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Wikipedia:WikiProject Years

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Docu (talk | contribs) at 18:48, 18 December 2003 (suggestion to addition of template). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Title

WikiProject Years

Scope

This WikiProject aims primarily to formalise the unofficial standard used for creating year pages. Results should be transferred to Wikipedia:Timeline standards.

Parentage

The parent of this WikiProject is the WikiProject Time.

Descendant Wikiprojects

Similar Wikiprojects

The similar WikiProjects are WikiProject Centuries and WikiProject Millenia.

Participants

Template

Note: This template contains things that don't apply to certain years. If something here doesn't apply, such as 'this year in television', just leave it out.

Centuries: 19th century - 20th century - 21st century

Decades: 1930s 1940s 1950s 1960s 1970s - 1980s - 1990s 2000s 2010s 2020s 2030s

Years: 1981 1982 1983 1984 1985 - 1986 - 1987 1988 1989 1990 1991

See also:

Events

Births

Deaths

Nobel Prizes

Discussion

I think that the section "this year in art, culture, and fashion" should be left out. I prefer the frame that has links to those pages. LittleDan 16:48 16 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Yep. It is redundant and takes up unnecessary space (I hate having to list things twice). I vote for just having the box links and leaving out the actual section. Oh and each other heading should be a real heading (==) instead of just being bolded. --mav
No, I like the bolded look. It cleans up the page. We don't want giant headings everywhere. But there is one problem with deleting the art, culture, and fashion section. Parts of it might not be listed in the individual pages, so we'd have to check each one. I've deleted the 'art, culture, and fashion' section from the template. LittleDan 15:22 17 Jun 2003 (UTC)
I would also prefer having actual headings as it makes editing (especially for long articles) easier. If it can be done automatically (some script) for all pages then it would be great, otherwise might as well leave them as they are. Dori 01:29, 16 Aug 2003 (UTC)
I'd also like to add my support to the idea of headings being real headings and not just bolded. It's best (especially in the long run) to use proper mark-up not just a lower-level description of what it looks like. If headings appear too big on some browsers (they don't on mine), then that can be fixed by CSS markup. Furthermore, the Wikipedia:Guide to Layout recommends this. -- Cabalamat 02:29, 29 Aug 2003 (UTC)
I also agree with the headings. It looks like we are close to a consensus here. olivier 17:38, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
I'm involved in the current project for the year in science pages, and have been adding links to them from the general year pages as they are built. I much prefer the See also boxes rather than art, culture, and fashon heading, as the year in science doesn't seem to fit there, yet it seems clunky to add another section just for the year in science link. Additionally, I agree with using headings over bolded headlines, and have been editing pages to use headings whenever I'm adding the "year in science" link. Hope I didn't step on anyone's toes. Gentgeen 09:52, 1 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Regarding specific dates, there are a lot of Wikipedia pages that refer to a specific date (day, month and year) on which an event occurred. These are not automatically put on the page for that year. Wouldn't it be nice if they were, in a semi-automated way (this could be done on a batch process running perhaps once per day or once per week). As an example of what I mean, consider the Eurofighter Typhoon site.

This contains the sentence:

The automatic process could insert this entry in the appropriate place in the 1994 page:

I expect there are a few things in this proposal that need to be ironed out.

-- Cabalamat 02:39, 29 Aug 2003 (UTC)

The main problem is that it gets so many bad entries. Most of these should simply be deleted again, the rest would probably need editing. If you do this at all, I'd propose to use to create some 1994/Temp page, and then create entries from there. I have the feeling that getting a list of them is the only useful thing here; rewriting might well be easier than editing. Andre Engels 11:16, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
  • I would suggest to have an additional paragraph: Monarchs/Presidents. The idea being to know who was in office where during that year. For instance, when I would read: "The Seven Years' War (1756 - 1763) pitted Great Britain, Prussia and Hanover against France, Austria, Russia, Sweden, and Saxony." I could click on the dates and see who were the guys in power during that period. See my embryonic proposal at: 1756. olivier 00:29, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
I love that. It only makes boring year pages more attractive! -- Taku
Along the same line, I suggest adding an Ongoing events paragraph. (see 1757 for an example). The idea being to give a snapshot of the state of the world at the time. olivier 01:18, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
Can we put practical rulers as well? Like Monarchs/Presidents/Practical rules or something. For example, in 1756 Japan was ruled by shogun. -- Taku
Same situation for Prime Ministers of the UK, Chancellors of Germany, various Governors... I agree that we should find a satisfying title for the paragraph that would include all of them. Monarchs/Presidents/Practical rulers is a bit bulky... olivier 01:40, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
I know it doesn't sound good. Simply rulers or national leaders? -- Taku
I think that's a good term, yes. Andre Engels 11:18, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
Sounds good. Another option would be "Heads of states". olivier 17:38, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)
I like Heads of states. If no objection is seen, I am going to change the heading. -- Taku 23:21, Oct 3, 2003 (UTC)
Popes, antipopes, some important ministers and leaders of breakaway or important dependent territories could also usefully find their way in the list. Does "heads of states" cover these guys adequately? I would say it does, but I would be happy to have other opinions. olivier 08:38, 4 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I'm definitely coming in late to this discussion (which I only found out because of Olivier's edit to AD 680), but I do have a couple of reservations:

  1. Won't this overwhelm entries of earlier years where outside of the "Heads of states" section there might only be one or two entries? (Hopefully this will not always be the case, but as one person who is trying to add content to entries before AD 1000, there are far more years that would be overwhelmed than not.)
  2. Where do we draw the line on inclusion of "Heads of states"? For example, currently there are about 170 sovereign countries in the World -- which ones do we include & exclude? The problem only gets more entangled the further back we go, & we lay ourselves open to charges of being selective. (For example, including every king of Sparta while omitting any mention of the kings of Nubia, or various client kingdoms of China or the current Indian Empire.)

Until these points are addressed, could the addition of this section be kept to the entries after AD 1000 -- & preferably after 1500? Those entries tend to be quite verbose, & a section like this would be of most benefit. -- llywrch 20:47, 16 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Interesting. I would almost be tempted to say that having all the lists of the all the heads of states pre-1000 or pre-15000 would be a good problem to have. Basically, we are talking about a problem that we do not have yet, but that we will have sometime down the road, after the "heads of states" lists become overpopulated (It is far from being the case at this point). 3 points come to my mind to tentatively address these issues:
1- Let us go back to the reason why we want (or don't want) to have the list of "heads of states" in the years' pages. I have started to include this section in order to generate a discussion, and also because I felt the need to have this information at some point. As I said before, having a page detailing what the world looked like in 680 would be interesting - to me, at least, and slightly more useful than knowing, for instance, who was born this year. Figuring out why we want these lists might help us figure out who should be in the lists. (I know I am not solving the problem here...)
2- Regarding the overwhelming issue. IF you intend to add the births/death and changes of power of all the rulers you are mentioning, then the list of heads of states should not be longer than the other lists on the page. I agree that this would make these pages VERY long. Now, the question is also whether we want to include all these events in the years' pages, and we arrive at a broader question: which granularity do we want to have on these pages? The question has been raised by User:Mazzy at Wikipedia talk:Timeline standards, but no agreement has been reached yet, as far as I know.
3- Wikipedia dynamics. In my Wikipedia experience, problems are best solved when they actually arise. Here is my suggestion: if some people feel enthusiatic about filling such huge lists as detailed "Heads of states" lists, then let us let them do it. It is a work that we probably want to see being done, and if we impose restrictions at this early stage, then these contributions might be postponed for a very long time. If we eventually figure out that some lists have grown out of control, then we could for instance simply create a separate page "Heads of states in 680".
Bottom line. My suggestion is to continue populating these lists, and if they grow too big, let us create separate pages. That reminds me a bit of a discussion we had at Talk:East Germany (see 29 Jun 2003). In this case, I belive that the presence of the template has generated more contributions than if it had not been applied. Of course, these are my suggestions, and I am glad to read others' opinions. olivier 23:42, 16 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I would suggest to reduce the 'this year in...' box to only those years where at least one of these actually exist, and then still only those that actually do exist. Having an empty link to 1001 in sports on 1001 is just silliness, in my opinion. Andre Engels 11:16, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)

Your voice and the voice of reason seem to be pretty close... olivier 17:38, 30 Sep 2003 (UTC)

See my suggestion for The world in at 1220. olivier 03:46, 5 Oct 2003 (UTC)

I'd like to suggest the following addition to the template for year pages, at e.g. 80:

Alternate uses: see Number 80

in wikimarkup:

:''Alternate uses: see [[Number 80]]''

at the beginning of the pages. Number 80 is a redirect to eighty.
This would replace notes such as (on 10):

  • For the number 10, see ten
  • There are quite a few albums called 10, including recordings by LL Cool J and Pearl Jam. For a complete list, see Ten.

or (on 24):

For the number 24, see twenty-four.
For the television series, see 24 (television).

--User:Docu

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