Talk:Thrash metal

Possessed and thrash metal

This is my source,. The page’s about Necrophagia but mentions Possessed as one of the pioneering death metal bands. Sixty Minute Limit (talk) 16:19, 16 June 2018 (UTC)

Okay, that's a solid one, but just because they apparently started that way and shifted later doesn't mean they aren't thrash too. The sourcing for the band's page itself is quite weak, but I'm willing to wager coverage of their thrash style exists in sources. Now I suppose I can let this go because it does seem they were more important in death than thrash and they seem outside my interest area, but I hope we can pursue this further. dannymusiceditor ^oops 03:42, 17 June 2018 (UTC)

@DannyMusicEditor: They actually didn’t move to thrash metal, they stayed more or less consistent. They were the first death metal band, using death growls and heavier riffs (wich were heavier than Death’s riffs from 1990 to 2001). But with their new 2018 TBA album, they might have a more thrash metal driven sound. Sixty Minute Limit (talk) 00:32, 20 June 2018 (UTC)

References

WP:REDFLAG

The article stated: Four American bands—Anthrax, Megadeth, Metallica, and Slayer—are credited with pioneering and popularizing the genre, and they have come to be called the "Big Four of Thrash". The Clash of the Titans tour (1990–1991), which featured Megadeth, Slayer, and Anthrax, is considered the genre's pinnacle, after which thrash metal saw a decline in popularity throughout the decade. Thrash metal has seen a resurgence in recent times, with many of the older bands returning to their roots with their new releases. A new generation of thrash metal bands emerged in the early 2000s, drawing lyrical and visual inspiration from the older groups.

Step by step: "they are credited" - weasel words. Who is crediting them, and are they right? Then, they are credited with pioneering, but the pioneers of Thrash form a much longer list and the four are not exactly at the beginning. As for popularising, this is pretty much an Americo-centric view of Thrash. The clash of titans is considered - weaseling again - to be the genre's pinnacle. Who says so, and why are they right? Lastly, Thrash did not decline after that unless you name specific cultures.

Extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. Live up to it. -- Zz (talk) 20:23, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

- Agree. “has been acknowledged, is hailed, is often cited, has been cited…” The overwhelming use of passive voice makes this article a hard read. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.125.68.34 (talk) 16:50, 17 March 2020 (UTC)

Heavy hardcore

Hi SolarFlash, in response to your recent revert of my addition of heavy hardcore to the derivatives section of the infobox, I'd like to clarify that I know you reasoned your removal of the given source because you couldn't access it. I'm not sure why that may be but this Wayback Machine archive may allow you to access it, if not it refers to "tough guy hardcore" which is a source synonym for heavy hardcore as having "combined circle pits and gang vocals with elements of Metallica-type thrash". This information has also been referenced on the heavy hardcore page itself since its creation. I hope this clears up any misunderstanding you may have had. Issan Sumisu (talk) 21:00, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

The discussion is happening here. Your edit was reverted because the cited source doesn't say what you claim it says. SolarFlash^Discussion 21:51, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

You stated yourself that the discussion of this topic should be on this talk page, the edit is applicable to this page, so it's best for it to be discussed here. And, what do you mean by "the cited source doesn't say what you claim it says", I provided a direct quote from it, to substantiate it. Issan Sumisu (talk) 22:00, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

You have been leaving messages on my user page (as opposed to my talk page where discussion is intended). Since you initiated the discussion there instead of here, the discussion continued there and not here. SolarFlash^Discussion 22:05, 13 May 2020 (UTC)

TheStrober

Quite frankly I dont think you guys are giving that fella enough credit, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN-ZOqVIKjA&ab_channel=TheStrober Just listen and see if it qualifies as thrash. The only reason you are reverting the edits is because it (incredulously) isnt as famous as Metallica) --2A02:C7F:901F:2A00:DD91:2E26:C3E5:A7F9 (talk) 17:43, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

You are literally proving the chorus in his song correct --2A02:C7F:901F:2A00:DD91:2E26:C3E5:A7F9 (talk) 17:43, 1 March 2021 (UTC)

We Are Not Your Puppet's link is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Inf-XNJs5to&ab_channel=TheStrober lets show Boris Johnson what happens to jealous nutcases like him. --MR Messager (talk) 16:55, 5 April 2021 (UTC)

Please find multiple independent reliable sources that support your claim. "Go and watch this Youtube video" isn't going to cut it.  Wisdom89 ^♦talk 16:57, 5 April 2021 (UTC)

Thrash Was A Philosophical Reaction?

This sentence in the intro I think misinforms rather than anything else.

"Philosophically, thrash metal developed as a backlash against both the conservatism of the Reagan era[6] and the much more moderate, pop-influenced and widely accessible heavy metal subgenre of glam metal which also developed concurrently in the 1980s.[7]"

Thrash was not a "backlash", philosophically or otherwise. Besides conflating, and confusing, the two concepts of "philosophical" and "political", the sentence is just plain factually wrong. In the 80s, 90s, and later, people who hate Thrash, or simply don't understand it, accused it of being fascist to the point of Nazi racism. That's totally untrue, of course, though lots of Metal bands have used the same kind of imagery that fascist political parties did -- Celtic symbols, runes, Norse Gods, monsters, the examples are so numerous as to stretch the capacity of article itself, let alone this post.

One of the basic aspects of Thrash was taking Metal in a heavier direction, and merging in some respects with Hardcore Punk with speed being the major element. The latter seemed to be influenced in some ways by Metal in the reverse direction, in particular by learning how to play their instruments. Punks and Metalheads really didn't like each other very much in the late 70s, but the one band they agreed on was Motorhead, and the Thrash boys took a good deal from there. Lemmy from Motorhead used the Iron Cross all the time, liked American Civil War stuff, including the Confederate rebel flag, war themes, etc. These are not exactly favorites of liberal political types. Still, some left-wing political nonsense followed with the Punks, but Thrash does not seem to be distinctly political in any conventional sense. If anything it's more a right wing phenomenon "philosophically" than left-wing political, weak-kneed, anti-American junk. Megadeth has in its very name a reference to nuclear war, and has a good deal of political pessimism about the "Countdown to Extinction" and all that, so there are counter examples. Most Thrash wasn't of that kind -- it was rebellious and angry, but that's a pretty generic strain in Rock as a general matter. Thrash just took it a step further, and decidedly distinguished itself from the Glam Metal that came out of David Lee Roth, Slade, and Kiss (in some of its weird disco-metal moments). It wasn't a "reaction" to Glam, they just hated the "hair bands" as a kind of betrayal of what Metal was supposed to be.

Mentioning the whole "philosophical" thing is a bad idea since I don't think there was one that unifies this form of Metal, certainly not in a political sense. People didn't even know what to call "Thrash" in the early 1980s. The terms "power", "thrash", and "speed" were used interchangeably until after the fact, when writers looking back started categorizing things, and also found that Death Metal, Black Metal had been there all along too, just without being conscious of the genre in which they were working. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Sychonic (talk • contribs) 08:29, 13 May 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 2 October 2021

Under the "Mid-1980s" subsection, fix the ordering of Overkill and Megadeth's albums to be in respective order. Either have the albums swap places or have the artists swap places with each other. Mega2447 (talk) 01:57, 2 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done. Mega2447, could you be more specific as to which sentences/phrases should be swapped? ◢  Ganbaruby!  (talk) 06:01, 3 October 2021 (UTC)

Mega2447 Fixed it. Thanks for pointing that out. MetalDiablo666 (talk) 14:02, 3 October 2021 (UTC)