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Talk:Lists of active separatist movements

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Mathieugp (talk | contribs) at 13:50, 28 January 2004. The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

I more or less trust this list, but am perplexed. Is the sovereignty of England, for example, vested in the United Kingdom (just guessing)? From a strictly practical standpoint, England seemed sovereign enough to launch a war in the Falkan Islands. What legal construct denotes sovereignty?

Could you please site some source for this list or for the legal doctrine that delineates sovereign from non-sovereign states? What about dependant sovereigns?

Sovereign states have a seat at the United Nations while non-sovereign states do not. That is the most official delineation you will find. For the definition of sovereignty in your language, I recommend http://www.dictionary.com/ or http://www.hyperdictionary.com/ or even http://www.wikipedia.org/ . However, this is not a list of non-sovereign states, but a list of non-sovereign nations. (See the very good definition of nation in Wikipedia).
There might be a problem with this list in the future though: some nations do not exactly have a territory on which they are the majority. This was the case with the Jews before the creation of Israel in 1948 and still is the case for tons of aboriginal peoples. For example, the Crees are a nation but I don't know how they refer to their own country in English or in the Cree language. I am thinking now that it might be a good idea to change them all to the name that we use to refer to these nations rather than the name of the territory on which they live. What do you think? Mathieugp 21:06, 25 Jan 2004 (UTC)

The definition of the word nation at http://www.dictionary.com/ reads as follows:

    • a) A relatively large group of people organized under a single, usually independent government; a country.
    • b) The territory occupied by such a group of people: All across the nation, people are voting their representatives out.
  2. The government of a sovereign state.
  3. A people who share common customs, origins, history, and frequently language; a nationality: “Historically the Ukrainians are an ancient nation which has persisted and survived through terrible calamity” (Robert Conquest).
    • a) A federation or tribe, especially one composed of Native Americans.
    • b) The territory occupied by such a federation or tribe.

Therefore, there really is no opposition between a nation and a nationality. Depending on the context, one is more prefereable than the other. Mathieugp 23:48, 27 Jan 2004 (UTC)

In theory several First Nations of Canada should be in this article. In the 1980s the government of the province of Quebec officially recognized the Amerindian nations which were on its territory. Let's see, there is the Attikamek nation, the Abenaqui nation, the Algonquin nation, the Huron-Wendate nation, the Innu nation...

You are right. Add them in. This planet is big enough for all of us. Also, I think that a nation doesn't exist when other powerful nations deem to look upon them and recognize them as such. A nation exists the moment a national consciousness is born within a distinct human community. Mathieugp 13:50, 28 Jan 2004 (UTC)
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