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Talk:UEFA Euro 2004

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by TomAnd (talk | contribs) at 00:53, 15 June 2004 (→The Title). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Table width?

DragonFire, a table element width of over 100% is fairly nonsensical, don't you think? :) --Shallot 07:07, 9 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I thought that too but if the width isn't more than 100%, then the tables won't be aligned in all Wikipedia skins. You see, all tables have a width limit which is determined by the data inside each cell. If a table row has long names such as Netherlands, Lichtenstein, Luxembourg or Switzerland, the limit will be the smallest width in which the names aren't cut off. If you try to format a table by inserting a 75% width, for example, and if that width is smaller than the limit, then the table will preserve the data inside each cell and will discard the width you inserted. So, even though the width you inserted was 75%, the real (smallest) width will always be 102%, for example. The width that I used for the qualifying groups is the smallest width for groups 9 & 10 -> 106% (it's actually a little bit more). If you try to reduce the width of this table you will see that you can't (on the Standard skin). All the other qualifying group tables are aligned according to this one. With these widths, the tables are aligned in all Wikipedia skins. ;) If aesthetic isn't important, then I agree that the widths should be reduced. :) DragonFire 17:25, 3 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Announced squad listings

I have added Announced team squads to the page with links to the Swedish and English squads. Personally, I am not convinced they are in the right place as they are respectively at: 2004 European Football Championship/Sweden and 2004 European Football Championship/England. I do think they should come under 2004 European Football Championship but not entirely sure how... Any advice/action welcome - Calexico (Talk) 14:11, 17 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

My thought would be to put them all on one page, 2004 European Football Championship squads maybe. sjorford 08:19, 18 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Qualification

What do you people think of putting the whole qualification in a separate article? Something like 2004 European Football Championship (Qualification). This way, all match results and statistics, concerning qualification, could be available. It seems rather poor only to include the final qualification tables. Besides, the 2004 European Football Championship should only focus on the final tournament.
This could also be done for the World Cup or any other competition as well. Take a look at Football World Cup 2006 and you'll see why the qualification should have its own article. DragonFire 20:09, 24 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

All sounds very reasonable to me - makes sense to separate the qualifying from the final section of competitions... Calexico (Talk) 09:57, 25 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

A break from talking about the article; who do you think will win?

As a little diversion from talking about the article, who do you think will win Euro 2004? Any Euro soccer fans out there? JB82 20:45, 9 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I think most of the people who'll be maintaining this article might count as fans! Personally I'd expect France to win... -- Arwel 21:45, 9 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Well, I have Portugal in the office sweepstake, so they've got be dead certs. :) It ought to be their best chance of ever winning, they've been building a strong team for a while now. sjorford 08:04, 10 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Nah, Portugal will never win anything; they have one half-decent player. I think Germany will be the surprise and go a long way. Otherwise either France or England. - Paul
Well, Portugal plays at home, and and helps, but so does in practice Spain, since all the games are less than 2 hours driving from the border, and they count with major public support. Plus such a great team must win something sometime, and this might be the year ;).
What amazes me is that you wrote that after watching them against Greece ;) - Paul

Rules?

What are the rules for qualifying/winning a group/progressing to the next round, how many points for a draw etc etc... are these anywhere in wikipedia? Lupin 08:39, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

3 points for a win, 1 point for a draw. If two teams have the same number of points, then the difference between the number of goals scored and conceded is taken into account (with the team scoring most goals being preferred). If they still can't be separated, then the result of game played between the two teams is taken into account (the team that won that one would progress). If there's still no difference, then it's the toss of a coin, but I can't recall a championship table being resolved on that basis!. -- Arwel 10:23, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)
I remember once in a World Cup (Italy 90?), there was a group where the 4 teams tied in all their games of the first phase, except for one game. Only one goal by England to Egypt disentangled the 4-sided draw the last day, and the coin tossing was avoided.

The Title

The Title 2004 UEFA European Championship gives no immediate indication of what sport we are talking about, for those with no knowledge of the governing body of European football, UEFA is meaningless. The page should be moved back to where it was before at 2004 European Football Championship Mintguy (T) 10:43, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)

For people with no idea of what sport we are talking about, they just have to read the first paragraph! We don't have to give all the information in the title. In fact, it perhaps ought to be moved to UEFA Euro 2004, as that seems to be the title used by the official web site. sjorford 15:22, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC)
Indeed. UEFA should be used like NBA etc. Very few do not know what UEFA is related to, if they wonder what part of football it is about, they will read the article. Everyone knows about the UEFA Champions league for instance.

The name debate

There needs to be a decision made on this as there is a similar debate over the World Cup.

  • YYYY European Football Championship or European Football Championship YYYY
    • Pros
      • Descriptive
      • Most consistent with Football World Cup and Rugby World Cup etc.
    • Cons
      • Long
      • Not in common use
      • Could be confused with other European football championships (champions league etc.)
      • Does not mention UEFA
  • UEFA Euro YYYY
    • Pros
      • Official name [1]
      • Short
      • In common use
    • Cons
      • Does not mention football
      • Does not apply to pre-1964 when it was European Nations Cup
      • Inconsistent with Football World Cup and Rugby World Cup etc.
  • YYYY UEFA European Championship or UEFA European Championship YYYY
    • Pros
      • Official extended name [2] (Not true, look below)
    • Cons
      • Does not mention Football
      • Not as common as Euro YYYY
      • Inconsistent with Football World Cup and Rugby World Cup etc.
  • UEFA European Football Championship YYYY
    • Pros
      • The official long name [3] "The European Nations' Cup became the UEFA European Football Championship for 1968."
      • The most descriptive, it includes both UEFA, European and Football.
    • Cons
      • Could be confused with UEFA Champions League, although highly unlikely. This could be included in the article. ("Not to be confused with" or something like that.)
      • Even longer

Votes

  • YYYY European Football Championship or European Football Championship YYYY
    • Ed g2s 19:10, 12 Jun 2004 (UTC) - for cross-sport consistency reasons.
    • MykReeve 16:54, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC) - the most easily understandable article name for someone previously unaware of the event.
    • Mintguy (T) 00:30, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC) - Clearly the most easily understood title with consistency for similar Wikipedia articles about other sports, which see no need to mention the governing body quite so prominently. Mintguy (T) 00:30, 15 Jun 2004 (UTC)
  • UEFA Euro YYYY
    • --Frankie Roberto 12:11, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC) - this is closer to the very common colloquial name for the championship ('Euro 2004').
    • Scurra 13:13, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC)
  • YYYY UEFA European Championship or UEFA European Championship YYYY
  • YYYY UEFA European Football Championship or UEFA European Football Championship YYYY
    • TomAnd 11:32, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC) This is the official name, and the most descriptive.
    • Kwekubo 23:05, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC) Offical and descriptive. If thought too long for common use, a shorter name like UEFA Euro XXXX may be used as a shorthand redirect. -- Kwekubo 23:05, 14 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Euro 2004 or Euro 2004 Finals

The article talks about "qualifying for Euro 2004", but the qualification stage was part of Euro 2004. The teams have qualified for the "Euro 2004 Finals". This may be too pendantic a point to change, so I thought I'd just float it in talk. - Paul

Match Results

Underneath the match results as well as the scorers what other infomation is needed? I see we have noted players who were sent off, I think missed penalties should also be included (to this affect I had put the Beckham miss in but it has since been deleted). Grunners 23:12, 13 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I deleted the penalty miss because it's a *score* sheet - the official Euro 2004 site doesn't list them - I've never seen any football report that does include penalty misses. The sendings off are dubious inclusions as well ; but if we are going to include them, can they at least be consistent. There have been two sendings off so far - one has the time of the incident marks on it, the other doesn't. Zaphod Beeblebrox

I think if we're going to include sendings off, there has to be some explanation of what "S/O" means, or preferably a link at the first use. It'd be nice if this were readable by your average sort of people who aren't soccer aficionados (or football aficionados for you crazy Brits). --Delirium 07:45, Jun 14, 2004 (UTC)

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