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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Gaditano23 (talk | contribs) at 09:59, 2 October 2017 (→Is Spain really a full democracy when it is actively suppressing policial rights?: Response to this rather ridiculous thread.). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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Life expectancy

According to the new data released by the United Nations in 2015, Spain has the longest life expectancy in the world after Japan. I think this piece of data is more important that GDP etc. It is a real bottom-line piece of data that should be commented on. In fact, a woman in Spain has a whopping five year longer life than in countries like the US:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

Error on " Public Holidays and Festivals" section

The artcle reads " ... Our Lady of the Pillar feast, patroness of Aragon and throughout Spain.". Our Lady of the Pillar is the patroness of Zaragoza City only and not Aragon as mentioned on the page. The Saint patron of Aragon is Saint George. Please check anywhere else, even other wikipedia pages to confrim this fact if you dont believe me. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A02:C7D:5982:6300:F04D:72F8:B234:BD76 (talk) 20:27, 29 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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The claim that Spain is a democracy

There have been a number of reliable sources questioning the extent to which Spain is a full democracy, yet the current article makes the claim that Spain is a 'parliamentary democracy' without any qualification. I realise that Spanish citizens opposed to Catalonian independence may believe that the Spanish constitution of 1978 prevents Catalonia having an independence referendum but that is surely the point: can Spain be called a true democracy when even it's constitution is preventing the Catalonian people from expressing their view on their constitutional future? I can think of no full democracy anywhere in the world that would be going to such an extent to prevent people voting as we are witnessing going on just now. As Wikipedia is based on what the reliable sources say rather than personal opinions, is there consensus to make reference to the question that exists with regard to the extent to which Spain is a full democracy? As I say there are plenty of reliable sources that are asking the question and many of them coming to the conclusion that Spain falls short on this matter. Lin4671 (talk) 17:51, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

  • Whether states, provinces, regions or other internal subdivisions have the right to secede or not has absolutely zero to do with whether a country is a democracy or not. States in the US do not have the right to secede (and trying to do so resulted in the Civil War), but the US is still commonly regarded as a democracy, and AFAIK Bundesländer in Germany don't have the right to secede either, but Germany is still a democracy. - Tom | Thomas.W talk 18:02, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for replying but I have to say that while that may be your opinion, a number of reliable sources are saying something different. Since Wikipedia is based on what reliable sources say, should that not be reflected in the article? Lin4671 (talk) 18:29, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
We don't automatically add everything that has a source. Claiming that Spain isn't a democracy because of not allowing Catalonia to secede is a fringe theory, and simply doesn't belong in the article, so don't add it unless there's a clear consensus among editors here to do so. - Tom | Thomas.W talk 18:49, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with Thomas.W. Best regards. --BallenaBlanca (Talk) 19:30, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Lin4671 Your question is so absurd you should seriously ask yourself whether you are qualified to edit wikipedia. Gaditano23 (talk) 20:02, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps the title I used is misleading you so I will start anew with more precise wording Lin4671 (talk) 21:16, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Is Spain really a full democracy when it is actively suppressing policial rights?

Hi again. I agree (as all sources do) that Spain is largely a democratic state, but it is not fair to include that there are questions being asked as to whether it is a 'full' democracy in light of its assault on political rights in Catalonia? We have a situation where police have been deployed to prevent people from indicating their political preference in a referendum - not the actions one would expect in any full democracy anywhere in the world. As I say, numerous reliable sources are making this point so why can it not be included in the article? Lin4671 (talk) 21:22, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

By reliable you mean Assange's twitter account? Please stop trolling here.Gaditano23 (talk) 21:45, 30 September 2017 (UTC)[reply]

How about the Office of the High Commissioner of the United Nations? [1] UN Rights Experts are quoted as stating "The measures we are witnessing are worrying because they appear to violate fundamental individual rights, cutting off public information and the possibility of debate at a critical moment for Spain’s democracy.”
This "expert" is no expert. He also happens to be a holocaust-denier and a rabid anti-semite.Gaditano23 (talk) 09:59, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Please don't just dismiss as a troll someone who says something you profoundly disagree with: check the matter for yourself. Lin4671 (talk) 09:57, 1 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
It's fairly obvious that Spain is no longer a full democracy. The issue is with sources, as Rajoy's turning Spain away from a fully democratic state is so recent (same thing as with Erdogan who is doing the same in Turkey but started earlier). So I would avoid describing Spain as a democracy in the article, but unless we have sources to the contrary, we should not state that it is not a democracy either. Jeppiz (talk) 22:59, 1 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Jeppiz It is fairly obvious to ignorant people who inform themselves on social media. To anyone moderately educated, it is fairly obvious that Spain is among the most democratic countries in Europe. The only "oppression" there is in Spain is of Catalans who dissent with the Catalan government's radical stance (who happen to be the majority).Gaditano23 (talk) 09:59, 2 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  1. ^ http://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/DisplayNews.aspx?NewsID=22176&LangID=E
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