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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Chronographos (talk | contribs) at 17:17, 29 August 2005 (Μπράβο αστροπελέκι μου εσύ). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Welcome; edit summaries

thanks for signing up, and welcome to Wikipedia. You will find that more polite edit summaries will do wonders for the chances of survival of your edits. Anyway, while Decius may sound aggressive with his threats against nationalists (not without provocation, I would add), he is entirely correct about scholarly opinion on ancient Macedon. So, if you want to have any effect on the Macedon article, you will have to cite recent academic research questioning or attacking the established view. dab () 09:49, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

well, afaik, the common classification of the ancient Macedonian language has nothing to do with a compromise between Greek and FYROM nationalists. It's simply what linguists came up with based on the glosses. If you have specific points you want to make, simply bring them up at Talk:Ancient Macedonian language, preferably referencing printed publications. As for Hellenic vs. Greek, if they are synonymous, how can using either be wrong? We do have Hellenes and Greek (name), and as far as I can see the information therein is correct, so it doesn't take a terrific amount of education to know about these names, you simply have to find, and read, their articles. regards, dab () 14:52, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I know the "standard meaning of Hellenic", it's just that I sometimes use it to include languages that were close to the Greek dialects, but not close enough to be the same language. See Talk:Stobi where about a month ago I explained how I sometimes use Hellenic. I use Hellenic sometimes because there is no other term to use, though I realize the way I use it sometimes is confusing. But it's not completely inaccurate. Hellenic in my English dictionary can mean "of or relating to the ancient Greeks or their language"---since Macedonian was related to Greek to a degree, I feel that I can use the term Hellenic to apply it to them, to a degree: the problem is, Hellenic also can mean specifically "Greek", which is not accurate to describe the ancient Macedonians, just as the Dutch are not Germans, though they are Germanic. I know about the origin of the term Hellene, which is common knowledge, and also I know the origin of obscure ancient Greek terms like "Karkinoi" (who were attendants of Hephaistos) if you want to get into trivia. Decius 15:56, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I suppose German, Dutch, and Danish are all just "dialects" of each other too, then, and not separate languages. I sometimes choose to use "Hellenic" the way "Germanic" or "Teutonic" is used, so don't get worked up. Decius 16:02, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You seem to realize that Hellenic is also a more loose term, that is why you prefer to change it to Greek. Or else it shouldn't matter to you if Hellenic is used instead. Decius 16:12, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The fact that FYROM Slavs take advantage of the uncertainty surround the ancient Macedonians is really not my problem, and that problem should be addressed to them. I'm just trying to make sure that the true history of Macedon is represented. To me, the fantasy-history that the Macedonian Slav nationalists have created is irrelevant: Macedonian was not at all close to Slavic, and the language was already extinct by the time the Slavs came, so they have no case in trying to make the slightest connection, and no serious scholar considers what they have to say anyway. Decius 16:34, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I don't hate my country.

Really. You mistook my harsh critisism of the Greek attitude for hate. I love Greece. I've just had enough with

1. the Greek attidude: "ela mwre, den bariesai, mhn to skeftesai" - "Oxi, re, 8elw na to skeftwmai!" "Kai ti egine poy exei 200 eurw h DSL? Emeis pernoume ta lefta mas apo to dhmosio? PW PW PW ENAS KOLOS!!!! Alla poy na paw na ths thn pesw, prepei na exei parei ena syntagma sto mouni ths! Ti elega? Ti mas les twra oti phges fantaros kai den plhrwnwsouna 16 mhnes? kai? Emeis na eimaste kala! den gamiete..."

2. the partisan hacks we percieve as politicians today.


Greek people are living in a dream, dude. We got to wake up. that's all. We're head-high in shit and dept, but we insist on kissing every fucking politician's shit-staned underware to get into the Public Sector (Dhmosio).

Later! And welcome to wikipedia! :D Don't forget to list yourself in the Greek Wikipedians page!

Project2501a 22:50, 12 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Childish comment

You childish response to Dab at [1] does not bode well for your future credibility on Wikipedia. Don't be surprised if people start treating you with suspicion.--Wiglaf 09:34, 14 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I see you've been doing it for some time. Did you call him gay then too? Lectiodifficilior

I think you're forgetting that my 'childish comment' was the answer to a personal insult (which I simply ignored). As for being treated with suspicion, if it concerns people who are already suspected by myself, then I couldn't care less. Miskin

I never insulted you personally. Your editing behaviour was poor from the beginning, and is getting poorer, I am sorry to say. Experience shows that such a pattern takes you nowhere, on Wikipedia, but it's up to you. Just bring us your references, anything else is just tedious for everybody involved. My view of the subject may be changed totally, with a single good reference, I don't pretend to be an expert, and I may well have missed an important point. My view will not be changed by childish bickering, and my expectations that you'll provide anything useful eventually aren't exactly increased by it either. dab () 10:31, 15 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]


Alexander the Great

Hi, I saw the dispute in this article and talked to User:Lectiodifficilior. You can see what I proposed on his talk page.

Regards,
Gilgamesh he 10:23, 25 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the NPOV intervention. User:Lectiodifficilior is prejudiced against everything I say.

Miskin

Please see my new proposal in the talk page. This dispute is leading us to a shameful article. Modern politics have to stay away from the article. Gilgamesh he 20:20, 28 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Greek language articles

Your suggestion for a better-organised series of articles looks good. I'll be happy to help out, time and my limited knowledge permitting! rossb 12:31, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Cuisine of Greece

Hi, I guess Miskin = 134.157.116.130?

Ouzo is a distilled beverage with anise, which clouds when water is added. This is essentially the same as Turkish raki or Arab arak. Of course, in Greece, "raki" means something else, namely an unflavored distilled beverage, also called tsikoudia, and similar to Italian grappa. But I think it is correct to say that Greek ouzo, Turkish raki, and Arab arak are basically similar, despite differences.

As for Greek cooking being "Mediterranean" rather than "Middle Eastern", I don't agree. Yes, Greek cooking has commonalities with other Mediterreanean cooking, e.g. Turkish türlü = Greek briami / tourlou = French ratatouille = Catalan escalivada ... not exactly the same of course. But it has even more in common with Middle Eastern cooking. Think of both the dishes and the names: giouvetsi, moussaka, doner / gyros, souvlaki / shish kebab, tzatziki, keftes, kima. Yes, there is pastitsio (pasticcio) from Italy, but most of the dishes come from the east.... --Macrakis 16:59, 14 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Apantao sta anglika dioti i sizitisi axizi na katalavenete ap olous...

I agree that souvlaki/shish kebab, etc. are not typical Greek home cooking -- but I don't think they're correctly classified as "tourist" cooking, either. They are the typical food of markets -- traditional fast food as it were. As for tourlou, yuvarlakia, etc. I certainly consider them typical home cooking -- at least in my home! I'm not sure which "real" Greek cooking based on seafood and meat you're talking about that's Medterranean but not Middle Eastern. There are certainly Middle Eastern dishes that are not Greek, but then they are not universally Middle Eastern, either: falafel is Egyptian, tabbouleh is Lebanese, etc. Greek cooking is pretty widely accepted as part of Middle Eastern cooking -- take a look at the M.E. cookbooks. On the other hand, Mediterranean cooking isn't even very well defined as a concept: what do Moroccan, Catalan, Genoese, Sicilian, and Lebanese cooking have in common? --Macrakis 19:10, 15 Jun 2005 (UTC)

"Μακεδόνες"

Μια μικρή υπενθύμιση για την ψηφοφορία που διεξάγεται στο http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Macedonian_Slavs#The_poll. Χωρίς την ψήφο μας, θα επικρατήσει το "Μακεδόνες". Με δεδομένη την όλο και ευρύτερη χρήση του Wiki σε όλο τον κόσμο, αξίζει τον κόπο να μην το επιτρέψουμε. Απλά και μόνο για το γαμώτο της υπόθεσης.

Notifying

You might want to notify User:Ninio and User:Vergina (though Vergina has a bad rep)about the poll also, etc. Decius 12:03, 16 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Ρε συ, μιλάς ποδανά?

Σύρμα, λακαμά, μας την πέσανε τα δαπαλλό! Τι ομάδα είσαι (ποδόσφαιρο)? Είσαι σε κανενα φόρουμ οπαδικό? Chronographos 14:58, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Panathinaikos, esy? Den eimai se forum. Syggnomi alla den exo Elliniki grammatoseira edw pera pou vriskomai.

Έλα ρε συμβάζελε! Αν θες γράψου στο φόρουμ των GWF, και 'δοποία με, γαμώ τους Τσουκαλάδες που έχουμε μπλέξει! Chronographos 15:10, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Βαζέχα σε θέλω, γρήγορο, και θα σ'τον κάνω εγώ το νακιμού τον Σορίν Ματέι να τον κλαιν' οι ρέγγες μουέχεχε Chronographos 15:34, 20 Jun 2005 (UTC)
Άντε ρε, γράφτηκες? Με τι νικ?

Syggnomi, eixa fygei apo ton ypologisti. Oraia ta eipes sto arthro "arxaia makedoniki". Exoun parei aera ta malakistiria. Miskin 08:45, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Ήρεμαααααα και τ' αυτιά έχουν τοίχους. Γράφτηκες στο GWF φόρουμ?

Den graftika akoma. Eixa akousta gia ena authentiko makedoniko keimeno kai to epsaxna kairo, opote i paremvasi sou mou irthe kouti. :) Miskin 09:49, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Ναι αλλά πώς θα συννενογιόμαστε και να μη μας παίρνουν σύρμα τα κουτόφραγκα?

Eimai sigouros pos tha yparxoun ki alloi tropoi. :) Miskin 10:52, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Πες έναν!

Sto forum tha mas vlepoun kai asxetoi.

στο φόρουμ έχει και σύστημα ανταλλαγής ιδιωτικών μηνυμάτων! ιρκ δεν έχω. "ΕΛΤΑ" έχω κάμποσα: δοκίμασε το trelomagkas-στο-"καυτό-ταχυδρομείο" ;)

En taksei, m'epeises. Tha grafto kai tha sou po to onoma molis gyriso giati prepei na fygo twra. 134.157.119.194 12:11, 21 Jun 2005 (UTC)

βρε μάλαξ, τι τσαμπουνάς στο άλλο μαγαζί? Δεν παίρνουνε πρέφα νομίζεις? Σβήστα παναθεμά σε! :-ΡΡΡ (Τάκης Φύσσας) Και να τζινάβεις αργκό όπως εγώ γιατί θα μας πάρουν σύρμααααα


Ela more siga. Akoma kai na katalaboune ti peirazei, den eipame kai tipota. Etsi ki allios kseroun pos eimaste kai oi dyo Romioi. Miskin 14:41, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

ΚΑΙ ΤΑ ΑΥΤΙΑ ΕΧΟΥΝ ΤΟΙΧΟΥΣ

Με το δόνπαρ που νωβαίεπεμ και μη ξετετρο, αλλά με τις λακαμίες που τελέ θα σας ρουνπά φαπρέ.Λώστεχαλα και μετεκά ό,τι τεμπορεί, αλλά ωσοπ μελε στη νικισαλο λαχαρααααά!!!Τεαν γειά λινεσβά και μη τεξεχνά, Ρηα, σουθυμι μια ηζω ζιμα σου!!!Ασσεοδυς.

Ουστ, βρωμοσκούληκο :-ΡΡΡΡ (Πλλλλλάκα σε κάνω, φ'λαράκ') :-) Chronographos 12:35, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC) (το αστείο είναι που γράφει ο Μακαρόνιας Μίσκο: γρίκλις "για να μη μας καταλάβουν"!) Ρε Ακάκιε, μην καρφώνεσαι μαμώ τον Παντελή Κωνσταντινίδη μου μέσα!
Με άλλα λόγια, πρέπει να είμαστε Δέλλες και όχι Κολτσίδες στην άμυνα, γιατί στο Champions' League δεν έχει Τεβεκέληδες να κάνουν τα στραβά μάτια στα μπενάλντια  :-) Chronographos 12:53, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Ξέρετε αισθάνομαι λίγο περίεργα γιατί το θέμα, αν δείτε τις συζητήσεις ξεκίνησε από εμένα, όταν είδα τι παπατζιλίκια γράφανε οι τύποι.Ομολογώ πως δεν έχω απεριόριστες γνώσεις στο θέμα (ένα βιβλίο του Μπαμπινιώτη, κανα δυο αρθρα,κτλ), όμως οι τύποι, ειδικά ο ημίαιμος αυστοούγγρος είναι εξαιρετικά αλλαζόνες και προκατειλλημένοι, φτάσανε στο σημείο να μην αναφέρουν καν το κράτος ως ελληνικό.Α! και κάτι άλλο, οι σκοπιανοί σχεδιάζουν να επαναλάβουν τη ψηφοφορία στο μέλλον, οπότε καταλαβαίνετε οτι υπάρχει κίνδυνος να έχουμε άρθρα πχ μακεδόνες,μακεδονική γλώσσα,πολιτισμός κτλ και να αναφέρονται στους γείτονες, να μην πω και για τα άρθα που αφορούν μακεδόνες βασιλείς,τη μακεδονική φάλαγγα,κτλ. Οδυσσέας

Δεν καταλαβαίνω, δηλαδή εδώ μέσα η αλήθεια αποφασίζεται βάσει δημοψηφισμάτων? Chronographos 01:17, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Δεν θα μπορούσα να το θέσω καλύτερα. Ξέρεις εδώ αν υπάρχει διαφωνία λέει κάποιος: Ας ψηφίσουμε! Έτσι αποφασίζονται όλα. Είναι η new age δημοκρατία born in the USA. Ένα σωρό αδαείς και αργόσχολοι αποφασίζουν. Τώρα θα μου πεις, εσύ ρε καραγκιόζη τότε τι ασχολείσαι?Μήπως είσαι και συ αργόσχολος? ή το παίζεις επιστήμονας? Όχι, το site αυτό το βρήκα κατά τύχη και στην αρχή έγραφα για πλάκα, όμως είμαι πεπεισμένος οτι σε site σαν και αυτό βρίσκεται το μέλλον και πως πρέπει όλοι οι έλληνες να κάνουμε κάτι για να προστατευτούμε από υστερόβουλους και να ενημερώσουμε τους ξένους σωστά. Σκέψου μόνο οτι αυτό το site βρίσκεται στα αγαπημένα του νέου internet browser Mozilla Firefox το οποίο κάνεις δωρεάν download και έχει μέχρι στιγμής κάπου 10% της αγοράς, φαντάσου λοιπόν κάθε αμερικανάκι, αγγλάκι κτλ που έχει να κάνει μια εργασία στο σχολείο, έρχεται κατευθείαν εδώ να ψάξει. Ξαναφαντάσου να έχει να γράψει για τη Κλεοπάτρα και να δει στο site οτι μιλούσε μακεδονικά και οτι ήταν μακεδόνισσα και για φαντάσου! υπάρχουν και σήμερα απόγονοι μακεδόνων!! Τρέλα! (και όχι για τον Άρη). Τα πράγματα λοιπόν είναι σοβαρά (θα ανεβούμε κατηγορία του χρόνου? Δύσκολο το βλέπω...και τα οικονομικά... σκατά....) Παρεπιπτόντως μπράβο για την αντιμετώπιση του αυστοούγγρου, τέτοιο πνεύμα χρειάζεται, μακάρι να μπορούσα να σε μιμηθώ αλλά εκνευρίζομαι εύκολα Odysseas 11:33, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Φίλε μου όσο κάνει κουμάντο ο κάθε Σαουρίδης προκοπή δεν θα δεις. Και είναι κρίμα γιατί, αν και βάζελος, την ομάδα του '80 (Κούης, Βένος, Μπαλλής) την λάτρευα. Τέλος πάντων. Ο ημίαιμος που λες, αν μιλάμε για το ίδιο πρόσωπο, δεν μου φαίνεται και τόσο προκατειλημμένος. Κάνω λάθος? Chronographos 12:01, 26 Jun 2005 (UTC)


Poios einai o imiaimos re paidia? Miskin 29 June 2005 04:29 (UTC)

Μουέεεεεεεεεεχεχεχεχεχεχεχεχεχε Chronographos 28 June 2005 10:55 (UTC)

Χρονογράφε, μπορεί να είσαι υπερβολικός ώρες-ώρες, αλλά το χιούμορ σου είναι άπαιχτο. Γέλασα με την ψυχή μου. Άντε, πολύ εξουσία μάς το παίζει τώρα τελευταία το αρωμουνίδιο, τύπου boyar μη χέσω.--Theathenae 29 June 2005 11:26 (UTC)
Δεν ξέρει με τι παλιά πουτάνα έχει μπλέξει, ο ψωμόλυσσας :-}} Chronographos 29 June 2005 11:35 (UTC)
Διάβασες την ετυμολογία μου για τον Δέκιο Μάξιμο Χωρίς-γουρούνια? Μα που τα σκέφτομαι ο παλιο-μπιπ! Chronographos 29 June 2005 11:57 (UTC)
Πού, καλέ;--Theathenae 29 June 2005 13:51 (UTC)
Κοίτα καλύτερα Chronographos 29 June 2005 13:52 (UTC)
Ναι, αλλά πού όμως; Αλήθεια, πού έμαθες τέτοια αγγλικά;--Theathenae 29 June 2005 14:01 (UTC)
Στο τέλος της "Φοινικικής Επιγραφής". Αγγλικά έμαθα στο σχολείο μου. Αργότερα έζησα στην Αμερική, αλλά εκεί χειροτέρεψαν :-} Chronographos 29 June 2005 14:08 (UTC)
Από τα καλά σου, όχι τα καλύτερα. ;)--Theathenae 29 June 2005 14:33 (UTC)

Φίλε Ακάκιε, δεν είσαι στα καλά σου

Τσιμπάς συνεχώς στις παγίδες που σου στήνουν τα δαπαλλό, τους δίνεις επιχειρήματα χωρίς καν να το καταλαβαίνεις, με άλλα λόγια ενώ ισχυρίζεσαι ότι είσαι Παναθηναϊκός, έχεις κλασσική συμπεριφορά γαύρου. Σύνελθε και δούλευε μεθοδικά, μη σε συνέλθω εγώ. Φιλικά, αλλά με ελάχιστη υπομονή: Chronographos 29 June 2005 13:56 (UTC)

Ti ekana o ermos? Miskin 29 June 2005 14:06 (UTC)

Όπως είπα: χωρίς καν να το καταλαβαίνεις. Chronographos 29 June 2005 14:17 (UTC)

Afou den mou eksigeis tha ypotheso pos den yparxei provlima. Miskin 29 June 2005 16:18 (UTC)

Τι να σου εξηγήσω ρε συ, αφού πας και τα μαρτυράς από μόνος σου. Δεν είναι εδώ κατάλληλο μέρος. ΚΑΙ ΤΑ ΑΥΤΙΑ ΕΧΟΥΝ ΤΟΙΧΟΥΣ

Civility

I'm pretty sure that "ignorant nationalist" would fall under the label of a personal attack. I invite you to review that page as well as Wikipedia:Civility in order to avoid unnecessary trouble. siafu 29 June 2005 19:56 (UTC)

I hope you're not serious about this. Are you manually picking on "personal attacks" or do you have a bot to do it for you? Either way, something needs reprogramming. Miskin 29 June 2005 20:18 (UTC)

If you prefer to keep on going the way you are, I'm in no position to stop you. I'm just pointing out that calling those you disagree with "ignorant nationalist" is against wikipedia policy, not to mention a very poor strategy for improving articles. It doesn't cost you anything not to do it. siafu 29 June 2005 21:41 (UTC)

On the Greek language

I'm surprised that you want to remove Mycenean as one of the stages of the language - and I note that in your plan for the articles you did indeed have this as one of the main stages. In point of fact it doesn't make a great deal of difference, except that the main article does in fact go on to mention Mycenean, so to say that at the outset that it doesn't deal with Mycenean is not actually correct. I would prefer leaving the Mycenean reference in, since this is after all a documented phase of the language (even if sparsely documented), whereas proto-Greek by its nature has to be somewhat of a supposition. rossb 30 June 2005 18:31 (UTC)

By the way the article I'm referring to is of course Greek language - I suspect that you may have been referring to Modern Greek. rossb 30 June 2005 18:56 (UTC)

Some suggestions

Might I suggest that you take a look at Wikipedia:Civility, Wikipedia:Wikiquette, Wikipedia:Resolving disputes and Wikipedia:Neutral point of view? -- ChrisO 3 July 2005 14:17 (UTC)

Like every measurable magnitude in this word, patience has also its limits. Miskin 3 July 2005 14:20 (UTC)

Please don't start revert wars. I note that you've not yet been warned of the three-revert rule, so I'll do so now: technically you've already broken it. If you revert Macedonians once more you will be blocked. -- ChrisO 3 July 2005 14:28 (UTC)

I assume that you're not too familiar with the subject, as you have left this article in this biased state for months. That's the best scenario I can think of, assuming that you're not biased yourself of course. Anyway I don't have the time nor patience to explain to you why this article is biased and has no connection to its name. Although I don't take kindly to threats (especially the type which understimates my intelligence) I don't intend to keep blaking it out because the edit war will get nowhere. However as a temporary solution I'm just going to edit all lies off. With your permission of course, sir. Miskin 3 July 2005 14:40 (UTC)

Ancient Greek

Of course Ancient Greek has a surviving descendant. So does Latin. That's irrelevant to the question of whether it's extinct or not. If you want to propose that "List of extinct languages" be restricted only to languages without surviving descendants, please discuss this idea on Talk first. - Mustafaa 4 July 2005 18:12 (UTC)

Three-revert rule

Miskin, you are now in violation of the three-revert rule at List of extinct languages and have been reported at WP:AN3#User:Miskin. --Angr/tɔk mi 4 July 2005 21:49 (UTC)

You've also violated the 3RR on Demographic history of Macedonia. Edit warring is a bad idea, and edit warring after you've been warned about it is a really bad idea. I've blocked you for 24 hours to give you some time to calm down, and Demographic history of Macedonia has been protected in the meantime. When you get back, I suggest that you try using the discussion pages to work out your differences with other editors rather than just hitting the revert button every time. -- ChrisO 4 July 2005 22:26 (UTC)

I'll look at it, Miskin. I did not follow this whole 3RR thing, and have to piece together the evidence first. regards, dab () 6 July 2005 13:59 (UTC)

Response

It is extremely hard for me to see any logical reason as to why the article should be curtailed to begin with the Slavic settlement in the 6th century. No one has disputed the fact that Southern Macedonia was inhabited by Greeks at the time of the settlement of the Slavs but that's already in the article. Don't attempt to blame the Bulgarians for "appropriating" the history of Macedon, that's between you and the Macedonians. Besides, the view of the Macedonian Slavs is a fringe opinion in the scientific world, which meets no recognition worldwide. Don't try to intimidate me, either, this will not produce any result. I have no one on my side, if you are talking about ChrisO as my "ally", no he is not. He enjoys quite a good reputation here for being a neutral and unbiased editor - unlike you. You combine a very offensive online behaviour + an inability to see things from any other viewpoint different from the Greek one. You are pissing off far too many people at the same time and I am looking forward to the point when several administrators will get tired of you and your escapades and will take a definitive decision on some things... Then I am gonna open a bottle of champagne. Have a good day. VMORO July 7, 2005 18:05 (UTC)


Sorry about quoting VMORO, but you keep side-stepping the issue. What are the specific problems in the Demographic history of Macedonia as it is now? It's no use disputing the demarcation of Macedonia within the context of Wiki. That article is giving a Demographic history of that region from ancient times to the present. At first I thought the article was superfluous, but I realized it's a valid topic (I can't think of a very good argument against it). Excuse me for giving advice, but I think you should just point out the specific problems that you see in the article. Decius 8 July 2005 11:06 (UTC)

Galatian et al.

There's no point in using Decius's talk page to hash this out, so I'm moving it here.

That's because Galatian is a Kelto-Greek language, as it was formed by a diglossy between Gaulish and Greek. You didn't even know of its existence until some hours ago, so don't try to school me on something I taught you. Galatia was also called Gallo-Graecia Their being called in by the king of Bithynia for aid, when they had gained the victory, they divided the kingdom with him, and called that region Gallograecia."--Justin, xxv. 2., just read the article. Miskin 8 July 2005 10:06 (UTC)

How on earth can you pretend to know anything at all about a language whose entire attestation consists of 120 words and no complete sentences? And incidentally, I first heard of Galatian at least fifteen years ago, so don't flatter yourself into thinking you taught me anything. And although they may ethnically have been a mixture of Gauls and Greeks, that doesn't mean their language was a mixed language. It doesn't mean it wasn't one either, of course; the fact is no one knows enough about the Galatian language to know one way or the other.

Oh and as for my violations of "No Personal Attacks", you did report me earlier in the most cowardly and cunning way for something that I didn't do (vandalism on stub articles doesn't exist), therefore it's only fair to violate a rule against you. Of course you don't think you reported me for no reason, and I don't think that I have ever personally attacked you, so there's no reason talking about it.Miskin 8 July 2005 10:06 (UTC)
  1. Reporting vandalism isn't a personal attack.
  2. Where did you get the idea that "vandalism on stub articles doesn't exist"? Vandalism is vandalism, regardless of whether the article affected is labeled a stub or not.
  3. I didn't report you for vandalism, I reported you for violating the three-revert rule, which is not considered vandalism. (Reporting violations of the 3RR is not a personal attack either.)
  4. I did refer to one of your reverts as vandalism, for which I have publicly apologized.
  5. If you don't think it's making personal attacks to say things like "I tried to make it clear to you that I despise you" and "After looking at your user page, I realised that you probably already have a socially disturbed life", in addition to the numerous times you have called me ignorant, cowardly, and a troll, then I seriously wonder what does qualify as a personal attack for you.

--Angr/tɔk mi 8 July 2005 13:45 (UTC)


Οδυσσέας

Ρε συ, τι έγινε τελικά με το άρθρο?, αν δείς την talk page για τους σκοπιανούς, θα σαλτάρεις!!!Τώρα μας λένε οτι πρέπει να ακυρωθεί η ψηφορία και να αλλάξει όνομα το αρθρο!!!Odysseas

Δεν ξέρω καθόλου, εχω σταματίσει ν'ασχολούμαι με αυτό το αρθρο. Ας κάνουν ό,τι θέλουν, έτσι κι αλλιώς δε νομίζω να καταφέρουν να αλλάξουν το όνομα. Miskin 13:55, 12 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Decius has a satori

Decius: "facts that are unproven cannot be called facts, even though I consider that almost a fact. Calling something unproven a 'fact' is what Miskinites do." Except Decius was correcting his own 16:34, 3 Apr 2005 "statement of fact", which read: "the fact (and it is a fact) that the ancient Macedonians spoke a distinct language". Therefore Decius is, by his own criterion, a "Miskinite". This must be very flattering (I guess) for someone, but I'm not sure for whom Chronographos 00:45, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Well, at the time, I was considering the XMK words and the various references I had seen over the years, and I was being aggresive based on my convictions. Now, I know about those Doricish inscriptions found in Macedon, so I'm more objective on the topic. My present view is that "more discoveries need to be made" to call Macedonian a Greek dialect with any certainty. You, Chronographos, however, seem to be convinced it was a Greek dialect, based mostly on those Doricish inscriptions. Decius 01:09, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

So "you used to be a Miskinite, but now you are not so sure"? Chronographos 01:14, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It would be better not to be "sure" about this topic, because the evidence is too incomplete, and the evidence even seems to be contradictory (the Doric inscriptions don't match what we expect from the XMK glosses). Decius 01:18, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed. Now what replaced your erstwhile "Miskinism" with your new-found skepticism? My Pella katadesmos article? Chronographos 01:22, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Νοικοκύρεψα λίγο ...

... το άρθρο σου για τον μεγάλο Χορν Chronographos 12:14, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Ευχαριστώ! Έψαξα πολύ και για καλύτερη φωτογραφία αλλά δεν εβρήκα τίποτε αξιόλογο. . . Miskin 12:55, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Galatian again

Please provide a published source backing up the claim that Galatian is a mixed language. --Angr/tɔk mi 18:29, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Apologia

I'm sincerely sorry for my "vandalism" of the Greek language article and I apologize. My intention was never to vandalize it...only to make it clearer. I am fluent in Ancient Greek so I didn't just edit everything for the heck of it. I really didn't know what I was doing though since I was not aware of the protocol. I never knew people would react so disfavorably. Also, on the languages style template page...it lists "History" as one of the bottom sections in a language article...above "Examples" I believe. When I changed the Greek language article to conform to this standard, the page was edited back...why is this so?

Sincerely sorry, Cubicalbubble88 20:06, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Πᾶν μέτρον ἄριστον, ὦ Kyle.--Theathenae 19:24, 19 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Γεια σου φίλε

Αν σε ενδιαφέρει, δες αυτό το άρθρο: [2]. Έχει μπει ένας και λέει ότι οι Αρβανίτες είναι Αλβανοί. Ίσως φάω αποκλεισμό αν συνεχίσω να revert, οπότε καλό θα είναι να συνεργαζόμαστε σ' αυτές τις περιπτώσεις. Eπίσης διεξάγεται συζήτηση στο Talk:Albanians για το ίδιο θέμα αν θες να καταθέσεις τη γνώμη σου.--Theathenae 19:44, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Auto pou kanei einai klasiki periptosi bandalismou, opote isos prepei na poume se kapoion admin na labei drasi. Proteino ton Elveto pou asxoleitai me tin archaia makedoniki kai entos eisagogikon mas "gnorizei". Miskin 23:07, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Δύσκολο. Τον αγκαζάρισε ένας Έλλην της Διασποράς που νομίζει ότι τα ξέρει όλα και ότι εμείς που φάγαμε τα νιάτα μας στα θρανία και τα βιβλία μασάμε ταραμά. Αντί να γράφει γράμματα στο Γερουσιαστή του και να οργανώνει την Ομογένεια μπας και βοηθήσει την Ελλάδα ... Εδώ φέραμε τα πάνω-κάτω στη Μακεδονική γλώσσα και στο Σλαβομακεδονικό, και αυτός έχει κολλήσει στην ... Ευκτική Αορίστου! Άλλωστε δεν μου αρέσει να ζητάω χάρες. Chronographos 00:57, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Totes to analambano ego. Gia poion milas omos? Miskin
As'to, katalava. Ouden scholeion ektos... Ma ti malakas. Miskin
Pantos echo synantisei kai cheirotera. Miskin
Συν Αθηνά και χείρα κίνει ... Chronographos 23:14, 20 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Συν Ποσειδώνι και τρίαιναν κίνει :-)) Chronographos 00:47, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Questions re. Greek language

Hi, I see you're active on some Greek language related pages. I was working on some Greek language related pages on Dutch wikipedia, and having more questions than answers here I go:

  • Was Katharevousa in the 19th century (or beyond) important for uniformising the way Greek was written, I mean the common way to write Greek alphabet and/or which sounds were represented by which letters and/or accents & diacriticals?
  • Is it true that the "old" way of diacriticals (with spiritus asper/lenis and accents in various shape and direction) was only fixed in 19th century, to be abandoned in 1976 with the most recent spelling reform?
  • Is there difference between "new Greek" and "Modern Greek" (Dutch wikipedia made that difference before I came involved), "kini neo-elliniki glossa" = "common neo-Greek language" (the "official" Greek from after the last reform) being identified with "Modern Greek"?
  • Or is all this just invention of one of my predecessors?

Thanks if you can give me some help to send me in the right direction! --Francis Schonken 16:29, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

DBachmann page

Hi, I can't help but notice that when you sent a note to DBachmann the link you gave, Talk:Arvanitic language, does not seem to exist on Wikipedia nor does Arvanitic language. You might want to check your link.Existentializer 16:32, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I wrote Arvanite language and then corrected it to Arvanitic language. Thanks anyway. Miskin 16:43, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

No problem, it must have not been moved when I clicked the link. Have a nice day!Existentializer 16:46, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

What sort of answer do you expect when you ask if I'm "retarded" and call my comments "idiocies"? And what's the problem with discussing the differences between New Testament Koine and Modern? I note that Chronographos hasn't answered a single one of my points; instead he mocks my spelling errors (so I might as well write in English). As for "les kai eipe kaneis allos oti prokeitai gia to idio kai to auto. Tis kseroume tis diafores"... Chronographos said quite explicitly "Dimotiki...versions [of the πατερ ημων] are practically the same as the Koine ones (give or take a participle here or a definite article there)". --Macrakis 17:24, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

By the way, I don't know why you put a message for Project1251a on my Talk page. I am copying it to his. --Macrakis 17:30, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I assume that Chronographos was referring to the degree of intelligibility, and not to the actual linguistic structure between the two. I'll give you another example:

"Από μικρόθεν μ'έλεγεν ο γέρων ο πατήρ μου: Παιδί μου μάθε γράμματα, και ωσάν εσέναν έχει. Βλέπεις τον δείνα τέκνον μου, πεζός περιεπάτει, και τώρα διπλοεντέληνος και παχυμουλαράτος. Αυτός όταν εμάνθανε υπόδησιν ούκ ειχεν, και τώρα, βλέπεις τον, φορεί τα μακρυμύτικά του. Αυτός όταν εμάνθανε, ποτέ του ουκ εκτενίσθη, και τώρα καλοκτένιστος και καμαροτριχάρης."

Χεχε, Πτωχοπρόδρομος, ε? Βάλτον να κάνει γλωσσική σύγκριση με την ιδίας εποχής "Αλεξιάδα" να μπλέξει χειρότερα ... (Μετά βαλ' τον να συγκρίνει Μακρυγιάννη με Παπαδιαμάντη)  :-)) Chronographos 19:15, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Do you understand this text or not? This is a demotic text of the 11th century, if you make a 'Koine Modern Greek' translation its structure will change significantly, but its intelligibility will remain the same. Dhimotiki and Modern Greek are not only about the official state language of Greece since 1976. Miskin 17:50, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Κοίτα ρε...

... που ήρθανε τα άγρια να διώξουνε τα ήμερα, με τραμπουκισμούς και χαρακτηρισμούς επί προσωπικού! Κατά τα άλλα, ωραία προωθείς τον Ελληνικό πολιτισμό! Βρίζοντας και μειώνοντας τους άλλους, και ιδίως συμπολίτες σου, και μάλιστα, τη στιγμή που κανένας δεν σε έχει βρίσει! Μου φαίνεται τα θέλει ο πισινός σου... Σου είχα βάλει την template {{welcome}}, αλλά μου φαίνεται τα έγραψες στα παλαιότερα των υποδημάτων σου. Ως εδώ η παρατήρηση και η προειδοποίηση ότι δεν πας καλά.

Όσο για την "προάσπιση της πατρίδας μου" και απάντηση στο σχόλιο σου, με βάση την απαξίωση σου στο πρόσωπο μου και την μοδάτη -αριστερή- ιδεολογία μου:

Καλοφάγωτo το 1.3 δις (τουλάχιστο) που θα σας κοστίσουν τα 30 Φ-16 και τα 333 Λέοπαρντ που έχεις να πληρώνεις για τα επόμενα 40 χρόνια και τα οποία διέταξε το ΚΥΣΕΑ (και όχι ο ΥΠΕΘΑ) να αγοραστούν. Πες μου μετά, ποιος κάνει κουμάντο με τα λεφτά μου, και μήλα μου για δημοκρατία! Κάντε και μία απόβαση με αυτά, στη Αντάρτικη, γιατί μας οχτρεύονται οι πιγκουΐνοι και εκεί και θέλουν να μας πάρουν τα ιερά μας χώματα! Και με ότι σου μείνει, δραματοποίησε την απόβαση στην Νορμανδία και τη μάχη στις Θερμοπύλες, να εξτασιάζεται ο Ντουβάς! Άνοιξε τη Μανίτσα και κάψτε και 10 φαντάρους ακόμα, να πάει στο λύκο, μόνο 8,71 ευρώ το μήνα πάνε! Και μην ξεχάσεις να μάθεις στους φαντάρους που σας περισσεύουνε βήμα, να μην τους φάει ο οχτρός! Και από το πουλί που θα γυαλίζει, να παίρνεις και θάρρος!

Κατά τα άλλα, η παράγκα που έχετε ανοίξει, δουλεύει μια χαρά. Δεν με καλέσατε στα εγκαίνια, γιατί ξέρατε ότι θα σας χάλαγα το μαγαζί! Αλλά, εύγε! Πάει μια χαρά και μόνο του! Συνεχίστε να γράφετε άρθρα για πεθαμένους και ξεχάστε τους ζωντανούς, δεν τρέχει τίποτα! Θα μας σώσει ο Αλέξανδρος, όταν μας πουν οι Βρυξέλες "Τη βαζελίνη τοποθετήσατε, ΑΠ! (γιατί αλλιώς βγαίνετε από την Ευρώπη!)". Αλλά, εμείς είμαστε ποιο έξυπνοι από τους κουτόφραγκους, έτσι; Χαλαράαααααααα...

Όταν θα θες να βγεις σύνταξη το 2020 με 2040, θα πρέπει να μου γράψεις έκθεση ιδεών: "Τι είναι η πατρίς;", ΟΚ; Αλλιώς θα πρέπει να μου βγεις στον ΑΝΤ1 και να μου παραπονιέσαι πόσο έχουνε ακριβύνει τα ραπανάκια!

Φίλα μου τον καταραμένο όφη σταυρωτά! Όταν τον σφάξετε να περάσετε να σας δώσω το παράσημο της ανοιχτής παλάμης! Βρήκε ο κάθε νέοπας το Ιντερνετ και βγήκε να πεί Ζήτω η πατρίς! Πέ' και πέ', ρε! Άντε για και φιλάκια! Project2501a 20:34, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Re file pairneis narcotika? Miskin 21:11, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Tha sou'lega tora pou na baleis kai tin "template" alla exe xari. Ti egine re file thixtikes pou se rotisame an s'exei faei i pentodaktulou? Ti na ginei re palikari afou auti tin entuposi mas dineis ki esy ki auta pou grafeis. Ti na kanoume ego eimai akoma apo autous pou ta lene Romaiika, an esu thes na to paikseis pseutopolitismenos Euro-peos me ta 'mas' kai me ta 'sas' tote sunexise to bioli sou. An sou zitousa diladi to email sou kai sta epsalna se oudetero edafos mipos tha eixe kamia diafora? An sto kato kato tis grafis se peiraksan toso polu auta pou sou eipa tote kane me report sti mama sou na me kanei block. Ti erxesai loipon edo pera kai mou klapsourizeis san na prokeitai na sou zitiso syggnomi i na me paroun ta klamata? Oso gia tis paparologies pou mou aradiases sti deuteri paragrafo, ti na sou po me ekanes kai gelasa. Esu prepei na'sai ap'autous re file pou sto sxoleio tous bazan na paizoun mpalla stin amuna kai tous erixnan sfaliares sto mathima. Mia oraia mera to loipon anakalypsan tous kakous apo tin ΔΑΠ kai tous kalous apo tin ΚΝΕ kai apofasisan na apotelesoun tin eksairesi stin xora tous, mia grothia sto sustima pou tha katapolemisei to sapio katestimeno kai ta loipa kai ta loipa. Ase ta loipa magka, xaneis ta logia sou, krata ta auta gia ta fititoudia pou synanastrefesai giati edo de masame koutoxorto. Oso gia to magazi, ego xalasmeno to pira apo kati ornia san ki esena, ki mpika ston kopo na ftiakso kati aksiologo, esu re mpouli ti exeis kanei eos tora (plin tis diatribis sou stin paparologia opou pragmatika se sygxairo)? Tora ta arthra gia tous pethamenous den ksero pou ta fantasiothikes, mallon tha'nai parenergeies tis prezas. Ase se parakalo tis genikeuseis tou typou "emeis" ki "autoi" kai pare xampari pos den apoteleis kamia eksairesi oute stin Ellada oute sto xorio sou. Stin prosopiki sou selida kai mono to vlakometro varaei sta upsi, periorisou kalutera ekei kai sto linux kai ase ta "ethnikia" na prostateuoun to teleutaio pragma pou sou epitrepei na autoapokaleisai Ellinas. Miskin
Απ' ότι έχω δεί είναι ένας τύπος που κλαίγεται ότι στην Ελλάδα υπάρχει "αρνητική ενέργεια" και ότι θέλει να φύγει στο εξωτερικό. "Αρνητική ενέργεια" υπάρχει όντως, αλλά την κουβαλάει ο καθένας μέσα του. Εγώ όταν θέλησα να πάω στην Αμερική για να μάθω κάτι που εδώ δεν μπορούσα, πήγα, έκατσα 5 χρονάκια και όταν το έμαθα γύρισα. Όση αρνητική ή θετική ενέργεια διεπίστωσα, εκεί ή εδώ, την κουβαλούσα μέσα μου κατά κύριο λόγο. Είναι συνηθισμένη "σταση ζωής" πολλών ανθρώπων αυτή. Για όλα φταίει κάποιος άλλος, ή γενικώς "οι άλλοι" και η αρνητική τους ενέργεια. Δεν ξέρω πόση "αρνητική ενέργεια" έχει επηρεάσει τη ζωή μου, αλλα ξέρω ότι έχω κάνει τις απαραίτητες ενέργειες για να ορίζω τη ζωή μου εγώ, και όχι η όποια "ενέργεια" των άλλων. Chronographos 00:16, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Κοίταξε φίλε μου Project2501a, το γεγονός οτι έμαθες να βλέπεις τον κόσμο μόνο από το αριστερό μάτι δεν σε κάνει αυτόματα μοναδικό κήνσωρα της αλήθειας. Πρέπει να συνειδητοποιήσεις οτι μπορεί να υπάρχουν άλλοι που να έχουν μάθει να τον βλέπουν μόνο με το δεξί (ή να προσπαθούν και με τα δύο) και να θεωρούν οτι αυτοί είναι οι ορθοί. Αν εσύ έχεις για κόλλημα τη στράτευση, άλλοι έχουν την ιστορία. Αν τους κατηγορείς οτι είναι εθνικιστές, εύκολα μπορούν να σε κατηγορήσουν οτι είσαι διεθνιστούλης. Υποτίθεται, ( τονίζω το υποτίθεται) οτι εδώ γράφουμε για τη τρέλα μας, για να μεταδώσουμε κάτι, κτλ. Όλους μας ενδιαφέρει νομίζω το καλύτερο για τη χώρα μας, ο καθένας (και εσύ φυσικά) με το τρόπο του. Και εγώ συμφωνώ οτι σε έναν ιδανικό κόσμο δεν πρέπει να υπάρχουν πόλεμοι και εγώ συμφωνώ οτι τα χρήματα που δίνουμε για όπλα είναι πολλά αλλά ο κόσμος μας δεν είναι ο ιδανικός και ρε φίλε, στο κάτω-κάτω, ΠΟΛΥ ΓΚΡΙΝΙΑΖΕΙΣ. Μόνο η γκρίνια δεν οδηγεί πουθενά. Τώρα, αν έχεις μάθει να σκύβεις και να τα δέχεσαι όλα (διαστρεύλωση και παραχάραξη της ιστορίας, ισοπέδωση των ιδιαιτεροτήτων κάθε λαού) γιατί έτσι προστάζουν οι πολιτικώς ορθές απόψεις της (πάλι υποτίθεται) 'προοδευτικής' σοσιαλδημοκρατίας (τύπου Μπλέρ, Φίσερ και των παρατρεχάμενων τους εδώ Συνασπισμού και Μπίστηδων), κακό του κεφαλιού σου, όταν θα καταλάβεις (γιατί κάποτε θα το καταλάβεις) οτι είσαι πιόνι τους θα'ναι αργά.

Και όχι, μην θεωρήσεις οτι είμαι πασόκος ή απολίτικος ή (όπως λέμε εδώ πάνω, στη Μακεδονία-ή μήπως πρέπει να πώ Aegean Macedonia, μή και σε προσβάλλω?- ντεμέκ) κεντρώος, δεξιός κάργα είμαι.Odysseas 12:09, July 22, 2005 (UTC)

Hey, how am I doing thus far with this Template:History of the Greek language?

Template:History of the Greek language

Just asking... don't restrain yourselves from improving that template, I think restructuring and reorganising the articles will be the easiest part afterwards! --Francis Schonken 21:07, 21 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Δύο παρατηρήσεις: "Consisting of", όχι "in"
H Μεσαιωνική περίοδος θέλει σπάσιμο σε "Λόγια" και "Λαϊκή" γλώσσα ( η δεύτερη περιλαμβάνει Ακριτικά, Κρητικά έπη, Πτωχοπροδρομικά κλπ)
Δεν είμαι σίγουρος για το Koine Modern Greek ως απόδοση της "Νεοελληνικής Κοινής". Μήπως ρηξικέλευθα να τη λέγαμε Νeohellenic Koine ή ακόμα πιο επαναστατικά "Νέα Κοινή" (Νew Koine) ???  :-))) Chronographos 00:24, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Sorry, I failed to notice you are a non-Greek. Can you read what I wrote or should I translate it into English? Chronographos 00:28, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm... isos. Den exo petyxei os tora ton oro se ksenoglosso biblio. Ekana eleutheri metafrasi akolouthontas to "Koine Greek". To 'Koine' pantos einai genikos glossikos oros opote de prepei na einai teleios lathos. Miskin

I'll continue in English to make it easier for Francis: Babiniotis' preferred term in Greek, with which I agree, is Neoelliniki Koine. Translating it verbatim into Koine Modern Greek looks awkward to me. Sounds like a car (!): this is Koine, and this is Koine Gran Turismo Sport.  :-))) A more literal translation, "Common New Greek" also looks awkward to me. I like "New Koine" (Νέα Κοινή) better, I think it looks more elegant. What do you guys think? Chronographos 00:44, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

If you think that Koini Elliniki gives Koine Greek, then Koini Neo-Elliniki should give... what exactly? Miskin

Koine Gran Turismo Sport!  :-)) Chronographos 00:55, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

There seems to be a body of literature in English that uses the term Standard Modern Greek.[3]--Theathenae 08:23, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Standard"? You mean, no airbags, no a/c, no ABS? :-PPP Chronographos 09:17, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Ναι ρε, στάνταρ.--Theathenae 09:22, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Albanau

You are right when you say I am not familiar with the situation, but regardless of if he always inserts POV material and constantly reverts or not, there is no excuse for making personal attacks. If you feel that you need to stop a revert war or to force someoen to talk then request protection at WP:RFPP. If anyone breakes the 3RR note it at WP:AN/3. If anyone repeatedly refuses to listen to consensus or to engange with other editors initiate an RFC at WP:RFC. Thryduulf 08:09, 22 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Miskin, γεια χαρά, να σε καλωσορίσω έστω και αργά στη Wikipedia. Απλά ήθελα να σου επισημάνω πως σύμφωνα με το παλιό σχολικό μου εγχειρίδιο, ο Κωνσταντίνος ο Μέγας άνηκε στη δυναστεία των «Ιλλυριών». Πάντοτε υπέθετα πως αυτό αναφέρεται στην καταγωγή του. Αν εσύ ξέρεις παραπάνω για το ζήτημα, έχει καλώς. Etz Haim 13:57, 30 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Euxaristo. Den exei amesi sxesi to onoma tis dynasteias me tin katagogi ton autokratoron. Gia paradeigma o Basil I pou onomastike "Makedonas" kai idrise ti dunasteia ton Makedonon, itan stin pragmatikotita Armenian people, kai oi diadoxoi pou onomastikan episis "Makedones" den eixan oute ekeinoi katagogi apo ti Makedonia. Oso gia ton Mega Konstantino, einai pragmatika komiko-tragiko na anaferthei os autokratoras Illyrikis katagogis stin selida tis Albanikis istorias, gia ton aplo logo oti den yparxei oute ena katagegrameno Illyriko ixnos stin katagogi tou (i opoia epivevaionetai sta omonuma arthra). Miskin 14:42, 5 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Επίσης, πρόσεξα πως αφαίρεσες την θεωρία του Morosi για την προέλευση του Griko, χωρίς να εξηγείς το γιατί. Etz Haim 14:07, 30 July 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Auti i theoria ap'oso ksero exei katariptei toulaxiston apo ti dekaetia tou '60. Auto pou mporei akoma na upothei, einai oti to Ellinofono Byzantino stoixeio enisxuse tin omilia tis Italo-Dorikis dialektou. Se kamia periptosi omos den stekei i upothesi oti auti i dialektos proerxetai katheauto apo tous Byzantinous metanastes kai de sundeetai me tin arxaia Doriki tis perioxis (to opoio kai diorthosa). Miskin 14:42, 5 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Γιατί μου τη πεφτεις ετσι για αυτο που εγραψα στο talk:Macedonia? Ουσιαστικά αυτο που κανει ειναι να αποδεικνυει οτι στην Ελλαδα δεν υπάρχει σλαβική γενετική επιδραση είτε απο σκοπιανους ειτε απο Βούλγαρους ή αλλους σλαβους

A! Δες και αυτο [[4]]

Den stin pefto bre ston Skopiano apeuthinomoun. Isos egrapsa se lathos simeio. Miskin 10:28, 15 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Ρε συ είδες τι έκανες στο Μακεδονία; Επανέφερες (κατά λάθος, προφανώς) αυτά που υποτίθεται ότι είχες διορθώσει. Θέλω ψήφο [5]


Άν ενδιαφέρεσαι, έλα στο Wikipedia:Featured article candidates και βοήθησε το Names of the Greeks να γίνει Featured Article. Πέσ'το και σε όσους νομίζεις ότι θα ενδιαφέονταν. Colossus 19:56, 15 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

ok

but stop calling Sterbinski's edits "vandalism" when they are just about a content dispute. And make compromise suggestions. If he turns them down, that's his problem, but you want to look like you are prepared to listen to concerns, and improve the wording. dab () 13:48, 16 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

It is unknown whether makednos is a "Greek word". Suggestions include maki-kedon, with kedon Macedonian for Greek khthon. But this is uncertain. The origin of the name is unknown. dab () 14:14, 16 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

vandalism report

Vandalism reports should be made at Wikipedia:vandalism in progress (WP:VIP) or Wikipedia:Administrator intervention against vandalism (WP:AIV). If you have a problem with another users behaviour, you should follow the dispute resolution process - see Wikipedia:Resolving disputes. Thryduulf 14:01, 25 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

New & Modern Greek in Dutch

Just to say thanks for your clarifications!

Yes, Dutch wikipedia made the distinction: "new" for "neo-ellēnikē" in general and "modern" for the written Greek resulting from the 1981 (or was it 1979?) reform.

I made a "template" similar to Template:History of the Greek language for Dutch wikipedia (nl:Sjabloon:Grieks, recently simplified by someone else), which I should adapt a bit, according to what you told me. But then first I'll have to find out for sure how language experts in Dutch-speaking countries approach this.

So anyway, thanks, you helped me. --Francis Schonken 14:21, 25 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

grc templates

I saw that you removed the Babel page links to the grc ("Ancient Greek") templates (though the templates themselves still appear to exist). I won't argue with you over whether the grc templates were simply Attic, or whether that ought to be categorized under "Greek" more generally, but I think there is a need for templates that can be used by people like me who can't speak or read Greek as the language is used today, but who can still pick our way through classical texts. Do you have any ideas for making such templates? -EDM 18:51, 25 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I'll certainly defer to you on the content of the templates and I'm not going to hasten to put them back. But there is a difference between those of us who can struggle through Homer or Sophocles with a Liddell & Scott next to us on the desk, and those who can go to Athens today and read a newspaper or have a casual conversation with a stranger in a cafe. Templates to indicate the former level of proficiency would be of value. -EDM 19:22, 25 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Μπράβο αστροπελέκι μου εσύ

Μόλις ταύτισες (ή τα 'φτυσες) τον Μακεδονικό Πολιτισμό με τον πολιτισμό των Σκοπίων. Αστέρι μου, φεγγάρι μου, της άνοιξης κλωνάρι μου ... Chronographos 15:55, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Μας δουλεύεις τώρα κι εσύ; Το άρθρο επαναλαμβάνει ουσιαστικά αυτά που μαθαίνουν τα Σκοπιανόπαιδα στα σχολεία τους κι εσενα σε πείραξε ο τίτλος και μία αναφορά που έκανε στους Έλληνες στην πρώτη παράγραφο; Τελος πάντων το συμμάξεψα λίγο. Εαν δεν καταφέρω να το διατηρήσω τότες θα το επαναφέρω στον αρχικό τίτλο. Miskin 16:27, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Πριν ένα μήνα είχα γράψει: "τους δίνεις επιχειρήματα χωρίς καν να το καταλαβαίνεις". Τώρα κάνεις τις ίδιες παπαριές, και το λιγοστό νιονιό που διαθέτεις δεν σου επιτρέπει να το καταλάβεις (οποία έκπληξις!). Ας το ταΐσουμε λοιπόν το μωράκι σιγάαααααααααα-σιγα', μην πνιγεί και τι θα γίνουμε μετά.
Είμαι ένας άσχετος Ιάπων. Ή Λάπων. Ή Μαλαισιανός. Ή Κογκολέζος. Είδα το έργο του Στόουν και πολύ μου άρεσε. Θέλω λοιπόν να διαβάσω για το Μακεδονικό Πολιτισμό. Ανοίγω τη Wikipedia και γράφω "Culture of Macedonia" στο κουτάκι. Πατάω το "Go". Και που με πάει? Στον απόπατο. Και ποιός έκανε τη σελίδα αυτή να οδηγεί στον απόπατο με το redirect του??? Η λακαμία που σε δέρνει. Chronographos 16:51, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Για δισαμπίγκ και τέτοια τι λες;MATIA 17:03, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Tίποτα. Ο Μίσκιν τα 'κανε σαν τα μούτρα του, ο Μίσκιν να βγάλει άκρη. Δεν μπορώ να νταντεύω το κάθε αυτιστικό Chronographos 17:06, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Για να είμαστε δίκαιοι, το έκτρωμα Culture of Macedonia προϋπήρχε της επέμβασης του User:Miskin. Γι' αυτό έριξα ένα redirect ώστε η αναζήτηση Culture of Macedonia να παραπέμπει κατευθείαν στο Macedonia. Έτσι ο Λάπων θα δει ότι δεν είναι μόνο αυτός προστατευόμενο είδος...--Theathenae 17:09, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Βεβαίως και προϋπήρχε. Εκείνος ήρθε και του έδωσε τη χαριστική βολή. Και τώρα πρέπει να τρέχουμε εμείς να τα συμμαζέψουμε. Θεαθήναι, μια και του άλλαξες Πάμπερς, βαλ' του και λίγη Φισσάν μη συγκαεί το σκασμένο Ηρώδης

Cut-and-paste moves

Hi Miskin. You recently moved "Culture of Macedonia" to "Culture of Republic of Macedonia". To go about this, you simply cut the content out of the old article title and pasted it into the new title. This is not the way to go about moving a page. Just click the "move" tab at the top of the article you want to move, and specify the new title. That way, it retains the edit history of the article at the new page. - Mark 15:56, 29 August 2005 (UTC)[reply]