Talk:Yakima War

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POV tag

See inline comments re POV tag. This article was created as a military-history article and shows its bias in the language used, as noted; other bits could also be noted in the same light. Native American context/language sensitivity needed before POV tag removed.

The only inline comment I see is about the phrase "on land in the path of white settlement." That doesn't seem particularly POV to me. It doesn't either attack or defend white settlement, it just indicates a major factor that brought about conflict (that and Isaac Stevens' racism, incompetence, and complete lack of fair dealing, which should be added to the article). It doesn't seem any more POV than saying that the peoples of the Danubian plain lived on the path of the Magyar invaders into Europe. - Jmabel | Talk 07:03, 6 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's more subtle than that, and a look at some of the other Indian Wars and various tribal pages would help; as it is there doesn't happen to be much written on the Yakima and their allies in Wikipedia yet. The native account of this war isn't here much, which is why the POV tag; the 19th Century "found" the Yakama...living in the path of white settlement is more politically-charged than might first be apparent (I added the quotes on "found" to highlight the difference in perspective). From their perspective, the Yakama "found" the white man (and some Chinese and others) poking around in their traditional lands in the wake of the Oregon Treaty etc. I haven't sourced them, but I know from experience elsewhere that their account of the war and its causes will have a different overall take, and there'll probably be also specific battles described in some detail; e.g. in the case of Chief Tonasket, who yet needs an article, the History of the Okanagan People by J. Teit contains their account of related conflicts during the Spokane War (see Nicola (chief).

I'm curious about the gold finds in Yakama territory in the early 1850s - where were they? How many miners? I'm into gold rush history in BC and the rushes in Washington Territory, especially Colville, are linked to the Fraser Canyon and other BC gold rushes. As far as I know there was only a trickle of settlers and prospectors north of the Columbia until after all the various Cayuse, Yakima and Spokane Wars; there was no real flood until 1858, when news of gold on the Fraser hit California and many of those already in the Oregon Territory, or who had ridden overland via there directly from California; parties of hundreds at once then travelled the Columbia-Okanagan route to BC; but I'm unaware of large-scale gold activity south of the line (the 49th Parallel in BC parlance) before the Fraser rush - not that I know the history of the Washington Territory well at all.Skookum1 20:33, 7 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not really much gold there (or anywhere in Washington, as far as I know) just enough to get some people prospecting for it (and sometimes finding coal or other ores in the process).

Yes, this needs far more work, but if you want to reword what you find POV, why not just reword it instead of complaining? I don't particularly see anyone actively defending this near-stub. - Jmabel | Talk 20:51, 7 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Maps would be helpful

I'll see what I can dig up.Skookum1 18:09, 22 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

made some changes; haven't fully dePOVized and needs research/revision

basically worked at changing the language/attitude of the opening, not working from sources directly but from what I know of the period; I have some here but don't have much time to do a lot as I'm moving soon and also have my hands full all over wikipedia, esp in regional history/geography, but it's a time thing; but I happened to see the page tonight and knew that old opening line about "being in teh path of white settlement" didn't sit with me well, so I added some bits and pointing towards more, ie. background on Cayuse War, for one thing, and maybe a Native American source or editor/contributor might be useful/helpful here, too. Many "Indian War" articles in their original form start out from, as it were, the cavalry side of things and wind up getting "Indian-ized" in the course of de-POVing; sometimes a tightrope and here I don't know Washington history well; my exposure to this war is the role it plays to the background of various tellings of the Fraser Canyon Gold Rush and the founding of BC and the other gold rushes along the border/accessible from where most of these wars went down. What drew me tonight was the Battle of Seattle (1856) article, if I've got that title right. BTW all of these wars to do with the, ahem, dissolution of the Oregon Country's former social order into wartime chaos should still IMO be part of the Oregon Country category; this would go right up to the incorporation of BC in 1858, which was the resolution of the British territorial claim north of 49, just as thesewars and the formation of the American territories were part of it south of the line; the timeline for the Oregon Country cat doesn't quite end in 1846, is what I'm getting at, though it does vary by event and topic; the colonies of Vancouver Island and Mainland BC I put in the cat, but nothing of them after that and only articles relating to places claimed by the US, ie thatwere in the Oregon Country from the American perspective, like Fort Victoria and Fort Kamloops....OK, that's 'nuff. Made some changes, kinda pointed towards where this article might go; I'll try and read something on the war to see if the rest below where my changes are is still POV-flavoured; this and its "sister" wars need a section on what used to be the Indian Wars page, wherever that redirects now (to something with a better name, finally).Skookum1 08:00, 10 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Yakima War v. Puget Sound War

There seems to be some confusion between the Yakima War and the Puget Sound War, notably (to me) in to which the Battle of Seattle (1856) should be assigned. Were these two separate conflicts, or merely an arbitrary division of an ongoing conflict or series of conflicts? How did the contemporaries experience it, and what do historians say? rewinn 05:28, 12 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

My somewhat lengthy response over at Talk:Puget Sound War. And yes, this article still seems in need of work. If I find the time, I'll try to help. Pfly 05:54, 12 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]