User talk:Valfontis

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Stubs Chemeketa Community College Rogue River Wars Nestucca River Western Oregon Yachats, Oregon Confederated Tribes of Coos, Lower Umpqua and Siuslaw Indians Central Oregon List of Oregon state forests Sahaptin language Crown Point (Oregon) John McLoughlin Bridge Yaquina Head Lighthouse PGE Park Shanghai tunnels Takelma language Coos River Salinan Alsea River Yaquina River

Cleanup Hualapai Benchmade Portland Shriners Hospital Merge Chinatown, Portland U.S. Route 101 List of numbered Routes in Oregon Add Sources Detroit, Oregon Aberdeen, Washington Aurora, Oregon Copyedit St. Mary's Cathedral (Portland) Expand Benny & Joon Kailee Wong Bellevue, Washington

Nez Perce

The accent markj and associated pronounciation are inaccurate with respect to the Nez Perce. As a teacher of Pacific Northwest history, I grow weary of this common error. At least let Wikipedia get it right.— Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.185.74.220 (talk • contribs) 20:29, February 27, 2007 (UTC)

Welcome to Wikipedia! I suggest you sign up for an account, we can always use more well-informed editors. Unfortunately when an anonymous editor removes content from an article, does not provide sources or discuss the changes on the talk page, or use an edit summary, it's hard for us to tell whether or not the change is vandalism or personal opinion. The use of accents may be wrong, but rather than completely remove the information from the article, it might be best to include it and explain why it is wrong, citing your sources of course, because it is still pretty common to see the accent used. Without a solid explanation in the article, the information may just get added back again by someone else. I hope that helps. Katr67 20:52, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I created an account right after posting the message to you. Now, can you explain why I get messages intended for Oriel College?

Mission Mill

I think you mentioned that you used to give tours at the museum. If so, do you think the history they are giving is particularly accurate? I ask because their webiste says the Indian School became the Oregon Institute, then Willamette U. I know OI became WU, but according to G. Hines this is not what happened. And from what I've seen elsewhere I think Hines is correct, plus since Hines was there I give his opinion a bit more weight. Aboutmovies 20:15, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Actually, I haven't started volunteering yet (I'm a slacker), but I have a big packet of information from them.(still wondering if I can cite it as a source, I need to ask) There are definitely some inaccuracies I saw, some minor and silly, but it could be MM isn't right. The way I know the story, the Indian School was kind of a bust, due to lack of Indians and the pressing need to worry more about basic survival. However, there was definitely a need to educate the children of the missionaries and others who showed up, so the Indian School sort of morphed into the Oregon Institute because there were teachers around and people who needed teaching, but I don't know if there was direct lineage. I'll have to check the packet when I get home. The website mentions the lineage in two places, but only one establishes a direct connection between the two. (Egads that site is hard to navigate...) Katr67 21:28, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Very confusing. I re-looked at the Hines stuff and it isn't clear either. Then the End of the Trail people have on their site it was two different locations. Guess I'll have to check out some books. Thanks. Aboutmovies 21:46, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Isn't Chemawa mixed up in there as well? Katr67 21:48, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

I think Chemawa is the problem. People are confusing the two and think J. Lee's Indian Manual Training School is the precursor to Chemawa. That's rare, white folk lumping the natives together. Aboutmovies 23:41, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Ghost Towns

I noticed "Ghost Towns" as a project on your other page. There is one in southern Oregon, called Buncom. You can find a little on the web. Anyhow, I'm fairly lame at making Wikipedia catergories - I barely know how to post images right. But if you ever feel like adding Buncom under Oregon, I'd be glad to send you a photo to use in it. Its just 3 buildings. I think I have one or two images now, but its only a few miles down the road, if I can't locate one and need to take another.Mdvaden 05:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion. Somewhere in the chaos on my desk I've got a list of ghost town articles I want to get around to writing and I'm sure Buncom is on it. Judging by the pictures on the 'net, it looks a little like Jawbone Flats up at Opal Creek Wilderness Area. I seem to get easily distracted around here, but when I write the article I'll be sure to drop you a note. P.S. Sorry I meant to touch base with you about your Bigfoot trap image before it got deleted, but it indeed looks like you got the copyright tag correct this time. Thanks for uploading it--it really adds to the article. Talk to you later, Katr67 06:43, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Tricia Leines

Hi! I remember ages ago you querying my adding Patricia Leines as a notable resident of Medford as she did not have a page (see User talk:PageantUpdater/Archive 4#Patricia Leines if you wish to refresh your memory). Anyway I just noticed that someone else created the article and when I was expanding the article I remembered our discussion so thought I'd pop you a note :) -- PageantUpdater • talk | contribs | esperanza 09:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Glencoe High School

Hey there, I notice you had done a little bit of editing on the Glencoe High School page. I cleaned it up a little bit, please let me know what you think of my edits and what you think needs to be done. I went to Glencoe, so I'd like to see its page improve. Pablothegreat85 21:54, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Champoeg cat

Since I know a lot of the folks I changed today are on your watchlist, I mainly left those that were important outside of the participation at the meetings in the main cat. But if their main notablity was just from the meetings, then I put them only in the sub cat. Let me know if you think this makes sense. Aboutmovies 20:00, 31 March 2007 (UTC)

WP:MOS

As I see you keep changing around the sections with a reference to the MOS, I thought I would let you know section order is not covered there, it is in Wikipedia:Guide to layout. And it says the order doesn't matter which is why I normally put the ref section last. It is a personal preference I have since I always put footnotes at the bottom since most people don't bother to check them (even my professors joke with us that nobody reads them), and I think people are more likely to use the external links. But that's my preference, I'm not trying to get you to agree but somepeople (as I think you have expierenced) might not like others changing articles for no reason. Aboutmovies 20:23, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, technically the GTL is part of the MOS so I'm not wrong about that part. It says it's "okay to change the sequence" of the sections, which I take to mean the order they have listed is the preferred way. I bet there's a huge talkpage argument about this archived somewhere. I dunno, most of the articles I see have the external links at the bottom, which seems like a consensus, and I really think it looks better that way and that people are used to looking at the bottom of the page for the external links so it's faster for them to find them that way. This is the kind of thing professional editors get paid to make consistent. Since I can't achieve consistency across the whole of Wikipedia, I figured I'd try for it on our end. If Wikipedia were a real encyclopedia, the guideline wouldn't be so vague and I could have my way, Bwahaha. Anyway, I hope I've only changed the order when I'm also editing other things, 'cos doing stuff like that and nothing else (I'm thinking of people who do nothing but change the spacing around the == Headings == vs. ==Headings==) *is* truly annoying, though luckily so far I think I've managed to annoy only you :). I'll try to look the other way on your articles, but that's how I see it, YMMV. Katr67, Hobgoblin, 21:09, 2 April 2007 (UTC)

Oregon Airport locations

Good day Katr67, I've noticed that you've been working on critiquing cities that have been called out in airport articles. Be advised that the cities selected as references where selected for a reason. These "cities" - whether a local or a cross road in the middle of no where - are called out in two FAA related documents. The first is FAA A/FD or Airport/Facility Directory. This directory is used by every airman for gathering information on an airport or other facility (such as a helipad).

The second is the FAA Form 5010 - Airport Master Record. When an airport is built and every three years there after it will be inspected and all pertinent information is recorded here. The inspection is performed by the FAA or a designee. (Trivia) In the State of Oregon, this is performed by State Airport Inspector with the Oregon Department of Aviation.

I would advise in keeping with standard in calling out the city addressed by the FAA. By all means feel free to indicate whether that local is incorporated, and if it is not incorporated then what the next closest city is.

Just for an example of this data here is the 5010 data for Lake State Airport. Note how Alkali Lake is called out as the associated city. I hope this help explain the method to my madness. Happy Wiking -Trashbag 02:02, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

Well, I find this baffling because I checked the USGS database, the Portland State University Geographic Names Database, and Oregon Geographic Names, and the places I changed are neither "populated places" nor "locales" (defined as a "battlefield, crossroad, camp, farm, ghost town, landing, railroad siding, ranch, ruins, site, station, windmill") [1] in any of those references. This is why I changed them to reflect the Wikipedia naming convention of Settlement Name, Oregon and put the nearest actual populated place. (Apparently even Wagontire has a population of 2.) These places are instead natural features and should be named simply Foobar Lake or Foobar (Oregon). I see how you'd want the List of Oregon Airports to reflect what the FAA says, so feel free to revert my changes. However, though I'd hate to say the FAA is "wrong" (have they talked to the USGS lately?), for the purposes of Wikipedia, I'd prefer these places didn't have wikilinks that made it seem as if they were settlements. (I was really doubtful about Beaver Marsh too, but that place even had its own post office for a time.) Perhaps, for example, the Alkali Lake (Oregon) article could include a sentence something like "for the purposes of the FAA, a location eight miles north of the lake, referred to as 'Alkali Lake, Oregon' is considered the nearest 'city' to Alkali Lake Airport". Similar to the blurb some of us put on Census-Designated Places--see Neskowin, Oregon. Katr67 06:43, 5 April 2007 (UTC)

category-mistress guidance sought

I'm working on adding divisions to the {{WikiProject Oregon}} template, but am in doubt about the proper category arrangement. As you seem to more fully embrace categories than I do, perhaps you could suggest the category names and relationships that these WP:ORE divisions should fall into:

• government
• education / schools
• biography / people
• history
• sports & athletes biographies
• flora
• business / companies
• geography / physical
• culture / arts
• transport / roads / airports

I expect these would be named rooted at category:WikiProject Oregon or similar names would be subcategories of it, but not sure how to proceed. For example, should government project articles be under category:WikiProject Oregon government, category:WikiProject Oregon/government, category:WPORE government, or what? Maybe this should go to the project talk page? —EncMstr 18:48, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

Oooh fancy. Well, as for government, we've already got Category:WikiProject Oregon Government & Politics, so why don't we follow the lead of that one but maybe lowercase like your first example because history, culture etc. are not really subprojects but subdivisions? We can key them to the existing subdivisions. I'll see if there's any examples of how other WikiProjects do it. Katr67 18:59, 9 April 2007 (UTC)

So I tend to to see how WPMinnesota does things, as they seem to have their act together/have more obsessives than we do ;). This is how they break it down: Category:WikiProject Minnesota. I like their format Category:WikiProject Oregon/Education, etc. I'd skip the "general" subcategory that they have, and I see their "nature and geography" seemingly overlaps "places". We have a cities subproject, but that can in turn fall under our geography category. I'd take the one you call "flora" and make it natural history (there used to be an Oregon fauna category that got axed but there's still a bit of fauna relating to our project). That's the only one I can see that doesn't match up with a subproject, but that's probably OK. They have a parks category, do we need one? We do have a lot of parks. It could be a subcatgory of geography. They don't have a history subcat but we'll need one of course. Katr67 14:30, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I'll propose something based on that at WP:ORE. Thanks. —EncMstr 23:29, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Take a look?

Hey there-

Just got back from the Maryhill Museum of Art (which has an awesome exhibit on Celilo Falls, btw) and I'm trying to wikify my newfound nuggets of knowledge. Could you take a look at Maryhill, Washington - I tried to make it grasp more coherently the dual roles of "modern" maryhill (pop. 98) and the original planned community. It's a weird combo, and one I know you've dealt with before…mind letting me know what you think? I've also been plugging away at Samuel Hill, Celilo Falls, The Dalles Dam, etc… -Pete 09:09, 16 April 2007 (UTC)

Cool, I need to get over there one of these days. I didn't just take a look, I was BOLD and did that thing that I do. I even happen to have a book on Washington sitting here so I threw in a little more info. See what you think--I added the blurb I stole from Bkonrad for just such purposes, slapped a bunch cats on it, etc. Judging by the info I found online, Columbia/Columbus had an identity of its own before it became Maryhill. There's a tiny bit more I can add from the book I have, but I'm sleep-deprived so I'll see if I can get to it later... Katr67 03:52, 17 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Good stuff. My original conundrum, however, remains. In this particular case, it seems to me that the historical status of the place is more significant – or at least, equally significant – to its present status as a hamlet of 98 people. I think a summary of its history belongs in the "intro" paragraph. Do you disagree? -Pete 00:54, 18 April 2007 (UTC)

LPO

The funny thing is, that removal came from the same IP address as the one that originally added it…also without explanation. -Pete 20:01, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Heh. Well, s/he's stuck with it now. Bwahaha. P.S. I'll get back to you on the Maryhill thing. I had some ideas but I got sidetracked... Katr67 20:03, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

The line under Libertarian Party of Oregon History concerning Wes Wagner lawsuit is false and misleading: "Instead of complying and producing accurate financial documents, the party leadership spent over $6000 in attorney's fees to not disclose this financial information." It is my understanding and direct experience that the LPO Treasurer made available all books and records to Mr. Wagner and any other member of the LPO State Committee at their request. If the LPO would have answered Mr. Wagner's "Alternative Writ of Mandamus" in the venue of the Washington County Court, it would have subjected the LPO to paying his attorney's fees as if it were an admission of some sort of guilt not to mention a recognition of the courts jurisdiction in the matter which was disputed by the LPO, affirmed by Judge Hernandez and the suit summarily dismissed in favor of the LPO. Please remove the line in question from the Wikipedia entry. --Jerrydefoe 08:02, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Hi, welcome to Wikipedia. I don't own the article so you are free to edit it yourself. Sorry if my above comment sounded snarky, but we don't like it when anonymous editors delete things without any discussion on the talk page and without using an edit summary--this usually comes across as either vandalism or POV-pushing. I don't really have much interest in the article itself, except to remove what looks to me like vandalism. I'd suggest making the changes, adding cited sources and using an edit summary, or, if you are not comfortable with that, posting your suggested changes to the article's talk page where other editors can get involved. (User Pete is a great resource for the political stuff.) Hope this helps. Katr67 16:39, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

P.S. If you are involved with the party, I'd also suggest reading about conflict of interest. This doesn't preclude you from editing the article, but there are good suggestions about how to write from a neutral point-of-view. Katr67 16:43, 24 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, sympathy, connections, and misc.

Thanks for alphabetizing Medford notables I should have done that myself.

Sorry your getting flamed so much lately just for making following official Wikipedia policies and guidelines. It would help a lot if users would learn more about these and throttle back their egos. I copied your talk page's discussion to Deathgleaner's talk page, where he can read it.

I've been trying to find out about a world champion lumberjack of the 1960s and 1970s named Melvin "Mel" Lentz. It's a little hard to find stuff here in Jackson County, what with #@*&!~ closed libraries and all. I'm sure he lived in Creswell, Oregon in his competitive years. Since he and Fircrest chicken are Creswell's 2 best known exports, I think we should put an artcle up about Mel and a link to Creswell. Can you help? I would also like to put in more about Larry Mahan, one of the greatest rodeo cowboys of all time, who competed out of either Salem or Brooks, Oregon. Same research handicap.

I see you are a fencer. Do you know our fellow Oregon Wikipedian Brady User:Bradybd ? I do volunteer work with him. He studied with Gay Jacobsen D'Asaro. Also do you know my other buddy, John McDougall [2], who also knows which end of the epee to hold?

I see you are a UU. I have always identified as one, and used to teach Sunday school at the Ashland fellowship.

Keep up the good work and keep being BOLD.DaKine 17:48, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Re: Fencing. Cool! My friend and fencing instructor, Twisted 86 has done some training under Maestro McDougall. I've met one other fencer from the Ashland area, Joel, but I've only been fencing for a few months, so I don't have the guts to compete in tournaments and possibly meet more of those folks. More later, I'm supposed to be working. Cheers! Katr67 18:41, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

Glad you're a Crumpacker Backer now

And I'm really looking forward to your Spruce Production Division article which will make everything clear! --Sprkee 04:37, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

I updated the Crumpacker saga, thanks to a pointer from Aboutmovies. One thread I started following had to do with his wife's legacy that I thought might be in your area of expertise or interest. She was the daughter of an Oregon Trail pioneer, James W. Cook. He seems to have some interesting pioneer history, documented in the "History of the Columbia River Valley From The Dalles to the Sea", which I started reading here. So in case you are looking for something else to suck you in.... --Sprkee 17:58, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Content from Bend Living

Hi Katr67 ... I understand the SPAM policy. I believe the changes I made regarding Central Oregon add value to readers in that each article showcases our beautiful state. We are not asking people to buy anything. We simply want them to have access to content that will help them plan a vacation and what to do when they're here.

For instance:

"Paradise Found" talks about "The roots of Central Oregon’s backcountry scene date to the early 1900s when Swedish and Norwegian loggers brought skiing to Bend from the Midwest and Scandinavia."

"Cathedral of Climbing" has some of the most spectacular photography of climbers at Smith Rock State Park. It also includes resources for climbers who visit Central Oregon.

"Rollin' (and Rockin') on The River" features the Bend Paddle Alliance and their work for a safer Deschutes. Again, the photography is beautiful.

"Central Oregon's 10 Best Places to Fly-Fish" lists the best places to cast your line in Central Oregon. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chebert512 (talk • contribs) 20:06, 1 May 2007 (UTC).

Hi Carrie, I suggest you read What Wikipedia is Not. One of the things Wikipedia is not is a place for helping people plan their vacations or even to showcase the state. You might want to check out Wikitravel, where the kind of content you want to add to the article is quite welcome. If you are truly interested in contributing to Wikipedia, I'd suggest adding content, not links. If you have further questions about the content you wish to add to the Bend, Oregon article, be sure to mention them on the article's talk page. Thanks and happy editing. Katr67 20:32, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Also please read this about external links--it is strongly discouraged that you add links to sites with which you are closely affiliated. Thanks. See also conflict of interest. Katr67 20:41, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Plunderathon

Thanks for re-wikifiing the Plunderathon article. We ran into an editorial conflict when two of us were editing it at once, and I believe the solution that was used was "cut n paste," which didn't work out so well. --Davethehorrible 01:02, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Still Pending revision

I noticed that you reverted an edit to the Still Pending article that appeared to be vandalism. Would you mind putting a warning on the user's talk page User_talk:KEVRAYRecords so that they understand the policy? You are quite the prolific editor about all things Oregon! Thank you for all of your contributions. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Stampsations (talk • contribs) 20:25, 2 May 2007 (UTC).

Hi there. I warn users all the time when I'm at home where my vandal script works. When I'm supposed to be working, at work where I can't use Firefox, I often don't take the time to warn vandals because I have to type out the templates by hand. That's just the way it's gonna be. But thanks for the reminder. And you're welcome! Cheers. Katr67 20:29, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. It's been too long since the vandalism for a warning to that user to be effective, I think. If s/he is still vandalizing, of course s/he should be warned again. Katr67 20:31, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. Stampsations 02:20, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Cookie

Thanks for the cookie. I can use one...I gotta go reboot a system at 1am. --Finngall ^talk 00:14, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Gak. What a weekend--heavy housecleaning, light home improvement, multiple parental units, and the door to the game room started falling off its hinges and needs replacing. Bibble. Bibble. B-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b-b..... --Finngall ^talk 19:01, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank you

Katr67 -

Thank you for reviewing my first article. I will work on proper categorization very soon.

GOSCON is not a pure acronym, it roughly stands for "Government Open Source Conference" and I am worried that as an entry title that would be a little generic. Let me know what you think based on the Wikipedia naming conventions.

Thank you!

Chess —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Chessicle (talk • contribs) 01:51, 4 May 2007 (UTC).

Cascade passes

I am almost afraid to touch anything about the Cascades. There is one editor who thinks there is a distinction to be made between the 'Cascades' and the 'Casade Mountains', claiming some mountains are in the Cascades, some in the Cascade Mountains and some in both. I hate to think what would happen to passes as well. Hmains 04:43, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Governor of Oregon

I was on this page today and the navigation template with all the past govs is having issues, but I wanted to make sure it wasn't just my computer. Could you see if the v d e and edit are behind the title? Thanks. Aboutmovies 15:32, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

It seems to be working fine in Explorer... Katr67 16:10, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for checking, I have explorer too and both the Gov template and the curretn govs templates are not displaying properly for me. Time for a re-boot. Aboutmovies 16:31, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

NHRP tidbit

This page looks like it could use a little gnomification from a NHRP geek: Grays River (Washington) (see the bit about the covered bridge...) Enjoy! -Pete 09:31, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Gnoming accomplished, including on a couple related articles. I'll try to get around to writing an article on the bridge. First I have to help my friend get her master's degree by editing a couple of her final papers... Katr67 14:43, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Northerly! LOL! Good luck with the "real life" editing... -Pete 19:02, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah. Heh. But for some reason I left "southwesterly" in the other article. At least they aren't statistics papers this time... Katr67 20:15, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Official Appointment

I hereby appoint Katr WikiCop.

Now nobody can claim nobody ever appointed you the police of Wikipedia. Hopefully the mellow is now somewhat unharshed. -Pete 06:19, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

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Jeff the Great weighs in again

Thanks for all the traffic to my http://jeffthegreat.blogspot.com blog, Katr67! Too bad I haven't made your User page as someone you hate :( — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.117.164.28 (talk • contribs) 16:16, May 8, 2007 (UTC)

No problem. But I'm confused. I don't keep a list of people I hate. Am I supposed to? Hate lists are uncivil. Besides, I don't hate you, but I wish you would read up on wikipolicy. Katr67 16:24, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Oregon politician stubs

There are a lot of politician stubs, including those not tagged as such, that need to be expanded. I see you made a place to list them under Wikipedia:WikiProject_Oregon/People but from the description on the main project page, I would almost expect them to be under the Government subproject. So could we either expand the description of the People subproject to specifically call out politicians, or decide to have politician bios be a part of the Government project? I think people who are into the government stuff tend to be into the politicians themselves as well. --Sprkee 17:01, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey Sprkee, I'm not attached to where they go, I just wanted a place to keep track of 'em. For sure feel free to rewrite or cross-reference the two sub-projects so it's clearer. My bias is that I'm more interested in people than politicians. :) I figure most everybody who's actually working on this stuff is already aware of both lists, but yes, if we want new people to get involved we should definitely make the redlinks easier to find. Katr67 17:12, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the invite - I'm also starting on a category and related pages for Category:University of Oregon buildings. I plan on taking pictures (myself, of course) of at least the appealing buildings on campus and incorporating them into new articles about campus history (I'm a bit of a UO history buff =P). Nice to meet a fellow duck on here! akendall_(talk) 19:54, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. Glad to have you aboard. Good idea on the buildings--quite a bit of work needs to be done there. I took a few pics last time I was in Eugene, but the weather was gloomy so the light wasn't so good. I did add a couple images to the Knight Library, bookstore and museum articles but better pics are always welcome. I've got a few more I need to upload... Be sure to check the commons--there's quite a bit of UO stuff on there. Cheers! Katr67 20:01, 8 May 2007 (UTC)

You sure are quick with those Wikiproject Oregon tags. =P akendall_(talk) 04:40, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

LOL. Some people tell me I need to get a life. :) Katr67 04:44, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Capitol

Thank you for the correction.

Live and learn.

(capitol, not capital)— Preceding unsigned comment added by Beaver1believer (talk • contribs) 17:08, May 11, 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome. It's a common mistake. Katr67 17:19, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Three Rivers, Oregon

Three Rivers is an interesting example of wikipedia's laws limitations. The problem is, there is basically no published information on the subject, so almost anything added is going to be considered original and thus wrong. In this way, we can't learn about Three Rivers simply because no one has published it.

I've lived in Three Rivers and my information is verifiable -- but "verify" here would mean calling the people and asking them if what i write is accurate.

So what's the solution to this?— Preceding unsigned comment added by Rayjackson30 (talk • contribs) 11:33, May 11, 2007 (UTC)

Thanks very much for bringing this up for discussion. First of all, please read about originial research. Unfortunately, personal experience does not count as a reliable source on Wikipedia. If there isn't anything published about the situation in a secondary source, I'm afraid it will need to stay out of the article, because as you correctly guessed, calling up people to verify the info doesn't count. I do find the "lawlessness" situation interesting, and I didn't know that Three Rivers was a gated community. Can you at least find a reliable source for that information? I see your revisions have become increasingly less POV, so thanks for working on that. If you want to go ahead and add a few sentences on the legal status of the community that are NPOV, I would be OK with adding a {{fact}} tag to that part and seeing if we can find more information. BTW, I believe "photographic evidence" doesn't work as a reliable source either. I'll take a closer look when I'm not supposed to be working. I hope that helps. Katr67 18:48, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Springbrook, List of Yamhill County Post Offices

I will gladly cite my sources. Can I get info on book and pamphlet citing format? --Zinc2005 15:57, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I find using citation templates is the easiest, maybe modify the books one to use for a pamphlet. According to the Chicago Manual of Style (one of the style guides Wikipedia suggests when the Wikipedia MOS doesn't address something), the format for pamphlets is here. If you're using OGN, you can just copy and paste this template:

<ref name="OGN">{{cite book | last = McArthur | first = Lewis A. | authorlink = Lewis A. McArthur | coauthors = [[Lewis L. McArthur]] | title = [[Oregon Geographic Names]] | origyear = 1928 | edition = Seventh Edition | year = 2003 | publisher = [[Oregon Historical Society]] Press | location = [[Portland, Oregon|Portland]], [[Oregon]] | id = ISBN 0-87595-277-1 | pages = }}</ref>

and add the page number. Since I use it all the time that's what I do. I keep a copy of it on my user page and just open the edit screen to copy and paste it when I need to. (I'd link to it, but since my user page doesn't have a TOC, I guess I can't--it's a little more than halfway down the page.) Hope that helps. Katr67 16:23, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Here is the page on footnotes. To simplify, most of the time on the Oregon articles we are trying to use the <ref></ref> tags around the citations, and then a References section with the {{reflist}} template. Other methods are OK, but that's what a bunch of us are trying to do. Katr67 16:28, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Oh, sorry, I didn't notice you'd replied. Okay, I tried it on my own, I'll revise them. By the way, where did you get the info on the Springbrook post office closing date? OGN? --Zinc2005 19:33, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

I must have got it from OGN, not sure why I didn't cite it. I'll go ahead and add the cite now. Katr67 19:39, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

With or without a TOC, you can still link to the section header...though your superscripted "ref" tag makes for an ugly URL: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Katr67#My_favorite_citation.07UNIQ5127530c4bf7191e-nowiki-00000008-QINU1.07UNIQ5127530c4bf7191e-nowiki-00000009-QINU

=) -Pete 19:47, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I tried that and I couldn't seem to get it to jump to the right section. You're right that it's ugly. I thought about fixing it but I'd rather work on articles. :) Katr67 19:51, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

How do you cite a section of a book? (or informational map, in this case?) --Zinc2005 20:00, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Hmm. There's a way to cite the chapter of a book with multiple authors (example from Chicago Manual: Repgen, K. 1987. What is a 'Religious War'? In Politics and society in Reformation Europe, edited by E. I. Kouri and T. Scott, 311-328. London: Macmillan.), but I'm not sure about a map section. Can you give an example? Katr67 20:45, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, reference 2 on Springbrook. "Rural schools" is the section (it's included in the title right now.)--Zinc2005 22:10, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

George Washington (Washington pioneer)

Hi, thanks for the help on editing this one. I tried to clean it up a bit. Bearian 00:56, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome, and Wow, great job on the cleanup. I wouldn't have noticed this at all if you hadn't put the oregon stub tag on it. Interesting how something that looks like total garbage can turn out to be a quite notable subject. Happy editing! Katr67 01:00, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Des Griffin

Hello Katr67, "This article may require cleanup to meet Wikipedia's quality standards". Ok, but you do not explain why... I would be interested to know your arguments about that. Don't you think this model is a little "agressive" for a new article that has already 2 references (which is a lot more than about 50 % of the articles on WP) ? To you, g'day, Eristik 03:14, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

I took the tags off. I'm getting tired of arguing with people. But some of the syntax is a little off in places, and just because other articles aren't up to Wikistandards doesn't mean you can compare them. Ideally, each fact in an article should be backed with a citation. That makes it easier when other editors add new info. Tags shouldn't be construed as "agressive"--we're all just here to improve articles. Happy editing. Katr67 03:24, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Ok for syntax, on my user page you will notice that ma langue maternelle est le français. I still believe, in general, that clean up is often done by users who do not know enough about the subject of the articles they're cleaning. Just a constructive comment. Merci et je vous souhaite une très belle journée , Eristik 17:12, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

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treasurers

Looking for a copy editor...anyone seen a copy editor around here? Can you weigh in at Wikipedia:Categories_for_discussion/Log/2007_May_13#State_treasurers_of_the_United_States, about how the capitalization should be? (And otherwise, if you so desire.) I am usually good with that stuff, but can't seem to wrap my head around whether the official title "State Treasurer" means that "State treasurers of Oregon" should have a capital T...and I have no style manuals laying around! -Pete 20:33, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

My brain hurts--I've been in the data entry zone all day. I'll take a message for the copy editor. I'll see if I can get my brain to wake up and take a look at it this evening. TTYL Katr67 22:14, 15 May 2007 (UTC)