Talk:Copyright

This page is for discussion of the particular contents of the Copyright article, or for straightforward questions about copyright. Please limit heated debate about the merits of copyright to Talk:Copyright/is copyright worthwhile?.

It is very important that everyone working on Wikipedia respect copyrights. Since this is a wide-open project with no editorial oversight, this sort of thing will certainly happen again.

In our role as a provider of internet services, we have a fairly strong defense under theDigital Millenium Copyright Act, and a fairly strong responsibility. We can't be held financially liable for other people's actions, so long as we follow a reasonable take-down policy.

Nonetheless, I can tell you that my charitable instincts and love of knowledge will hit the wall if someone sues me. :-( --Jimbo Wales

Notice that I have added some more words at the bottom of the page when you go to submit. I think that the problem will mostly go away with this. People just need to understand that we don't want them to cut-and-paste from copyrighted sources!

There is no way to be 100% safe. But, hey, risk is a part of life. --Jimbo Wales

Hmmmm - The only place I found that article exactly like that in its full length was on Ginger's site, in connection with her Wolf Cam. The first two paragraphs also appear in the same form in The Dog Owner's Guide, though the rest of that article is quite different. The author's name (Norma Bennett Woolf - can you believe that?) and copyright information appear at that site, including ways in which they will permit their material to be used. I donno if Ginger got permission or not. I did not find it on Nova (Jimbo's link) at all, tho there's alotta junk about wolves there. Ginger - did you simply contribute the article from your own page and forget that part of it was copyrighted? AyeSpy

Actually I put it together from a few different sites. I was unaware of any copyright problems I was causing. I had never been to the pbs site Jimbo found the article at. I will be more careful in the future you can be sure. It is not my intention to cause problems for anyone and I feel badly about this. WcGing

No need to feel bad. I'm all about the future, not the past. :-) Some of the paragraphs were exactly from the Nova site.

I encourage you, WcGing, to write a shorter article based on the knowledge you got from those articles...

We don't have to be particularly original, we just have to try to be correct, and most importantly of all, we can't give anyone an excuse to try to shut us down. So we have to put everything in our own words.

Has anyone considered starting a nonprofit or somesuch similar organization around the wiki so that it's not so legally tied (in either direction) to the folks that so kindly started it? IANAL, but it seems like it might have good consequences both ways in terms of liability, as well as for tax exemptions and such.

I didn't know where to put Sonny Bono Copyright Term Extension Act.

Generally if people want to write a new article, they just find a way to work the title into another, existing one; and if the connection isn't obvious someone comes along and makes it so. Putting it on a Talk page is fine for the short term, but links to new articles should probably go in a main articles instead, as the talk pages are frequently edited, cleaned up, or eliminated completely, and not everyone reads them anyway. --KQ

I have reorganized this article to seperate it into a general section and a US specific section. -- Simon J Kissane

What is our policy for including copyrighted but freely distributable work? In other words, the copyright allows all retransmission but does not allow changes. E.g. I provisionally added Free Software Definition--as long as noone changes the text, it can be copied in any medium any number of times. -- The Cunctator

You should accompany such text with an article about the text (just as one might write an article about the US Constitution or a Shakespeare play), and include the exact text labelled as such. Wikipedians are free to change the article, but changing the included text specifically referenced as from an external source is clearly the wrong thing to do (though someone might want to correct mistranscriptions), so Wikipedian won't be tempted to change it. --LDC

The copyright article is but good but has flaws: it portrays copyright as the government granting someone the right to copy a work whereas most laws formulate the right by making unauthorised copies (and the act of making them) illegal. It should point out that modern copyright originally came about in order to protect the printers' businesses.

There is no discussion of moral rights (the most important one being the right to be identified as the author of a work). In some countries, France I believe, the moral rights are strong enough to control the use of original work. For example, I may not be able to place a painting by artist A in a context that is offensive to the reputation of artist A (this may include simply being placed next to another work). (contradicts last sentence of 1st para)

Not all countries have something exactly analogous to copyright. It is common in Europe for countries to have a right that would be better translated as "author's rights".

There is also public lending right (right to be recompensed when ones work are publicly lent). (contradicts last sentence of 1st para)

The author is not always the first owner of copyright (often it is the employer). This is pointed out later on in the article, but it contradicts para 3.

This is something I am currently researching (particularly with regard to IT). I may revise the head article at some point. Sorry this isn't very constructive yet.

Surely US sopyright law simply belongs in another topic?

Removed this:

Copyright law has been attacked for some time, especially in reference to computer software. Proprietary software sealed under copyright law is considered the antithesis of the open source movement by many.

Copyrights are the spawn of the devil.

Stuff about open source may belong in open source article. Stuff about computer software is simply not true (copyright law has been attacked, and for many of its aspects, of which digital books/music are especially visible lately).

Can't we claim non-profit educational exemption? Lir 06:43 Oct 23, 2002 (UTC)

See the fun world of Wikipedia:Copyrights and Wikipedia talk:Copyrights. Short answer: fair use has limits, try to be reasonable. --Brion 06:51 Oct 23, 2002 (UTC)

from village pump

How long does copyright last? At what point can I quote large chunks from a book first published in 1934? -- SGBailey 19:30 Jan 26, 2003 (UTC)

It depends on the law of the country to which the author had the closest connection.

The general international rule is Life + 50 years and it would apply of the author was Canadian or Australian.
If the author was an EU citizen the rule is life + 70
If the author was American it would go into the public domain on Jan. 1, 2030. If, however, the author failed to renew his copyright in 1952, it is already in the public domain.

There are some variations. Eclecticology 21:19 Jan 26, 2003 (UTC)

I have an obscure copyright question: If I embroider a commercial kit, and then take a photo of my finished product, does publishing the photo infringe copyright? Thanks for any help - Sannse 10:56 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

I'm no expert, but I think that if you published the picture it would. Judging from cross-stitch magazines etc. most kit manufacturers actually like having photos of their kits displayed. If you give details of the kit you are giving them a free advert, so I doubt that they would object. If in doubt write to them and ask for permission, they will probably be delighted. -- Chris Q 12:06 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

I believe that your photo does not infringe on the copyright. The company would have rights to the pattern, but I don't think you can apply copyright to a finished embroidery product. I'll ask isis for her informal opinion... -- Stephen Gilbert 14:26 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)

Thanks both. As you suggested Chris, I've mailed DMC (an embroidery company) to get their view, but the more info I can get the better so isis's opinion would be a help too - Sannse 18:10 Jan 28, 2003 (UTC)