grutness|^hello? 03:08, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

Brandenn Bremmer

Grut, you have the misfortune to be the first of two or three admins I'm choosing more or less at random in the hope that one is more or less "online" and would be kind enough to take a look at recent bizarre behavior -- well, bizarre to my mind, at least -- at Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Brandenn Bremmer. If everything seems normal, it could be that a recent deletion is the cause; take a look in the history. In short, however, somebody deleted the content of a VfD page, then moved it when I restored it, then moved it, then moved it again when I moved it back. I understand his (her?) logic, and he (she?) has a case; but given a choice between what he (yeah, somehow I guess he) is doing and what I'm doing, I really think that I'm on the side of transparency and straightforwardness here. However, do judge for yourself. Thanks! -- Hoary 05:19, 2005 May 7 (UTC)

That's probably a good move, Grut. In the meantime, Slim asked me for a further explanation, which I've provided here. -- Hoary 06:03, 2005 May 7 (UTC)

Call me Grutness or James, please, not Grut! :)

Sorry James, Sir! -- Hoary 06:26, 2005 May 7 (UTC)

Ahoy-hoy

Hello his Grutness! I am not sockpuppet of User:NoPuzzleStranger ([3]). NoPuzzleStranger is Wik. I am not Wik. Hope this clears things up so you can sleep better at night. Yours truly, Starky