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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Markh (talk | contribs) at 10:31, 10 October 2007 (Undid revision 163491501 by Rick S33555 (talk) revert rambling). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

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The Narmer Palette is depicting a section of the Genesis scripture. The scene depicted on the Palette is one of the main stories in the Genesis,..which is the murder of Abel by Cain. The figure carrying the sandles means that Cain and Abel walked a long distance until reaching a marshy erea where today would be the spot where the great Sphinx sits on the Giza Plateau. In this spot Cain raised his staff or stick and beats Abel to death, mostly by hitting on the head. The two figures at the bottom of the Palette my be either stating that the two where brothers, or that Abel ran away from his family with a companion. The other side of the palette depicts Abel's funnerary procession. Again the figure with the sandles depicts that this procession was a long walk that ended by a pyramid, probably the pyramid of Menkaura on the Giza plateau. The boat depicts that this procession was happening by the Nile river, and that the whole procession was very pompus and extravagant. Of course there was only a few humans at the time when Cain killed Abel, not enough for a pompus procession full of people: what the Palette is trying to state is that the grave of Abel was later visited by people of the coming generations to venerate him. Again the bull stamping the figure at the bottom of the palette reminds the onlooker that at this spot Abel was killed in a beastly manner.

We can clearly see that prophet Moses was brought up by the priests of Hierankopolis where he was taught the ancient holy scriptures. A torah that was already written in stone and preserved by the priests of Hierankopolis. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 196.218.27.140 (talk • contribs).

The Narmer palette shows the control of an adversary with threat of sanction rather than violence.
On the pallete we observe that it is the personified field, Akr the god of the land itself and the distribution of the setat or irrigated land that is being controlled. Horus assists by opening the ways and letting the innundation flow to the fields. By controlling the water Narmer controls the land. He stands on the power and authority of his ancestors, who built and defended cities not enemy corpses. Rktect 12:13, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

History of Palette: "Cosmetic palette"

The original Palette (Egyptian Xxxxx) (in books) were obviously pictorial, and probably hung for display (as a painting)(Not Narmer's) of today's "Rope Art". (Some contained the bored holes for the rope/string for hanging.) They often had the motif of the bird beak (actually bird head) at each side, (the term facing, or facing away: confronted, or anti-confronted (?). The circle in the center was not originally there, as sometimes an entire surface was Unadorned, (the whole palette). Only the very top, or some other point had some animal motif, reference. (An example of a proto-palette is an ovoid turtle, no adorning, just set up for hanging (with stubby turtle feet)).

There appear to be about 12, a dozen or so more spectacular palettes. (These were after the "Proto-palette"s.) An incomplete list: (from memory:)(Palette (Egyptian historical)

  1. the Cosmetic palette
  2. the Proto-palette
  3. Bull Pallette
  4. Vulture Palette
  5. Palette of the Five Standards (vis. Palette of the Hunt)
  6. Giraffe-Palm Palete
  7. Two Panther Palette
  8. Libyan Palette
  9. Two Hippopotamus Palette
  10. Tribute to City-states Palette=Libyan Palette(officiale-nominus)-(Cairo Egyptian Museum)
  11. Narmer Palette
  12. ---Etc.--Totally incomplete list. Some of the above names are the "Standard"; others mine. added Libyan Palette..(Cosmetic palette-Stub) -Mmcannis 15:29, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Any egyptophile who has perused the books, ((or attempted the Hiegoglyphic translations)), or been in the appropriate museum, (for example: Los Angeles County Museum of Art), can see these Proto-palettes on display(the above list are not the "Prote-pallette"s, but Palette (Egyptian historical)). notes from the ArizonaDesert.. -SonoraDesert-- (Also = =giving a header= = to the above unsigned First Section)...Mmcannis 18:07, 31 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I'm sorry, but what are you saying this has to do with the article here? The Narmer Palette is notable for its apparent depiction of the unification of the Two Kingdoms and for its mention of a unifying king not mentioned in the king list.
If you're proposing a general article on Egyptian palettes, go right ahead and create it. I caution you that giving your own names to them is original research which we cannot include here. Also be sure to provide citations for features such as the interpretation of the holes you give above. (To me, they could equally well been for hanging on a peg for storage, although with the decorative motifs a secondary purpose of display is not unlikely.) TCC (talk) (contribs) 00:44, 1 January 2007 (UTC) [The last picture I saw of a turtle palette, January2007, "Ian Shaw: (editor)" Ancient Egypt(20 authors), (P. 49, hardbound), c2000 (hardcover, ISBN 0-19-815034-2) has a hole in the top margin, center for hanging[pick the Type of hanging]: Yellow painted eye(only paint job), tiny, miniscule tail, about 1/25th, or 1/30th area of fish. No scales, but a few lines(details) here and there. The example was used as a color photo[bottom rectangle 1/2 of page], because it is so exceptional, with no breaks.)] -Mmcannis 15:29, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The Narmer Palette appears to be the last of the 'series'. Virtually all of the previous ones are "proto-dynastic" or later, at least in style. The earliest have sometimes no adornments, only shapes (As the turtle-shape mentioned), or the bird heads, which are in the proto-dynastic motif. I am just trying to relate that the amazing Narmer palette is the last of them, .... but there are some other amazing ones too. (from the ArizonaDesert).... -Mmcannis 06:13, 1 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Its one of a series at any rate. If you look at the palettes of the scorpion king and other artifacts of the predynastic kings such as their mace heads and knife handles, you see the same symbols of power, the same nome gods and in particular the same responsibilities which bring the support of the nomes to the king. On the Scorpion kings palette we see the people digging ditches to create irrigated fields under the kings direction. Its that sort of leadership and organization that creates dynasties, and supports their continuation with the grant of land in return for service and thus sustenence in return for support.
Erm... The Narmer Palette is Protodynastic according to many Egyptologists, and there are many other examples of palettes, some earlier, some later, and others roughly contemporary. TCC (talk) (contribs) 06:32, 1 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I am not sure any are later than the Narmer Palette. I think Egypt got started, and was up to bigger and better endeavors (on the way to pyramids and all)(and language). But a Date-list of palettes would be nice-and Provenance.-- (from Arizona's,SonoranDesert-) ..-Mmcannis 15:29, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I suspect the misunderstanding may have something to do with Narmer being considered Dynasty 0 or Dynasty 1 (or even straddling the two), and is the "latest" of the finds from the Main deposit (Nekhen). It is likely that it was not the very final such palette ever made, but it is one of the more easily dateable ones, and it is datable to end of the protodynastic period.
For a picture of another protodynastic palette which could be used for an article on the subject (hint hint), see the one available on WikiMedia in the shape of a turtle at: [1].
Cheers! Captmondo 16:52, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I assume the only other ones that are date-able, are from their "Find -positions? I can only think of the Narmer as datable. The Libyan Palette has a Scorpion on it, but long before Serket, or King Scorpion..And I think only two others(1 the Libyan) have hieroglyphs(total plus Narmer P. -3). --Mmcannis 19:21, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I see there was a Protodynastic king: Serket I. -Mmcannis 19:31, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
The Narmer Palette is not actually dateable from its findspot. It was in the Main Deposit at Hierakonpolis, which was not well-recorded in situ when excavated and was evidently a kind of dumping ground for old objects that were no longer useful but too sacred to simply dump. It contained artifacts from a range of eras. The Palette was approximately dated by the comparative method, IIRC.
There are other objects, not palettes but things like labels, bearing early hieroglyphs, but since these are not the same as the later glyphs they can't be read with any certainty. TCC (talk) (contribs) 22:16, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I've never heard of the Main deposit (Nekhen) being described as a dumping ground in the way you describe it TCC, got a citation for that one? (Not being challenging, am genuinely curious). Though I can't find the source, I remember hearing of once sacred objects being disposed of by burial if they had been desecrated in some manner, but that was millenia later than this.
And for Mmcannis' benefit, the find positions were not recorded properly when the dig at Nekhen was done in the late 1890s. Read the article for a good, if brief, overview of what is known about the dig.
Had a chance to look at once of my reference books that mentions the palettes, and what makes the Narmer Palette special is that it uniquely(?) seems to describe events involving a pharaoh who can be named. For the record, other Egyptian palettes of note to ancient Egyptian historians include the following: the Battlefield Palette, the Bull Palette, the Cairo-Brooklyn Palette, the Hunter's Palette, the Libyan Booty Palette, the Min Palette, the Ostrich Palette and the Oxford Palette. I don't believe any of them other than the Narmer palette are linkable to any other pharaoh.
For a good online source that references all of them (good start for an article on the subject), see: Masking the Blow: The Scene of Representation in Late Prehistoric Egyptian Art (kind of esoteric in terms of its subject-matter, but has pictures of most of the major known ancient Egyptian palettes). Captmondo 23:24, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Michael Hoffman characterized it that way in Egypt Before the Pharaohs unless my memory is unreliable, as it occasionally is. I don't have the book in front of me so I can't give a page reference ATM. TCC (talk) (contribs) 23:43, 24 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

An update for the Palette List: (JUN 9, 2007)
(from memory:)-Again" (Palette (Egyptian historical)

  1. the Cosmetic palette
  2. the Proto-palette; I think it goes along with: Rhomboidal-Proto palette-(? yes?)
  3. Bull Pallette
  4. Vulture Palette
  5. Palette of the Five Standards (vis. Palette of the Hunt)
  6. Giraffe-Palm Palete
  7. Two Panther Palette
  8. Libyan Palette; the Tjehenu Palette, other names, just now updated,-8June07
  9. Two Hippopotamus Palette
  10. Narmer Palette
  11. "Tribute to City-states Palette"=Libyan Palette(officiale-nominus)-(Cairo Egyptian Museum)

and one of these is the "Oxford Palette".....from the SonoranDesert-ArizUSA...-Mmcannis 12:16, 9 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Going to Gardiner, Faulkner, Loprieno or other sources and learning the Egyptian grammar so you can read them palettes allows you to get much more information than is immediately apparent from just looking at them. In particular a comparison of the titles of those who accompany Narmer (catfish chisel) on the palette is edifying. Rktect 12:13, 19 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

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