User talk:Keeper76

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For closing the ANI thread here!

My RfA

I can has mop?

Hi Keeper76! Thank you for your support in my RfA (87/3/3). I truely appreciate the many votes of confidence, and I will exert myself to live up to those expectations. Thanks again! - CobaltBlueTony™ talk 17:56, 26 March 2008 (UTC)

New Messages

Hello, Keeper76. You have new messages at Dustihowe's talk page.
You can remove this notice at any time by removing the {{Talkback}} or {{Tb}} template.

I have been doing some digging....

I am not sure about this, but I think This admin's actions are incorrect. What do you think? Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:12, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

• thought I would throw this in there too. Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:20, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I think I'm staying out of it. I don't know the subject matter, I don't know the editors involved. I would recommend you do the same, unless you happen to know the subject matter. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:22, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm staying out of it, as I tried to do the compromise thingy, and its kinda worked, a little bit of discussion. I'm talking about him using his admin powers to push weight around. Does this fit here? I just have an issue with him being uncivil, especially with my polite request. It was polite wasn't it? Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:25, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Your request was fine. Did he respond to your request somewhere incivilly? All I saw was him deleting your request, which is perfectly acceptable to do, not incivil, and well within his editor rights (and has nothing to do with admin rights). In fact, him removing your comment was an acknowledgment of reading your comment. It is retained in his talk history. Nothing else needed, IMO Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:30, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Read the edit summary here. Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:33, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I hafta be honest, I kinda chuckled at that. It is similar to something I would have typed if someone posted a section on my talkpage with the header "Edit Warring". "Edit Warring" has an inherent assumption of bad faith in it, don't you think? It sounds quite negative. Perhaps in the future, "Hey there, I've noticed a dispute", or something of that sort would have garnered a more positive response from him. He didn't swear at you, I suppose that's positive. :-) I would let it go if I were you. He got your message, and since then, has been contributing to the talk page. Mission accomplished, as it were. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:38, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Maybe, just maybe I could have picked a better title. Hmmmm..... chunky peanut butter or creamy peanut butter? Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:40, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Sunbutter. :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:42, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Leave it to you to put a smile on my face. Thanks keeper... Dusti^{speak and be heard!} 16:46, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Well Well Well

You asked for an apology in my deitor review. No chance, apoligize for this: 'Do your "high aspirations" include telling someone to fuck off when they approach you with constructive criticism?' That was really rude and don't expect an apology until I get one. --FGWQPR (talk) 17:23, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

You stated that you had high aspirations. Only a few edits before you told someone to fuck off. My question was an honest one. So was my question on your editor review Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:27, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Just watch the Aprentice. I tell you they have high aspirations and they always tell people to fuck off.--FGWQPR (talk) 18:53, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

And then usually right after that, they get told "You're fired". What's your point? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 19:17, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

It is possible to be angry and to be clever. You can be angry at your peers and aqqaintences but be a really succesful person accademically. --FGWQPR (talk) 19:38, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I'd say that it's possible to be clever until you become angry. ;-) --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 19:43, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I would say cleverness and anger come at different times, completely seperate but in the same person. —Preceding unsigned comment added by FGWQPR (talk • contribs) 19:45, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

<outdent>I'll just finish this whole thread with "it's possible to edit wikipedia without telling other editors to fuck off", however clever, aspiring, angry, or academically successful one views him/herself or wishes him/herself to be, as they are all irrelevant to Wikipedia. I can't think of a good reason to say "fuck off" on Wikipedia. And as long as we are relating it to real life inappropriately, I can't think of a job/occupation/career/aspiration that will last very long, or be very rewarding at least, where a person is telling their co-job/occupation/career/aspiration -ers to "fuck off". Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 19:51, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry, I must say one last thing. You have said fuck off proving your point wrong. :) --FGWQPR (talk) 19:58, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Ha! Thanks for your levity. I have technically said "fuck off" more in this thread than I think I have in any other thread, you are completely correct. I appreciate your good humor. I did take a minute to read your editor review (at least those that reviewed you) and can see that you are a good editor, glad to see you being open to criticism and open to adoption/coaching, for what its worth. If you don't mind, I'd like to call all of this "water under the bridge". Agree? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:01, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Agreed! --FGWQPR (talk) 21:19, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Quote

Funny now that anytime I come across something funny I think of you. Hmm.. Anyway, you might like Jeske's here. I was going to use it myself, but then I got a Friday quote. :) Rudget 17:35, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

heh, that is funny. I like Fridays too (I'm assuming it's the one in the box on your current userpage? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:38, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

:) Rudget 17:42, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Online?

I need some advice....Dusti^{complain/compliment} 19:59, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm here, but barely....Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:06, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I have adopted FGWQPR. Any thoughts where I should start?Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:08, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Have you adopted anyone before? If not, some good reading is available WP:ADOPT, and this subpage for adopters. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:10, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

And also, there is a resources section too, could prove helpful. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:12, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

No, I have never adopted someone before, but I feel that its going to be a good expierence, with this particular user. I have looked over those pages, and I think the first thing we are going to do is discuss what has happened over the past several days and where it applies in Wiki policies. You could have easily blocked him for being rude and uncivil, but you being good ol' keep kept your cool. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:15, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Excellent place to start. And to clarify, I did in fact block him for being rude and incivil, to use your words. For 48 hours, if I remember correctly, read his talkpage. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:21, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I meant for the above comments :) Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:27, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Oh. In that case, I have absolutely no reason to block him again, that hasn't even crossed my mind. We were having a very civil conversation from what I could tell. Had I blocked again, I would've been the subject of an ANI post for admin abuse for sure, as it would have been completely out of line for me to do that to him, as it would have been punitive instead of preventative at that point. So, yes, in that case, I guess keeper did keep his cool...:-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:31, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Good job! Any other thoughts? Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:33, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

At the moment, I was just thinking that the cloud outside my window looks like a clownface. And I'm wondering if my two year old son is taking a good nap so that he won't be crabby when I get home from work...oh wait, you meant wiki? No. No more thoughts. You'll do fine. If your talkpage (and FGWQPR's) talkpages start getting cluttered with back and forth, you could create an adoption subspage in his userspace, other than that, go for it! Help him out, let him ask questions (and for the love, every time he asks a question, don't post here. You've adopted him, not me :-). Have confidence in what you know, use the Wikipedia resource pages for what you don't know. Don't guess at things, find the answers. Excellent practice for when you're an admin. (Notice I said when, and not if this time?  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:37, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

No if? Wow, you seem to think I will be an Admin one day....hmmm... I won't come here if he asks a question, I'll look it up. And if I can't find it there, I'll make up an answer lol :). Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:49, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Cheers

For catching that little bit of nastiness :)... hope you're good —αlεx•mullεr 20:04, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

No problem. I'm doing well - haven't seen you around much since RfA, which may be a good sign I suppose - no ANI threads with your name in them...:-). Did you take a break or are we just in separate circles? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:06, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I was on holiday for about three weeks when I didn't edit at all, and now I've got exams pretty solidly through till the middle of June... I should be around fairly often until then, and I can foresee a lot of time over summer spent here (it's the holiday before my first year of university, so it's about 4 months long). I'm looking forward to getting much more involved in this once the time becomes available... though I'm finding catching up on recent controversies hard, we need an ANI "major incident" summary :). Anything seriously big change throughout March or the beginning of April? —αlεx•mullεr 21:07, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Oh, you know, the usual stuff. Nothing that hasn't been seen before, or won't be seen again. I wouldn't worry too much about what you missed, there'll be plenty to go around this summer.  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 21:39, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Rollback Question

since I seem to see it all over my watchlist these days? I know what it is from Wikipedia:Rollback feature and its assorted links, but why is it necessary? I like and use Twinkle and Friendly -- is Rollback really any better? Just curious? TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 20:49, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

If I may keeper, Rollback is a simple tool that makes reverting large amounts of vandalism easier. Some users seem to find it easier than using the undo function. I'm in love with the tool, but really it only saves a few keystrokes and is one click instead of two. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:52, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, Dusti. Have you used Twinkle? Is it any different in terms of ease of use, etc? TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 20:58, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

I never (or at least rarely) use rollback. I personally don't see the big deal about it. I also don't have any scripts loaded (I'm a purist I guess, or perhaps a masochist). 100% of my edits are manual edits, even when I worked extensively at WP:DPL. So, meh? Maybe I'm not the right guy to ask. If you wanna try it out, say the word. You definitely would qualify as an "editor in good standing", I'd be happy to add +rollback to your account. It can be removed anytime by request as well if you don't want it. Actually, nevermind. I just added it. Try it out, read the WP:RBK to do it right. If you don't want it, don't use it. If it comes in handy once, it's there as an option. Fair warning though, when you click on "rollback" on your monitor, there is no "are you sure?" screen. It just says "rolled back" (or some such). Be sure of what you're doing. Oh, and Dusti. Cripes! Give me two minutes to answer questions on my own talkpage! Sheesh!  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:59, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Twinkle doesn't work with Internet Explorer. Oh and Keep, just type faster lol Dusti^{complain/compliment} 21:01, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

Or, considering the average size of my posts, type less. :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 21:02, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

No, you make sense. See you tomorrow :) Dusti^{complain/compliment} 21:04, 21 April 2008 (UTC)

(outdent from the colon farm): thanks, Keeper, I'll play around with it and see if I find it useful. Thanks for the heads up on the lack of warning and the vote of confidence re: being an editor in good standing. Dusti, no worries n the IE -- I don't use it. I'm a fan of Firefox myself and hoping soon to get a new laptop that's more functional than my current one. I have a list of talk pages that are long and/or have extensive images that are on my personal "Don't even think about it" list when at home. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 00:41, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I've actually commented that rollback really is WP:NBD because anyone can add Twinkle and that has its own rollback. Twinkle doesn't work for everyone, but it doesn't require approval to use. Enigma ^message Review 00:45, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I was more curious because discussions about it -- people wanting it, people using it, talking about Rollback edits, etc. had been all over and I'm a curious Sagittarian :) I find Friendly to be a bit cooler than Twinkle -- useful for welcomes and article tagging. I don't do much in the way of vandal patrol outside my watchlist so my need to roll back vandalism is limited. We'll see. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 03:20, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Tressym

Hello! :) In March, Tressym was nominated for deletion. At the time, there was no suitable page for this article to be redirected to, so based on the consensus, you deleted the article. I have created a new page, List of Advanced Dungeons & Dragons 2nd edition monsters, which would be a proper destination to merge and/or redirect the article to. I'm wondering if it's possible to restore the original article, and turn it into a redirect, thus preserving the edit history? Thanks!  :) BOZ (talk) 04:46, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Hey there BOZ! Just a quick question first, I went to the list you created (Wow, that's comprehensive!), and did a search for the term "Tressym" and noticed that it isn't used anywhere in that list. I'm a D&D n00b, but generally, a redirect is used when the subject to be redirected appears in the parent article or list. Did I miss it? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:42, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

It isn't there yet - as comprehensive as the lists are, they hardly cover everything yet. :) The tressym first appeared in an adventure module, and we haven't gotten around to covering most of those yet. If it will help, I can add the module to the list first? BOZ (talk) 14:45, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

When you get to it, that's fine. I trust you (and again, I know nothing of the topic). I'll create the new redirect in a sec...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:50, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Okie dokie, it's restored and redirected. Good luck with your list! happy editing, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:53, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks!  :) Glad to know I'm trustworthy. :) BOZ (talk) 15:52, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Calling in a favor

To help me in this adoption process, I've visited Wanabe Kate's tool and looked at FGWQPR's edits, however, I haven't been able to see his deleted edits. Can you take a peek and lemme know how those look? Thanks Keep, Dusti^{complain/compliment} 15:51, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

No problem! FGWQPR has exactly one deleted edit. He added a tag to a nonsense article for speedy deletion on April 17th, and the article was speedy deleted shortly thereafter. That's it! Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 15:56, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Wow, that won't be too hard to look through huh? Thanks again! Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:01, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

"Calling in a favor". I'm gonna go out on a limb and say the balance sheet is probably in the other direction. :-) Tan | 39 16:02, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I chuckled at the title too. I don't recall owing him one either... :-) 16:03, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Yea, well, you don't owe me one, as I owe you many.......*sigh* opening a COLD DIET COKE....Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:38, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Can you also take a look at the latest review on my editor review. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 17:14, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the kind words, I have some high hopes for him, but I have a feeling this isn't going to be an easy ride. :) Happy Editing, Dusti^{complain/compliment} 18:15, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Anything you do that is worthwhile is generally by rule not easy. Enjoy it for what it is, I'm sure you'll both do fine. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:17, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

<outdent farm> I know. When I wanted to ask, something was telling me not to, to let him come to me, but I instead had to offer. I'm glad though I did it, for if I ever become an Admin. Also, did you see my request above? About the editor review? Dusti^{complain/compliment} 18:19, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Nope, I'd missed it - going there now...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:20, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Hmmm. I've been reading and reading trying to see what Blackzeppelin was doing so terribly wrong that he warranted a AIV report by you. He is by no stretch of the imagination "a vandalism only account". His talkpage is littered with impersonal warnings from you. He was attempting to cleanup up disambiguation pages, hardly controversial. Maybe not agreed on, but surely not vandalism. In hindsight, I hope you realize that a personal talkpage message to him asking "what are you attempting to accomplish, and can I help?" would have gone a long way to welcoming a new user. You also rolled back some of his contribs that were not obvious vandalism, which you know now is a big rollback no-no. (Again, it was 4 days ago, I'm not worried about this). This all happened back on the 18th. I did notice that you've also apologized to him today the 22nd, after his post to your editor review, which is good. However, I don't like the bit you put in there on his talkpage that reminds him to stay civil, after you posted that many templates. (I hate user warning templates, though they are a necessary evil, I try not to use them and prefer manually typing a response or concern - you get a better reaction, and its just less bitey). In fact, your apology was really just more warnings in the end. I think his editor review of you is a tad harsh, yes, but not incivil by any means. He simply said what he thought after his intereactions with you, which were honestly how he felt. I would recommend not removing it from your editor review. (I won't say cheers, I know you hate that when I'm being a jerk friend...) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:54, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I sorta researched this a bit too and agree with Keep, although I'm not even sure I'd be as forgiving. This did not warrant an AIV. His review of you, while obviously biased, is far from incivil. However, being a third party, I'll end my observations here. Tan | 39 19:01, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

(Sorry to keep the orange bar going Keeper, but to keep this centralised). I also agree with Keeper. Sorry Dusti, I think you were way off target on this one. Best thing is to drop a note on Blackzeppelin's talk to try and generate some positive conversation, and retain him/her as an editor. sorry Dusi, and I know you did this in good faith, but I think a "let's move on" note might be handy here. Pedro :  Chat  19:08, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I want to thank all above for the input. At the time, as I explained to someone somewhere, I thought the actions were vandalism. Later that day I saw that the actions weren't vandalism, but got sidetracked and didn't get around to apologize to him. As keeper says, now its just water under the bridge. I just don't know how to take the Review though, I mean, I don't know. I'll try to talk to him and work this out. I just wanted some input from someone other than myself. Thanks, Dusti^{complain/compliment} 19:44, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

His review of you isn't doing any harm. I'd probably just sigh and let it go. Typically, trying to "fix" situations like this just increase the drama factor. Tan | 39 19:58, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

When I said "fix" I meant to apologize and let it go. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 20:01, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

As always Dusti, your willingness to have your contributions and actions reviewed by your peers, regardless of the outcome, is very encouraging to me. I appreciate you bringing this forward and your civil and contrite responses. Happy editing, (and Cheers!) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:17, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

My RFA

Thanks--Kumioko (talk) 22:22, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

You're absolutely welcome. Glad you've stuck around. RfA is a bitch. You have about a bazillion more positive contributions to the encyclopedia than I'll ever have (I'm more of a policy wonk, never been much of a writer), if you are ever getting grief over anything as a content writer from some ridiculous admin, let me know. I'll do battle for you! I find defending content writers against fringe-ists, over zealous admins, etc, to be my specialty (see User:Malleus Fatuarum for example). I'll never be a content writer, but I'll defend them by all means possible, as they are the only reason anyone is even able to type here. I'll fight for you till the end if needed, you've proven to me that you are a worthy addition to this insane website. Why? Because you are a content writer, and because you are not an admin. (although you should be)... Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 22:27, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Hey, did someone call? I wondered why my nose was twitching. Keeper's quite right, so you're in safe hands. I would very likely have left wikipedia by now had it not been for his support. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 22:59, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah, shucky darns, I'm blushing. Go GA/FA something would you? What are you doing on a talkpage? What a waste of time, Malleus...:-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 23:02, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm just taking a short break from the John Frederick Bateman article. Got to get back now and review soap production in Palestine. So I'll leave you alone for now. ;-) --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 23:09, 22 April 2008 (UTC)

Question

What's a Unique Page?[1] I don't think I've ever heard of that before.--KojiDude ^{(Contributions)} 01:57, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, this guy is rather unique, I suppose that would count?  :-) Seriously, in the context you are asking, where an editor has "17000 edits to 9000 unique pages" simply means that they have a diverse level of contributions and make a few smaller edits to each page rather than dozens or even hundreds of edits within one article. Nothing more. It's I'm assuming, meant to show that the candidate has "been around" long enough to know how to work this place's magic. Hence my support. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:25, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah, I get it now. Thanks for clearing that up for me.--KojiDude ^{(Contributions)} 15:16, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Are you ready?

I'm going to go comment on some AFD's if your up for it today. Oh, and about your comment above, I love criticism, let's me see where I am, both positivley and negativley. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:08, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I'll be watching for the new afd list on your subpage - go to town! Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:09, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

i've got an issue on my hands. My adoptee incorrectly nominated an article for AFD, as it can be tagged as {{db-bio}} . I wish to close the AFD, he wishes to close the AFD and just tag the article as such above. Per your ban, I can't do this, so could you delete the article and/or the AFD?. Thanks, Dusti^{complain/compliment} 17:12, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

 Done Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:16, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, I was really close to closing it and leaving a nice message, but the block scared me enough to come to you. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 17:17, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

You have chosen wisely....  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:20, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I have completed my AFD list. Only four today. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 17:32, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Redirect Question

Hiya! Quick question, Mccafe has two re-directs. I can understand why the accent might not be a good thing per WP:UE, however is there any good reason for it not being at McCafe which is proper capitalization? There's nothing on talk but I have no idea how to go about undoing a re-direct and moving Mccafe there. Help? Pointer in the right direction? Thanks TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 16:42, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Is the correct title McCafe or McCafé? (and I agree, it's not Mccafe...) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:49, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

And actually, looking at the McDonald's website, you can see the accent in the logo. McCafé it is (he answers himself...)Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:51, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

And now it's done! The page is called McCafé, and McCafe and Mccafe redirect there. You weren't able to do it yourself because moving the page required deleting the old redirect first. If you are interested in deleting redirects in order to title pages properly, please add yourself to this page after passing one of these. Let me know when you'd like a nomination.  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:55, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks! I wasn't sure if it was something that even could be done. Glad to know it wasn't something I could have done easily without pestering :) . I knew it had an accent, I just am not intricately familiar with WP:UE and when we use accents, etc. It's on my list of things to brush up on before asking for that nom. You'll definitely be the one I ask when I'm ready. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 17:04, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

The basic rule of thumb, for corporation assigned names and official logos, is to have the article title match whatever the corporation decided was the name. McDonald's decided that McCafé was the legal name. No one in their right mind will type that in a search box, so it makes it inherently reasonable to set up probable redirects (Mccafe, and McCafe). Easy as McPie! (I prefer the cherry to the apple, only one McBuck for 2 McLovehandles...mmmmm....drooool....) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:18, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Quit making me hungry ;) I gave the article a bath -- reading the sources made me even hungrier. I don't know if we have any here in NY but I've had them in Australia. I OD'ed on McDs the first time in Japan, barely touched it since. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 17:45, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Subject Matter Expert

I created a page in my sandbox to show an idea I have for creating a Page or project to identify wikipedians as Subject Matter experts or near experts on a given subject. Right now its just one bigpage but if it takes off it could be multiple pages and or projects. The basic concept is that if I am knowledgable about Math, Science, Wikipedia policy, speaking greek or whatever I can put my name under the category or categories I am interested in participating in and if someone has a question or needs help relating to that subject they can go to that page and contact one of them on their talk page. Its still a very rough idea and right now I based the page on the Logistics page of the Military history project but I see this changing into somethin much bigger. If you don't mind take a look and let me know what you think. Maybe theres something out there already and I just don't know about it.--Kumioko (talk) 17:25, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Right off the bat, I like the idea. For your reading: Wikipedia:Expert editors, which was rejected, and a newer version, aptly named Wikipedia:Expert editors/New draft, is being mulled around (although not edited for months, so probably a dying effort). Maybe you can cop some ideas out of those? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:29, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks, those help and give me some more ideas. Do you happen to know why they weren't well received?--Kumioko (talk) 18:00, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

No sorry, don't know the history there. I never contributed to either. I think the first one has a link to a "debate", or perhaps the talkpages of the two links would give some discussion with opposition? Knowing who/why/how someone opposes means your stab can head those off to some degree. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:02, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Aren't the problems with this obvous? Who, apart from you yourself, would agree that you were an expert in anything at all? What does "expert" mean anyway, never mind "near expert"? --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 19:31, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I think one of the problems, as you are alluding to, Malleus, is credentialing. Brings back all kinds of Essjay type memories. In fact, probably why it's been kaboshed before. Still an interesting idea. Did you look at Kumioko's sandbox? It's actually a bit different then the older proposals, meaning its vounteer only. A big fat disclaimer on the top that says "unverified experts" would suffice to counteract blatantly lying volunteers. Certainly would need a lot of work before I supported it though, to be honest. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 19:47, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

What other changes do you suggest?--Kumioko (talk) 21:10, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

The Essjay episode was in my mind, yes. --Malleus Fatuorum (talk) 21:27, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

AfD for Incheol shin

If the subject was the same person as this: http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=Incheol+shin&hl=en&lr=&btnG=Search he or she is probably notable. I wish that people would do a Google Scholar search before nominating an article about an academic for AfD, no matter how weak the original article is. --Eastmain (talk) 17:32, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

hmm. Actually I agree with you. Is there a way to verify if this is the same person? I'm not a subject expert, which of the links have you looked at, Eastmain? Are there any that could be useful as reliable sources? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:35, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

And actually, I'll go one step further. I'll consider this a contested speedy, and restore the article's history, to let the Afd run its course. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:41, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thank you. --Eastmain (talk) 18:47, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

No thank you, Eastmain! If you hadn't taken the time to post to me as deleting admin, I would have never given this a second thought, which would've been to the detriment of Wikipedia, at least based on how the debate is going!. I take full responsibility for deleting too fast and without research, and this has served as a good reminder to me to slow down in CSDs. Gracias - Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 19:03, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I like the way the debate is going :-). Seems that it could be kept. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 19:07, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

My Talk Page

Maybe its time to unprotect it? What do you think? Dusti^{complain/compliment} 18:46, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

It is unprotected. I set a expiration time, the protection expired days ago.  :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:47, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Don't believe me? Check the log Expired 4/16. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:48, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

• Blush* Time for a diet coke. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 18:49, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for that, could you also delete my user subpages aswell? But leave the talk archives if thats okay. Thanks and goodbye :-) TheProf - T / C 20:09, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Consider it done. If you want them back, let me know, I'll gladly restore them. If I might ask, what exactly tipped you over the edge? Feel free to vent if you need to, my talk page or yours...Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:11, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Without digging here, this seems a regretable loss of an editor ? Pedro :  Chat  20:15, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Absolutely regrettable. I've looked through his recent contribs, don't see anything appalling, but maybe I'm missing it. Seems to have been going along rather nicely. I've asked for clarification on his talkpage, but I suppose people leave all the time. His subpages, which I just deleted, were actually quite nice. I laughed at his "funnies", and saw in more ways than one a dedicated editor. Tis a shame really, not sure what happened. Hopefully, he'll be reading this still and clarify; if not, I wish him good will and good luck. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:17, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

(ec)Basically, I've encounterd too many unfriendly admins. Most admins have been great, like yourself, however some have simply assumed bad faith of me and others have been down right nasty! The fact that the vandal fighting is a losing battle doesnt help either. Real-life issues are also a factor. I just need to step back from it all! I will still make a few small edits under my IP, if i feel its needed. Again, thank you very much for your help :-) TheProf07 (talk) 20:19, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks to Pedro as well. Wikipedia is not a lost cause, but i still feel the need to leave. Again thanks to everyone for their concern. TheProf07 (talk) 20:19, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. Wishing you the best. If you ever decide to write under "prof" instead of IP, again I'll assert that you've done a lot of great work around here, and I'd be happy to undelete your subpages/userpage if you'd like them back. Best of luck to you, sorry for the troubles from admins. I personally gave up serious vandal fighting a long time ago, because while I find it to be a worthy cause, it is really really really draining and depressing. The only "vandal fighting" I do now is stuff in my watchlist. Just to say, I know what you mean about it being a neverending battle. Cheers, good editor, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:23, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I've deleted TheProf's User and Talk page. As stated by the esteemed Keeper, these can easily be recovered. My best wishes in whatever you move on to, and again I echo Keeper's regrets that we loose you. Pedro :  Chat  20:28, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

What did you delete? I'm missing it. The talk pages (including archives) shouldn't be deleted, and in fact Prof said not to. Maybe I'm being daft? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:30, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

the talk page is still there. --Tikiwont (talk) 20:33, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

(ec)If you want to do me a favour, you could look after the All Grown Up! article for me! It's an article that i'd hate to see vandalised because i stopped looking after it. (also, the Dil Pickles article, List of All Grown Up! characters and List of All Grown Up! episodes articles) It would be appreciated. Again thanks :-) TheProf07 (talk) 20:31, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Cheers Pedro TheProf07 (talk) 20:31, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

I've watchlisted all 4 bluelinks, I'll keep my eye on em for obvious stuff (although I know nothing of the subject matter, I can easily revert things like "All Grown Up is teh gay!" and it's ilk. Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:36, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah, confusion. Is TheProf87 the same person (tagged with U1's)? [2] refers. Pedro :  Chat  20:37, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Lightbulb! There it is! Prof87 used to redirect to Prof07, (see the history (sorry admin only at this point) of User:TheProf87 and you'll see were it was redirected a while ago. So essentially you deleted the redirects. All's well in keeperland. I didn't notice the redirects when I was U1-ing...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:41, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah! That explains it. I saw them at C:CSD so just went ahead as proper U1 requests. Pedro :  Chat  20:45, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry fellas, TheProf87 was my alt. account. No harm done i hope (if you're wondering why i'm still here, i'm making sure i've tied up all loose ends) Cheers TheProf07 (talk) 20:48, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

No harm at all. Again, best wishes for the future. Pedro :  Chat  20:50, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

<outdent, too many colons>I think between Pedro and I we've some how muddled/managed to delete all of your subpages for "07" and "87", at least what I could find. The only page intact at this point is your "07" talkpage, which by precedent should probably stay intact as well as your archives. If you'd like though, you can certainly blank the talkpages if you prefer not to receive well wishes or other talkpage messages. Your choice. Wishing you well, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:52, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Heh, nevermind, I see now that you already did what I suggested. Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 20:55, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

(ec)Yes, i'd like my talk page and archives to stay :-) And i welcome any messages of support there. I just wont be archiving anymore. Yet again, thanks to you, Pedro and Tikiwont (hope you see this Tiki) for all your help and support. TheProf07 (talk) 20:56, 23 April 2008 (UTC)

Islander just deleted the talk page. ? Enigma ^message 17:24, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Thanks

Thank you for voting in my RfA, which passed with 194 supporting, 9 opposing, and 4 neutral. Your kindness and constructive criticism is very much appreciated. I look forward to using the tools you have granted me to aid the project. I would like to give special thanks to Tim Vickers, Anthony and Acalamari for their nominations. Thank you again, VanTucky

The difference

There's a huge difference between trying to talk someone out of suicide, since that still leaves the ultimate decision in their hands, and forcibly preventing him from killing himself, which is the inevitable outcome when "the authorities" are brought in. The latter is unacceptable. The fact is, an individual owns his life, and he is perfectly entitled to kill himself if he so chooses.

Your stance amounts to little more than "father-knows-best"ism, which is frankly despicable. I am not a megalomaniac; I do not claim to know what's best for others, just as I expect others not to claim to know what's best for me. Kurt Weber (Go Colts!) 02:10, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

As for minors...well, minors are a different matter, as always. I'm talking about adults. Convince and cajole all you want; just don't force. Kurt Weber (Go Colts!) 02:14, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

My stance makes me a megalomaniac? I'm despicable?? You are a daft fool Kurt to post this tripe on my talk page. You have obviously never been affected by suicide. I pray earnestly that you, someone as thick as you seem to be portraying yourself, never has to go through what my family has gone through. My relative was an adult. He put a shotgun under his jaw and blew his fucking brains out in the woods. He wasn't found for 3 fucking months. Why did he do it? Because his girlfriend of 2 months broke up with him. What I wish more than anything is that some "authority" had heard a cry for help from him. Had forced him to have a beer, get drunk out of his mind, and pass out till morning. Tied him to his bed. Took his fucking shotgun away, and his car keys. That's what I wish would have happened. For my own selfish reasons? Hell no. For his good, not mine. This was several years ago now. Do you honestly think that if he were alive he'd be worse off? That he'd still be upset about his fucking girlfriend? You are obviously not a father Kurt, or you would know with certainty that sometimes father does know best. A father is the guy that's been there before and knows that it will work out with time, no need to splatter a tree. I've read your userpage. If any of it's true, I feel sorry for those that are under your tutelage. You've got a lot of growing up to do before you can start throwing around this garbage on public forums. I'm a libertarian as well, by the way. Have been for years. The fact that you can call yourself a libertarian and have such a disregard for human life at the same time makes me want to puke. I will not have this on any part of Wikipedia that I visit. You are not welcome to post this vile. If I see anything from your username on a publicly viewed talkpage, project page, noticeboard, or anything of that sort that carries your opinion of "go ahead and kill yourself, its your right", I will delete the post on sight. Over and over and over again if I have to. I will not use admin tools to do this, but consider yourself "friendly warned" against using Wikipedia as your soapbox. This is not your soapbox - bring your daft, uninformed, inexperienced, illfounded, wrong opinions back to your blog. Do not disrupt this place again with your garbage. If an IP posts an "I'm going to kill myself", and sees your garbage, it will be on your head not mine. For the good of the community, I urge anyone to delete on sight anything from Kurt or anyone else that says "go for it". Smug prick. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 13:49, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm sorry to hear about your relative, Keeper. I fully and wholeheartedly support your statement and believe that you hold the right position; compassion. Stay safe, my friend. Scarian^{Call me Pat!} 08:58, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Keeper, you're a good person, and a valued editor; but the "disregard for human life" you speak of seems to me to be at the heart of the libertarian philosophy, at least as practiced and preached by most of the libbies I know. It was explained to me once that if I thought that a person who was going to fall off a cliff had a right to be thrown a rope by somebody standing nearby with a rope, then I wasn't fit to be a libertarian, because the person who owned that rope had the sole right to decide what was done with that rope. I agreed with them wholeheartedly; I wanted no part of such a belief system. --Orange Mike | Talk 14:06, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Sorry for the butting in, and obviously this is a sensitive topic, but can we just write this off as a difference in outlook without passing judgement? From what little I know of Kurt, he builds his beliefs up step by step in a rational philosophical fashion. He's gotten to where he is by years of this. He's unlikely to be swayed. I'm sure we can all agree that suicide is a tragedy and it's better when people are there to help keep it from happening. The issue of whether you have an ethical duty to prevent it is a niggling little detail, suitable for discussion over a beer. But in the grand scheme of life, it's a small issue. Friday (talk) 14:11, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Friday, in the grand scheme of life, the duty to protect life is a small issue? That's rather daft as well. I'm also a Libertarian. I'm sorry OrangeMike you've had bad experiences with Libertarians. Kurt does not represent true Libertarianism, his level of extremism has nothing to do with political philosophy. Also, I have made no assertions here, on his talk, or anywhere else that I was entertaining the idea of changing his mind. He needs to have a mind before it can be changed. I merely told him to shut the fuck up about it on Wikipedia, and that I would delete any such tripe where I felt it was harmful to this project, namely, anywhere on this project. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:21, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Some advice...

I've been busy lately, so not very proactive on this but the activity at WP:N/CA is...well, zero. Not sure what to do with it now, really. I'm not sure I can claim consensus for it as a guideline (many supports, but a limited number of !votes overall) but...well, I don't know! Any thoughts? Fritzpoll (talk) 12:20, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Hey Fritzpoll, sorry I've been "distracted" as well. I'll look into how to move something from proposed to guideline. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:23, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

User:Stifle marked it as rejected, but has agreed that I can re-tag it as active if we can generate more interest. (S)he didn't beleive that we'd reached consensus either. Fritzpoll (talk) 14:41, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Just noticed that as well (edit conflict here with you :-) Not sure why it was rejected, other than the relative lack of activity. Hmmm. Let me know your thoughts FP, this one might have to be chalked up to silence = apathy = no consensus. We'll hafta muddle through the next unfortunate AfD when it inevitably crops up. Makes me not want to watch the news, so I don't know the names, so I don't search for them on wiki....Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 14:44, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Just depends on whether or not we managed to advertise it widely enough - the problem is that most people came, saw it, and then either endorsed it (mostly) or opposed it. If there was more we could have done to get people coming to see it and form a consensus (even to reject) that would, in my mind, be better than it dying off because few people saw it Fritzpoll (talk) 15:04, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Yeah, I was just thinking that to, but I'm not sure where else it could've be posted or could still be posted that it hasn't. If, by posting a notice of an upcoming change on "everyone telephone poll in the neighborhood", we get that little of a response,my reluctant hunch is that it apparently isn't of enough concern to enough editors to warrant a change in the notability guideline. People saw the posts. They may/may not have clicked on the discussion. Some discussed, but not enough put in an effort towards reaching a consensus. Sigh. If it's of any consolation, just taking the time and effort to process this issue in collaboration with this many other editors, has only made your arguments stronger for the next AfD, perhaps enough to sway a discussion the appropriate way. Again, a small consolation. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 15:09, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Well, the way I see it, Wikipedia is all about consensus, and the consensus here was that the community was apathetic to the proposal and implicitly rejected it. All I've lost is time, and I've plenty of that! :) It was a valuable exercise for me ( and bolstered my project space edits - I'm joking!) and fun to interact with people. I'm sure we'll cross paths again soon - thanks for all the help Fritzpoll (talk) 15:13, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Are you getting used to these orange messge bars?

I need help with my archive again, new archive page, bot not archiving, dates also aren't being archived as I wish. I want to begin archiving in Archive 3 (April - June) and all threads older than 2 days. Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:36, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Lovin the orange bars. Sorry I can't be of much help with archives, I have a really simple one that isn't date specific, just age of thread. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:40, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Anyone watching this page have a clue? Thanks for nothing keeper (just kidding) :) Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:45, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Did you just spam my talkpage asking other people to help? No you didnt....:-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:46, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Batta bang batta boom! Yep, I did.....come one... block me lol (seriously though, dont) Dusti^{complain/compliment} 16:49, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

S/he is on wikibreak until 4.28 but Krellis helped me and perhaps can help you too. I'm adept at c/p, not too much beyond that with archiving. Oh and Keeper, the Twinkies can have Latrine back if he'd help you, he's quite useless for us. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 16:53, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

heh, you can have him. He did play well for the Twins though, although there seems to be some consistency with players becoming quite subpar, useless even, once having a New York Spotlight in their eyes...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 16:58, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

You missed the best ones, Kevin Brown and Kenny Rogers! Dougie Alphabet is excused, I think he would have had a very good season if not for his injury. BTW, do you userfy deleted articles? I can't find the category for those who do and I've pestered DGG enough lately for copies o:) If you do, I'd love Brunswick Computer Museum because I think I found it in a new name, I'm just not sure. If you don't, no worries TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 17:03, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Done! Keep in mind though, the deletion discussion was a unanimous delete as a probable hoax. You have an uphill battle with it! Can be found here: User:Travellingcari/Brunswick Computer Museum. Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:09, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Oh yuck, completely not what I thought it was -- which was the American Computer Museum, which used to be in the town of Brunswick/Princeton but now is in Bozeman, Montana. That can definitely go back from whence it came as a very likely hoax. I don't know that it's a likely search term for ACM, thoughts on that? TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 17:15, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Pfffftt!!! That made me laugh out loud. Put it back out of its misery. Any more ridiculous requests? You want me to delete LaTroy Hawkins? Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:19, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Probably not a likely search term since it's not in that town anymore. You and a handful of other museumgeeks can find the right article without it. :-) Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:21, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Need to find what I said to Brew on the topic of museums. Ahh yes, he called me a museum freak and I said I wasn't a freak but rather a geek :) Best thing about the museums? Infintissimal drama quotient. No one is that passionate to get into edit wars over museums. No more ridiclous for the moment ;) I'd rather delete LaTrine from the Yankee roster, but sadly we cannot. TRAVELLINGCARI^{My story}_{Tell me yours} 17:35, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

12.39.2.83

This IP address user had a short-block message from February that he wants to blank out. Is he within his rights? Presumably he doesn't "own" that IP address. Or does he? [3] Never mind the smart-aleck remarks he made on my page. I just want to be sure of what the policy is rather than get into some stupid revert war over a talk page. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 16:59, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Assuming it's the same person, the message is rather stale, certainly doesn't need to stay there. Assuming it's a different person/reassigned IP, the message is irrelevant, doesn't need to stay there. Bigger better battles await, for example, if said IP decides to contribute in other "constructive" ways. Let him/her have his/her blank talkpage...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:02, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Roger. A bit off-track, the Twins have been having trouble scoring runs this year, and somehow I'm reminded of a scene from early in Bull Durham. Do you know what I might be referring to? Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 17:10, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

The Twins have trouble scoring runs every year it seems. Such is my life. They always have good fundamentals though, and get rid of the hotshots when they need to tone it down. I wouldn't have it any other way. As for Bull Durham, haven't seen that flick in ages, so know, I don't know the reference. In fact, I've purposefully tried very hard to forget all of Kevin Costner's "movies". Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:15, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Just this punch line from the manager: "Well, what do we need a scoreboard for? We haven't scored any runs all year!" Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 17:18, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Where is Dennis Hocking now that they need him? Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 17:19, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

File:DAP Bull 890625.JPG

The old bull from Durham Athletic Park

A little DAP'll do ya. Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} 17:22, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

TheProf07 (talk · contribs) block

If the user requests another review, I request that you handle it and I'll accept your choice either way. I was originally a "fan" of this user, but his counterproductive behavior is escalating. - CobaltBlueTony™ _talk 17:04, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

He's requested no more unblocks. I consider myself to be a bit too involved myself. If he continues, it should perhaps be left to a wider audience at WP:RFU. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:17, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

And obviously looking at the block log, TheProf decided to go out "in style", in a disruptive, attacking, and rather immature fashion. Changed my mind, changed temp block to indef block. Bye Prof. Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 17:35, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Please see my posting to Cobaltblue's talk page re: TheProf. This was very personal between TheProf and Scion?. The vandalism was wrong, but this kid was pushed; and he was good and helpful. It's too bad, and is not fair. Scion (sp?) was hassleing me just today and all I was doing was posting source info to a talk page. I went to Cobaltblue for help and he did help. Scion holds a grudge; and it pushed this kid over the edge. Too bad. Kek15 (talk) 18:27, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Seicer (talk · contribs), not Scion. - CobaltBlueTony™ _talk 18:31, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Ah, I was wondering who Scion was...Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:54, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

FYI, Keeper, you may want to take a look over at John Reaves talk page - having labeled TheProf an out-and-out vandal, he's now restored his talk page, and blocked him from emailing. No denying that TheProf behaved appallingly, and an indef-block was probably justified, but I'm starting to get a picture what pushed him over the edge... at the very least, I see no problems honouring his request to delete his talk page, but I would value your input. _TalkIslander 18:33, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Scrub that, John Reaves has re-deleted it. Case closed... perhaps... if the wind is blowing in the right direction, and the phase of the moon is just right... _TalkIslander 18:37, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

I'm leaving it alone. Seems to be water under the bridge, unless as you say, TheProf continues to email you. I actually agree that at this point, TheProf would be better served to stay away for at least a few days, and honor his intention to stay away. If/when he decides to come back, there will be some atonement necessary (to Seicer at the very least). Let me know if anything new comes up, otherwise I'm leaving this. Cheers, Keeper | 76 | Disclaimer 18:54, 24 April 2008 (UTC)