User:Egil/Sandbox/rfar

VfD discussions

Evidence to show that the VfD discussions for articles created by rktect indicates that a consensus that the material submitted by rktect is unsuitable for Wikipedia exists.

The content of all the discussions is presented as evidence, as well as the vote count per August 30th, shown as (keep/delete). The votes of Egil and rktect, being parties in the arbitration, have not been counted. Redirect votes in the sense that the original content should be removed, have been counted as delete.

For Mille passus there was one vote "Merge with Pseudoscientific metrology" that has not been counted.

Claims made in articles

Evidence to show that rktect has made false claims in his article contributions.

The number of lines contributed by rktect is overwhelming. Altough many of the contributions are repeats and variations over the same theme, it would be a major undertaking to research each and every claim for accuracy. The following is only a very small selection.

Miles

Miles and stadia have been intended to be unit divisions of a degree of the Earth's great circle circumference since they were first defined as standards of measure by the rope stretchers of Mesopotamia and Egypt. (From Mile)

This seems to be a central point in rktects argumentation, one upon which he seems to build many of his claims. The source of these thoughts is probably the writings of Livio Catullo Stecchini (found at http://www.metrum.org/ )

Stating that the measurements of length of these ancient civilizations are derived as divisions of the degree, implies that these civiliations must have known the circumference of the Earth to a high degree of accuracy at the time these units were defined, perhaps around 3000 BC. There is no historic evidence whatsoever to substantiate this. Indeed, the earliest known claim that even indicated knowledge that the Earth was a sphere are from Pythagoras. See http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/PUBS_LIB/Geodesy4Layman/TR80003A.HTM#ZZ4, and User:Egil/Sandbox/Earth for a summary. It was not untill the 17th century that the circumference of the Earth was measured with sufficient accuracy that it could be used as basis for a measure of length (see User:Egil/Sandbox/Gabriel Mouton et al).

Furthermore, the entire concept of a degree as a unit for angle measurement was not known by the ancient Mesopotamian and Egyptian civilizations, anyhow.

Greek mile

The Greek Milos or Milion of 4800 pous (From Mile)

The Greek milion is simply the name of a Roman mile, it is not a Greek unit of measure at all. The ancient Greeks predominantly used the stadion, and sometimes the schoinos. Where rktect gets milos from, is unknown. (User:Ctenophore has established that the only known noun milos in Greek is in the meaning "flower of the yew tree" [1] )

Greek mile, again

The word Milion is the Roman term for the Greek Milos and is mentioned in Mathew 5. (From Milion)

We have established that the Greek Milos is pure fantasy. But the Greek did have a term for the Roman mile, which is in fact milion [2]. Not the other way around.

Scottish miles

* 1 Milliare Scotia in 1503 = 1600 elle of 1616.8 mm = 3200 pous = 2560 remen

* 1 Milliare Scotia in 1595 = 5 minutes of arc of the great circle of the earth = 9.25 km (From Mile)

These definitions are quite typical of the claims . Based on an assumption that an Egyptian remen is directly based on the circumference of the Earth, he can then go on to turn some discussions done by a 16th century geographer into something that looks as defintions. The Scotish mile was in no way connected to an Earth great circle in 1595, and these definitions are meaningless.

The "geograhic" atur

Ten itrw would be 700 stadia of 300 royal cubits or 1 degree of the earths great circle. The Romans and Greeks appreciated the concept. If a distance of 75 Roman miles could be covered by a river barge or an army could march an equivalent distance of ten atur in ten hours then that made navigation a little easier. (From Itrw)

In addition to the wrong assumption that ancient Roman, Greek and Egyptian measures were derived from the degree, this is pure fantasy. Based on concepts that we today take for granted, they make look innocent enough, but the fact of the matter is that in ancient times, there simply were no maps where degrees of latitude and longitude were indicated. In fact, this concept were developed in the middle of the second millenium AD.

Number magic

If you have ever wondered why there are exactly twice as many seconds in a century as there are inches in the circumference of the earths great circle then it may have occured to you that both time and the division of a circle into degrees of arc are sexigesimal in nature and probably originated in a culture that appreciated factor rich integrals. (From Itrw)

This is typical statement taken from the more bizarre fractions of the anti-metric movement statement, to show the superiority of the Imperial inch over the metric system. It is of course pure speculation and numerology, and has no meaning unless evidence can be found that this is the way the inch was originally defined!

Eratosthostenes

If his results were acurate his stadia would have measured 158.57 m. As it happens this works out to 302 Egyptian royal cubits.

The Egyptians had a very well documented standard of measure called the khet which was 100 royal cubits in length and was the side of an 3ht or field called a st3t. In Greek and Roman times the Egyptian fields were generally farmed in clusters of three with one left fallow, one plowed and sowed in grain and another planted in hay for the plow animal.

This means the Egyptians clusters of fields would have been surveyed by a standard of 300 royal cubits that Eratosthenes could have found useful in his work. (From Eratosthenes)

Instead of accepting the result of Erathosthenes, which is pretty well documented, rktect here simply assumes that Eratosthenes did know the circumference of the Earth to a much higher degree of accuracy. In order to prove his belief, he then simply invents his own chain of speculation on how there must have been a local Egyptian stadium consisting of the magic number of 300 royal cubits, which Eratosthenes must have used.

The atur

The Egyptian value for the itrw or river journey was 21,000 royal cubits. (from khet)

Most reliable sources state the atur (or itrw) is 20,000 royal cubits. There is uncertainty, and a value of 12,000 royal cubits is also seen (also linked to the Greek schoinos). Anyway, the defintion of 21,000 seems to have been fabricated to support the claims about Eratosthenes.

Mouton, the abott

In 1670 Abbe Mouton suggested a primary length standard
equal to 1 minute of arc on a great circle of the earth.
For this basic length Mouton offered the name milliare.
This was to be subdivided by seven sub units with each one
to be 1/10 the length of the one preceeding or
Milliare = 1 minute of arc = 36524 English feet = 1.11 km
Centuria =.1 minute of arc = 3652.4 English feet = .111 km
Decuria = .01 minutes of arc = 365.24 English feet = 111.1 m
Virga = .001 minutes of arc = 36.524 English feet =11.1 m
Virgula = .0001 minutes of arc = 3.6524 English feet = 1.11 m (From Pes)

(The original verse form is retained). Here, it is presumably referred to Gabriel Mouton, an abbot (abbot in French is abbé, which seems to be the explanation of the confusion wrt the name) who proposed the first system of measurement based on the size of Earth. Moutons definition of a milliare is a minute of arc, which by modern definition would be a nautical mile, but by the knowledge in 1670 was 2.040 km. A virgula was 20.4 cm. Where rktect got his figures from, is unknown, but presumably he calculated them himself: centuria and decuria seems to have exactly the same length by metric measure!

Aristotle

The Degree of Aristotle

1 Degree = 1/360 of 400,000 stadia = 1111.1 stadia = 111km
10 stadions = 1 km
1 stadion = 100 m = 300 pous of 333.3 mm
111 km divided into 600 stadions of 600 pous of 308.4 mm = 185 m (From rope stretchers)

Again, to prove the knowledge of the exact circumference of the Earth throughout the times, some tiny adjustments needs to be made. For instance to the value of the stadion used by Aristotle. This time, it is curiously enough defined as exactly 100 meters! Of course, to make a sensible foot, he cannot use the usual division factor of 600, and must use 300! How a pous can be both 333.2 mm and 308.4 mm at the same time, is unknown. In the same article there are also similar claims for totally different feet and stadia by Posidonius, Marinus, Ptolemy and so on. There is not a shadow of evidence whatsoever that the Greek at the time of Aristotles used a stadion divided in 300 feet. Interestingly, I have not found this claim anywhere within pseudoscientific metrology either, so this is quite obviously taken from the good rktects fantasies.

The pendulum clock

I'm sure there is some perfectly natural explanation for this, but whatever the reason it seems to have intrigued Mouton who began to think along the lines that led to the chronometer although he didn't realize it at the time. (From Gabriel Mouton)

Mouton did not inspire the pendulum clock. He published his work in 1670, and the pendulum clock was invented by Christian Huygens in 1656, based on the pendulum devised by Galileo Galilei.