Template talk:Goldener

Purpose

Just seen this template added somewhere but it is unexplained. What is a Goldener? What is its relevance? What gets included? There doesn't appear to be an accompanying wikipedia page we can link to. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 08:05, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Answered my own question. It appears to be ATU 314. Not very clear. I will adjust the template. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 09:14, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Next question: while ATU 502 is clearly related, it is not clear why it is included in the template. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 09:17, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Sirfurboy, answering your questions: "Goldener" refers to a type of narrative of the international Aarne-Thompson-Uther Index, more commonly classified as type ATU 314, "Goldener", post-2004, but it was previously known as "The Youth Transformed to a Horse", in the versions of the index by Antti Aarne (1910) and Stith Thompson (1928 and 1961). The narrative has been alternatively called "Goldenermärchen" in German circles, "Le Teigneux" in French academia (vide Paul Delarue and Marie-Louise Theneze), and "Lo Tignoso", in Italian. The main characteristic of the plot is that the hero takes on golden hair, hides his hair under a cap - which makes him look like he has a capillary disease, and works in a lowly position to another king (most of the time, he is a gardener).

Type ATU 502, "The Wild Man", is included in the cycle because (not me talking, but the Thompson's index and Enzyklopädie des Marchens), after the starting sequence with the "wild man" character, the narrative follows the "Goldener" schema.

Many local and regional indexes (like Marzolph's Persian one, from 1984; the East Slavic from 1979) may list the gardener sequence under another tale type, but Hans-Jörg Uther, in 2004, tried to subsume the many disparate, but similar classifications, under a single type to facilitate further indexing and to make the ATU index a true international index.

The "See also" tales are there for there are motifs or narrative sequences that some scholars have noted to be similar to the narrative schema of the type. KHR FolkMyth (talk) 23:56, 5 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

If “goldener” is German for “golden”, maybe this template is to cross-reference tales that have gold as a significant part of their events, so not just about ATU 314. I’m only guessing though. --Northernhenge (talk) 16:06, 18 September 2023 (UTC)[reply]