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Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/archive May 2004

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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Seth Ilys (talk | contribs) at 14:42, 15 February 2004. The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

Template:Communitypage Please read and understand the Wikipedia deletion policy before editing this page. Explain your reasoning for every page you list here, even if you think it is obvious. See Wikipedia:Deletion policy polls for polls on current deletion issues.

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Please do not forget to add a boilerplate deletion notice, to any candidate page that does not already have one. (Putting {{subst:vfd}} at the top of the page adds one automatically.)

Subpages

copyright violations -- foreign language -- images -- personal subpages -- redirects -- Wikipedia:Cleanup

Deletion guidelines -- deletion log -- archived delete debates -- Wikipedia:Votes for undeletion -- blankpages -- shortpages -- move to Wiktionary -- Bad jokes -- pages needing attention -- m:deletionism -- m:deletion management redesign -- maintaining this page -- wikipedia:inclusion dispute -- Wikipedia:Deletion policy polls

Votes in progress

Ongoing discussions



February 5

  • Mathematical problem - just a one-line dictionary definition, no history and no scope for much expansion that I can think of right now. Bryan 06:16, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • rather amorphous and vague, ditto the expansion thing. Delete Dysprosia 06:23, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. wshun 07:02, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Bmills 15:52, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep and treat it as a stub article. It could, for example, have an introduction followed by a list of articles about mathematical problems on Wikipedia. See [2]. Dissident 02:16, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Is there a mathematically technical definition of a "problem"? If so, explain here and list problems that have their own article. If not, redirect to mathematics, which already has plenty of pointers into our mathematics articles. --Delirium 06:33, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Bryan is wrong. BL 03:00, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
      • Care to elaborate? --Jiang
        • It's not just a one-line dictionary definition, with no history and no scope for much expanision. Anthony DiPierro 05:02, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Still needs work, but it's getting there. Anthony DiPierro 05:02, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Higgs' Laws someone's personal law? Gets 6 google hits: [3] Maximus Rex 06:18, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete; vanity article. Besides which, the first and third "laws" are simply incorrect. Data transmission protocols (e.g., 56K modems) are often engineered on the hardware level such that upstream bandwidth is narrower than downstream bandwidth. And there were (and possibly still are) jurisdictions where copyright is perpetual. Psychonaut 10:57, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge with Simon Higgs. Then let's come back and discuss that page. Bmills 14:25, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - If it gets to stay then I get to write an article on Texture's Law.... :) - Texture 15:30, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Now that I'd vote to keep. Bmills 15:52, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Wikipedia:No original research Anthony DiPierro 22:05, 5 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge with Simon Higgs before deleting. --Delirium 06:33, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. I've often heard these quoted. They may possibly have something of a cult following among people who rarely write webpages (which is the problem with using Google to justify deletion). Whether they are true or not is irrelevant, they are significant. Andrewa 13:14, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete both this and Simon Higgs pages. -- The Anome 13:20, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. BL 03:00, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)

February 6

  • Greater Prussia "Greater Prussia is a term which may be used to refer to Brandenburg-Prussia, The Kingdom of Prussia and the subsequent Republic of Prussia as one continuous entity. The term is artificial. It may also be used to refer to the Kingdom of Prussia at its greatest extent."
    • We suffer terribly from having to many Prussia related articles. Somebody added yet another, self decribed as artificial and never used. Delete it!Cautious 12:03, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Freistaat Preußen also. We already have Republic of Prussia. Cautious 12:06, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Note: Cautious and WolfgangPeters are the same individual. This has been verified through the server logs. Maximus Rex 05:36, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep, but possibly redirect. If "Greater Prussia" is a term that is used, it may be worth having at least a stubbish definition of what area it refers to. If it is used only rarely, redirect to Prussia, since that already contains a one-sentence mention of "Greater Prussia". In either case, don't delete. --Delirium 06:35, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. BL 03:09, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • redirect (doesnt hurt to do so) --Jiang
    • Delete all 3 pages. Prussia has already to many entries. Disno 10:27, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Note this user has 14 edits as of writing. Probably the same person as GH/AM/Cautious/WolfgangPeters (don't want to bother Tim to check the logs). Vote should not count under the SPAT rule of deletion policy anyway. Maximus Rex 05:09, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep as a redirect to Prussia. Maximus Rex 05:09, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Harmless as a redirect. It will be revived, or I miss my guess. WP should stick to formal historical designations, not "Perfidious Albion" and "La Belle France." Wetman 02:40, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Thorgerda - poem - move to wikibooks? - Texture 17:28, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Or Wikisource. --No-One Jones (talk) 17:30, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Yes, wikisource. Got that wrong. - Texture 17:50, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Poems are encyclopedic (when they are written by famous authors). BL 03:09, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • stubbed so keep if famous--Jiang
  • The House On The Hill (poem) - This is more a clean-up request. The article had a vfd notice attached on 18 Dec 2003, then spent some time in the copyvio quarantine and when it got out on 23 Dec 2003 it kept the vfd header, but wasn't deleted. A christmas present? Anyway, it's the source of a poem. Delete or wikisource or just remove the vfd header? Lupo 21:07, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete and move to wikisource - Texture 21:10, 6 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Wikisource unless drastically cleaned up in the next few days. Anthony DiPierro 12:16, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep here, as part of our encyclopedic coverage of poetry, which does require some examples. This poem belongs as a short example for both Edwin Arlington Robinson and Villanelle. Better to keep in its own article than to merge it with either or both and have the duplication. Has to be the source of the program itself because that's the only way to illustrate the composition of a poem. Jamesday 02:37, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Put it on Wikipedia:Cleanup if you want "clean-up request". BL 03:09, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • stubbed so keep if famous--Jiang
    • Wikisource. Davodd 09:14, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)

February 7

  • Release Part 1,2 & 3 ambiguous title, almost no content --Jiang 09:16, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge with Blackalicious and delete (we don't need the history, as it's public domain information). Anthony DiPierro 12:33, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. The title has nothing to do with the content. RickK 01:56, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Music is encyclopedic. BL 03:23, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge with Blackalicious and delete. Wile E. Heresiarch 06:45, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Creature --> wiktionary Mikkalai 09:27, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep as stub. Allow to grow. Anthony DiPierro 12:34, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Can this ever go beyond a dicdef? I vote delete. Meelar 16:34, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Good subject, good stub. Just BTW, I'll add the VfD notice. Andrewa 19:47, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Move to Wiktionary in its current form.—Eloquence
    • Keep. It will grow. BL 03:23, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Move to wiktionary. Wile E. Heresiarch 06:45, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Sarah Marple-Cantrell Looks like a personal page SD6-Agent 13:02, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Doesn't look like a personal page. Anthony DiPierro 15:02, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I feel really bad about this one. She's not an encyclopedia subject, but she certainly deserves to be remembered somewhere. Wikimorial and delete. Meelar 16:34, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • This was already listed in VfD back in May, 2003 (see Talk:Sarah Marple-Cantrell). I supported deletion, but there were not enough votes to delete. Kingturtle 21:41, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Not encyclopaedic - are we to have a page on every kid who's ever comitted suicide? What makes Sarah different? Delete. (Also support move to Wikimemorial) PMC 23:07, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Sad, but not encyclopedic. Isomorphic 01:03, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Twelve year old shooting herself with a firearm. Kinda spectacular. Enough for the news, enough for WP. See the that page's talk page for more argumentation. BL 03:23, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • move to wikimemorial and delete.--Jiang
    • move to wikimemorial and delete. Davodd 09:16, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
  • Wikipedia:List of blank pages - an empty list Anthony DiPierro 16:11, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Would've been great if it was just a completely empty page, but sadly, no.Exploding Boy 16:26, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. It's linked to from a lot of places. Just because it isn't currently up to date doesn't mean it will never be. It's a useful page. Angela. 10:03, Feb 8, 2004 (UTC)
      • Why shouldn't blank pages be listed on vfd or cleanup (or unblanked directly), instead of taking the extra step of listing here? What is the use? Anthony DiPierro 16:27, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • Well, when it was created, there were several hundred blank pages, so that was created as a place to hold them all so they could be worked through without cluttering any other pages with the listing. --Delirium 08:10, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
          • I understand that, but I was wondering why it is still needed. Is this still a problem? Anyway, looks like it's goinng to be kept. That's fine, I guess. Anthony DiPierro 05:11, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Alien artefacts This material is thoroughly covered and more easily findable at any of the establish "Alien visitation"-type entries. Delete Wetman 17:22, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep as a redirect to one of those established "alien visitation"-type entries. Onebyone 19:01, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete misspelled and redundant page; at least convert to redirect. --Daniel C. Boyer 19:25, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Del; mv'ed info to Erich von Däniken's bio. JDR
    • Delete, I am client of SETI and we have no evidence of alien intelligence Plàcid 22:44, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Wikipedia:List of stubs without msg Page no longer used or updated. -- Graham  :) 23:21, 7 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • When the server is happier maybe it should be updated. Secretlondon 23:44, Feb 7, 2004 (UTC)
      • But now that the {{msg:stub}} tag is more widely known is this page really needed? -- Graham  :) 13:56, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Yes because there are still many that haven't got the msg, and it's easier to add now. Secretlondon 15:56, Feb 8, 2004 (UTC)
    • (No vote). I will updated it once a new (and fairly recent) SQL dump is available. In the meantime, we could delete/blank the page, or just remove the entries for listings that say "has msg". Personally, I prefer the last solution. -- User:Docu
    • Delete. Useless page. Don't add stubs here, just use

      This article is a stub. You can help Wikipedia by expanding it.

      . Anthony DiPierro 00:17, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I dont see the worth of going around and converting existing notices to msg format. Do it only when convenient, not for the sake of doing so. delete.--Jiang
    • delete. Davodd 09:16, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
    • Uncertain. While we don't want complete anarchy, I can't see that this page, or any of its users, are doing even one little bit of harm. It seems to me that we waste a lot of time, and possibly discourage a lot of potential Wikipedians, by needlessly discouraging new ways of working. We probably waste some good ideas as well. Wikipedia is far too conservative regarding methodology, like any institution! Andrewa 19:00, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - Texture 19:06, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 8

  • Kendall Bruns subject only has 344 google hits (wikipedia no. 3), looks like self promotion. --Jiang 02:27, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Subject has 344 google hits. Doesn't look like self-promotion. Anthony DiPierro 03:30, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • My name registers 30000 google hits (probably none really referring to me). What's the threshold for inclusion? --Jiang
        • Verifiability. Encyclopedic subject. NPOVable topic. Anthony DiPierro 16:13, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • All three? Since when have obscure subject found their way into enyclopedias? Should I create a website about myself and usethat to satisfy the verfibility req? --Jiang
            • Since Wikipedia. A website about yourself does not satisfy verifiability. Being named one of Cincinnati's "Next Influentials" by Cincinatti Citybeat does. Anthony DiPierro 03:24, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Looks like self-promotion. --Wik 03:33, Feb 8, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, self-promotion/vanity. Maximus Rex 04:18, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Ditto with Anthony. --Ryan 08:00, Feb 8, 2004 (UTC)
    • Ambivalent. This is about as grey-area as it gets. Not famous, but not totally obscure. My instinct says that he himself probably created the page. This is a hard call to make. →Raul654 09:05, Feb 8, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Self-promotion. Isomorphic 00:57, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Nonfam. --Imran
    • Delete: personal promotion. Wile E. Heresiarch 15:04, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep famous enough and verifiable.[unsigned comments dont count]
    • Keep. Although it's a Crappy article on a significant Midwest artist. Davodd 09:21, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
  • Criticisms of Anti-Scientific Viewpoints was moved from Scientism per the example set in Allopathy that was used to delete criticisms of modern medicine. Criticisms of Anti-Scientific Viewpoints is nothing but a tirade on why some people are imagined to hold anti-scientific viewpoints. Long angry speeches, usually of a censorious or denunciatory nature, that is a diatribe, like this article have no place in an encyclopedia. -- Mr-Natural-Health 18:43, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. The proposer would appear to have redacted opinions with which he does not agree from Scientism into this separate article, and now wants those opinions deleted altogether. Please don't use VfD to censor opinions you don't like. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:15, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Then kindly restructure the text to remove the tirade. [Criticisms of modern medicine] was deleted for the same reason that this article should go. -- Mr-Natural-Health 20:49, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • (no vote) This page is for discussing current deletion votes only. Please take disputes about articles to the relevant talk page. Thanks! -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:55, 8 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep for the moment. More antics of a single-issue activist, who seems to be the only editor of this particular page, including creating it and listing it for deletion. Andrewa 09:51, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Uncertain (change of vote). I still don't like letting this guy delete the page, and just merging and redirecting isn't a deletion and doesn't need VfD. Deleting loses history of course. Andrewa 19:11, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge back into Scientism and then delete. Bmills 09:55, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not factual and not encyclopedic. ping 06:38, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: idiosyncratic. -- 209.158.197.2 16:20, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • The above IP is almost certainly Mr-Natural-Health. It belongs to the city of Richmond, where NH lives, and its only contributions have been votes for deletion that just happened to agree with MNH. ---No-One Jones 16:30, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not encyclopedic. R Gunther 16:26, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • The above user is clearly a sock puppet. I'm 99 per cent certain uts MrNH trying to avoid his ban. theresa knott 17:20, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge back into Scientism and delete. Wile E. Heresiarch 06:41, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 9

  • Philip Bussmann - vanity page? RickK 00:09, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - vanity - Texture 15:25, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: vanity. Wile E. Heresiarch 15:16, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep: Matches the 5,000 count criteria from Wikipedia:Criteria_for_Inclusion_of_Biographies:PeopleStillAlive: "Well known entertainment figures, such as TV/movie producers, directors, writers, and actors who have starring roles, or a series of minor roles, in commercially distributed work screened by a total audience of 5,000 or more" and/or "Published authors, editors, and photographers who have written books with an audience of 5,000 or more or in periodicals with a circulation of 5,000 or more". Cyvh 19:38, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Not vanity. Maybe move to Philip Bußmann though. Anthony DiPierro 22:24, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. BL 03:58, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
  • Reproduction speed - dicdef. --Imran 00:46, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Wiktionary. (So refreshing to see something that actually belongs here). Anthony DiPierro 00:49, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - move to wiktionary - Texture 15:25, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • No. Keep. There must be thousands of articles like this one here in Wikipedia, and we don't want to (?????!?) get rid of all of them. <KF> 20:23, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. How do you measure reproduction speed? Obviously expandable. BL 03:58, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
      • Wikipedia is not a dictionary. We've had this article for almost two years with no non-minor edits in that time. --Imran 23:46, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. This could grow into useful resource (e.g. on demographics). Humus sapiens 03:30, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Cypherpunks anti-license - this entry seems entirely to describe one person's web page for a hypothetical "license" that doesn't seem to have ever been used anywhere else. The only references to it on Google are its Web page, the Wikipedia entry, mirrors thereof (some to an older wiki version), and a couple people's links lists. —Steven G. Johnson
    • Delete, please. Mrdice 04:32, 2004 Feb 9 (UTC)
    • Delete - fictional - Texture 15:25, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Um. I found quite a few non-WP-mirror hits. Keep. BL 03:58, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
  • Shnorrer -- slang definition. No-One Jones (talk) 04:42, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Move to wiktionary, and maybe send Wik along with it? Or are we allowed to do that? Pakaran. 04:45, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Agree with Pakaran on both counts. Anthony DiPierro 04:46, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Comment about Karl Schnorrer moved to the talk page. Anthony DiPierro 22:40, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Since when is "slang definition" a reason for deletion? Just as with the term shlemiel, a whole (sub-)culture is hiding behind shnorrer. Read Leo Rosten's book(s) before putting such words on VfD. And of course there is also a novel by Israel Zangwill entitled The King of Shnorrers. <KF> 12:36, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - Wiktionary is the place for slang definitions - Texture 15:25, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Agree, delete. Bmills 15:31, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Wow, great arguments you've got here. I'm impressed. By the way, could you refer me/us to that part of Wikipedia policy where it says that slang has no place in Wikipedia? Because if that's true, I'll nominate Baseball slang. <KF> 18:39, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • It's not the slang part that's a problem. It's the dictionary definition part. See Wikipedia:What wikipedia is not. Anthony DiPierro
      • Oh, that's fine with me. So let's nominate Baseball slang, which consists solely of dictionary definitions. <KF> 22:44, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Believe me, a cryptic reference to another page that contains lots and lots of ideas, guidelines, rules, etc. is not (let me repeat this: not) an argument. You seem to have three other "arguments" at your disposal which you use in a random fashion: "dictionary definition", "slang", and "encyclopaedic" (see Baseball slang below). <KF> 23:06, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • Once again. Brash fighting on the delete page. Shnorrer is an entry entirely devoted to a definition of a word (let's ignore "slang" here). That violates the "wikipedia is not a dictionary" on the page that Anthony mentions above. Baseball slang is an encyclopedic entry that talks about how slang has affected American language, and then lists examples. Now, it is perhaps not the best written prose, but it is encyclopedic, not a straight dictionary entry. Move Shnorrer to wiki- dictionary, and delete. Lyellin 00:52, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
        • I wasn't making an argument. The argument is already made at Wikipedia:What wikipedia is not and Wikipedia:Wikipedia is not a dictionary. I've never used "slang" as justification for a deletion. As for my use of "encyclopedic," I think regular contributors will know what I mean. If you don't, I encourage you to stick around for a while and see. There's a lot of shorthand notation that goes around on these pages. I'm sorry if I was brash. Anthony DiPierro 01:03, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Over time I think this could become an extremely encyclopedic article on a cultural archetype that has a lot more behind it than a simple dictionary definition. --Alex S 01:07, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Wiktionary. KF: The Baseball Slang article isn't very good, but falls into the "lists" category (which is my vote below). Tempshill 01:44, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep: literary term. Wile E. Heresiarch 15:16, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • No comment on deleting but if it does stay it should be spelled correctly: schnorrer, which gets about 44,000 Google hits compared to a few hundred for the unusual one in use in this article. Jamesday 04:24, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Important cultural term. 131.130.181.71 16:10, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Deleting this term could be seen as an anti-semitic act by some. Wikikiwi 21:17, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • MUD trees - an example but no content or explanation - Texture 17:28, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. It's also an exact copy from the site it lists in ext. links ("DikuMud Heirarchy (c)1995-2000 Derek Snider"). --Mrwojo 17:54, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, for same reasons as above. Psychonaut 18:02, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Its fate should be the same as Dikumud. I vote to merge them. Mikkalai 02:41, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • I disagree: Dikumud should stay regardless, but it should be at DikuMUD instead (currently a duplicate substub). --Mrwojo 03:21, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • I fail to see your logic. If dikumud stays, then its tree definitely belongs there, regardless external links. Mikkalai 16:50, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • I fail to agree that the post should be deleted. I think it was a harsh decision to vote it down in the first place, when an edit may have been in order. Since "Dikumud" is not its derivatives, putting it on the Dikumud entry doesn't make sense. The "MUD Family Tree" entered into the public domain in 1993, and was posted on rec.games.mud.diku and is considered the public domain, and is NOT copyrighted to Derek Snider, as the page it is from indicates, as this was an adaptation from a previously released copy, which was copied and constructed. In fact, I believe the original tree changed hands many times before being "Claimed" (unlawfully) by Derek Snider, if that was his intent by putting (c)1994-2000 Derek Snider on his web page. Furthermore, a "MUD Family tree is not the same as the MUD itself, and would serve as a lineage / navigational tool for other entries. Ebube_Dike
        • Mikkalai, I disagreed with the idea that whatever happens to MUD trees should also happen to Dikumud since they aren't the same thing. Ebube_Dike, if a person makes changes to something in the PD then they hold the copyright to the changed version. I can't find the post you mention and you say its from the site the claims copyright. I've replaced the text with the copyright notice. --Mrwojo 07:51, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Hidden Worlds, Online creation - One is self promotion and the other only exists to reference the first - Texture 17:30, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Wikipedia is not a vanity press. Psychonaut 18:02, 9 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Do not delete. Shows an important part of MU* history and the lineage of an idea's initial "inception" and is related to the acronym OLC. If you search google, you will notice many "OLC" sites. Ebube_Dike +
        • Do not delete. Nice online creation article, but just look in the page history to see some changes I made to it, to bring it up to Wikipedia's style standards. User:Zanimum
    • No vote, just wanted to point out the Online Creation duplicate article. --Mrwojo 04:54, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 10

  • Newlyweds - Wikitionary. jengod 02:31, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Dictionary definition. Anthony DiPierro 03:15, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Before something is deleted because it belongs on another project it should go through the m:transwiki system. As Newlyweds is not on the Transwiki log, vote to undelete so we can see the contents are. Gentgeen 11:27, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Temporarily undeleted. Maybe it could be redirected to Marriage. Angela. 17:42, Feb 10, 2004 (UTC)
    • Redirect to Marriage, I guess. Or Wiktionary. Tempshill 19:01, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Interwiki redirects are bad, as they are very hard to find. Gentgeen 21:27, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • redirect to marriage is not interwiki. --Jiang 23:45, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • All the "what links here" links are referring to the MTV show Newlyweds, so I've turned it into a stub about that. Keep stub. --Delirium 03:34, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
  • Williams Communications - company advert - "...For More information visit the WilTel Communications web site at www.WilTel.com and the Government Solutions web site at www.WilTelgov.com or call 1-866.WilTel.1" - Texture 16:25, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I was originally going to say keep and rework until I discovered that they aren't these guys (which is actually a large and reasonably important company). So, delete. RadicalBender 16:35, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete Bmills 16:46, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Move to WilTel Communications. List on cleanup. Anthony DiPierro 23:45, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. BL 04:11, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: advertising. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:15, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Practice - attempted dictionary definition - and I don't think it's accurate - Texture 19:51, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I can still remember the lecture in school about the difference between "Practise" and "Practice"... dictionary definition (and no it's not terribly accurate) so delete. -- Graham  :) 19:59, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Lots of philosophy in that one keep. BL 04:11, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
      • Surely whether it's philosophy or not it's a dictionary definition and belongs in wiktionary? -- Graham  :) 14:10, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I vote Keep, but work on. Its linked to from many pages and is an interesting philosophical subject or can be if worked on. I'll try something... sunja 02:50, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 11

  • Junkno, supposedly a form of music (which some find "quite annoying to listen to"). No relevent google hits [4]. Maximus Rex 08:14, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep and list on cleanup. Relevant google hits. Anthony DiPierro 21:21, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Agree, no relevant google hits (for "junkno", "junk no", "junk techno", maybe proof that Croove is real), no verifiable evidence I can find of encyclopedic worth, so delete or change into a redirect to junkanoo (which is also spelled junkano, and is not an unlikely misspelling IMO). Tuf-Kat
    • Delete: idiosyncratic. Try googling for "junkno" and "ez2dj" -- this should turn up 20000000000 - MYSTIC DREAM 9903, the one song in the world that is called "junkno" (on the ez2dj song list at least). Doesn't appear to be a misspelling. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:32, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Medical Scientism -- idiosyncratic -- The Anome 17:26, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Idiosyncratic. Anthony DiPierro 17:30, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete or redirect to scientism. It's self-promotion for his web site and his writings, which form the vast majority of search engine results for the word pair, other than those which are from us. Jamesday 20:18, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • A valid discussion of medical scientism could exist, but that's not it. Redirect to scientism, which could do with a paragraph discussing scientism in medicine, certainly. --No-One Jones (talk) 21:25, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Redirect. Then put on your hard hats. Bmills 12:10, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep and treat it as a stub article. -- 209.158.197.2 16:18, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • The above IP is almost certainly Mr-Natural-Health. It belongs to the city of Richmond, where NH lives, and its only contributions have been votes for deletion that just happened to agree with MNH. ---No-One Jones 16:30, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Not well developed yet, but a great start. R Gunther 16:24, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • From the pattern of their activity, this user may also be a Mr NH sock puppet. Bmills 09:26, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Lots of hits here too. BL 04:16, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Redirect to scientism. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:32, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)


  • Goodwin, Hester Genealogical stub about non-famous person, but my main objection is the title. Deb 19:01, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Exactly. Delete. Wikikiwi 20:24, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Title is fixed. Keep. Famous. Anthony DiPierro 21:13, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Famous for doing what? Or being what? Onebyone 23:19, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Nonfamous. --Wik 21:15, Feb 11, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not famous. Mrdice 21:23, 2004 Feb 11 (UTC)
    • Delete as not famous. The article does not indicate why this person is in any way noteworthy. --No-One Jones (talk) 21:25, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • How can you, Tony, say she's famous? Not a single page links to Hester Goodwin, and none of the names in her own article has an entry. Who is she? Don't be so damn monosyllabic! Wikikiwi 21:34, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Same way y'all can say she's not famous. It's a pure guess. I just happen to treat articles as innocent until proven guitly. Anthony DiPierro 04:43, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • Well, I hate to tell you, but you have the wrong attitude. First, it's not innocent vs guilty; it's famous vs not famous. You can't prove someone is not famous - it's a basic principle of logic that it's impossible to prove a negative. In other words, you can only prove someone is famous; you cannot prove they aren't. Which means you have to assume someone is nonfamous until proven otherwise. →Raul654 04:49, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Nonfamous. This is somebody's genealogy project. See [5] DJ Clayworth 21:40, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not famous. Secretlondon 21:53, Feb 11, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, no proof of anything resembling noteworthyness. - snoyes 21:59, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, shouldn't have to be famous, but must at least be notable in context of something. Cool Hand Luke 01:53, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not famous, or, at least, nobody has produced any evidence that she is. Doesn't pass the Google test. Dpbsmith 02:43, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Not an encylopaedic subject. The onus in on anyone saying she is famous to prove it. Bmills 12:42, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Fails to state any information that could colourably be interpreted as basis for inclusion in Wikipedia. Article could be revised so such information is included but until they my vote is to delete. --Daniel C. Boyer 14:50, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: nobody in particular. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:32, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • List of topics related to current Polish territories related to -- pointless, unathorised disclaimer, inciting hate. I shall not reverse inserted disclaimers on referenced pages, as I don't want edit wars in all referenced pages. Przepla 21:41, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Whatever anyone may think about the disclaimer (and I think it is in line with ordinary WP practice, and also a step in the right direction), the page itself is a valid list of topics. Charles Matthews 21:45, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. The disclaimer and the page itself are a good step towards solving the constant edit wars for these pages. Jor 21:51, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • I know there are edit wars on those pages. But I object on topic based factual accuracy disclaimers. For instance Szczecin page had reached consensus, and yet it has been listed as disputed solely on fact that it is within scope of article. Besides, correct me if I am wrong, main namespace is not intended for disclaimers. If this would be permitted, why don't insert such disclaimers in all God based articles, since they are also often changed. I object to very idea of generic topic based disclaimers to disputed pages. Przepla 22:02, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • In that case remove the disclaimer and link it from See also. The article itself is useful still for the same reasons. Jor 22:07, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • I already stated my opinion. I understand that I may be wrong and that is the reason I put here to consult community. I still think that factual accuracy should be resolved separately for each article. Even Israel/Palestine conflict pages does not have such disclaimer.Przepla 22:19, 11 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • I agree with Przepla that we do not need such a disclaimer. This page is not helpful at all. Recently there was some progress towards more NPOV in some of the articles, and I don't know why we should need this disclaimer now. Delete. -- Baldhur 08:46, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - Removed text in article requesting text be added to other polish articles and reference to talk page (not appropriate for the article itself) - This appears to be trying to be some kind of meta-page - I assume we are not going to try to create meta pages for each controvertial issue but are going to use existing talk pages. - Texture 15:47, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete 1st the authors of this page are complete ignorants. They put the disclaimer on the areas, which never been a part of moden Germany. The main issue with thie page, is that the cities are currently Polish and are not subject of any international dispute. Why people of those cities should be denied right to express their view on the history of their cities? Cautious 17:29, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Can I make the point that it would be good for Wikipedia to resolve all the differences about articles in this area before May 1, when Poland accedes to the EU? And that this will require discussion with all Wikipedians interested in these matters? Simply calling for deletions doesn't help this process.Charles Matthews 17:38, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Good index page keep.BL 04:16, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete or rename the page. Let say Polish_German view points. Do not include any disclaimers. Disno 10:11, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 12

  • Fragarach. Can anyone find any record of this thing existing other than on gaming sites? RickK 03:24, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep (Updated article). Non-gaming site references (2 of many) appended to article (cos I can't get them to work in here) Syntax 04:05, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. BL 04:27, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
  • Culture of Turkey - mostly some POV rambles, not much worthwhile info there. Dori | Talk 03:59, Feb 12, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete.Bmills 13:20, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. An article being bad isn't a reason to delete. There should clearly be an article at this name. Improve, don't delete. Isomorphic 01:13, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • There is culture in turkey. Keep. BL 04:27, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Move to clean up list. Wile E. Heresiarch 18:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • delete if not improved by Feb 19. --Jiang
    • Merge back into Turkey -- not enough yet for a sep. article. Davodd 09:34, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
  • Qibla al-Qudsiyya. Can anybody find any proof of the existence of these people other than a site that gets its information from Wikipedia? RickK 04:46, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I can confirm the existence of some Jews of Medina who converted to Islam in 622, but not under this name or any variant Romanizations thereof -- and I find no evidence whatsoever that they formed a distinct sect of Islam. I don't know; it seems like an odd thing to make up, so defer for now. --No-One Jones (talk) 05:06, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • How to make Biodiesel Not an encylopaedic subject. Wikibooks? Bmills 12:53, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Encyclopedic subject. Anthony DiPierro 14:26, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - move to appropriate location unless it is updated to be more than the mere recipe it is now. - Texture 15:37, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • m:transwiki this and all how-tos to wikibooks. Gentgeen 14:26, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Move to wikibooks. Wile E. Heresiarch 18:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • move to wikibooks and delete. --Jiang
    • Delete -keep, put under Biodiesel.or make sure to link to from biodiesel. This is an extemely relevant item for present day and historical existence. sunja 02:50, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Ars (no giggling at the back, please) Dictionary def of a Latin word. Bmills 13:05, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - Texture 15:37, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep: a word with a lot of peculiar uses. Not many Latin words deserve WP articles; this is one of them. Wile E. Heresiarch 18:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Tror, Seskef - patent nonsense, claiming that Thor was the son of Priam. Unless this needs context as fiction based on a work I am not familiar with, delete it. -- Smerdis of Tlön 14:43, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Ridiculous cryptohistory (I think it's serious --- this is probably the source). Delete with extreme prejudice. ---No-One Jones 14:54, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete nonsense.Bmills 15:00, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - Texture 15:37, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Misuse of the Internet - attempt to recreate Very Irresponsible Material on the Internet (listed above) under another name - Texture 17:00, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • [add The Way the Internet is used or abused to the above] This is silly. Do we need an article on misuse of the telephone saying how people sometimes use the telephone for phone sex and drug dealing, and oh isn't that terrible, fortunately we're not like that? Or what about an article on misuse of the postal service, describing how people send pornography through the mail, and also letter bombs, how dreadful, tsk tsk? Delete this article and any further clones or reincarnations thereof. ---No-One Jones 17:08, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • I know it looks silly. Please read the article on Moral panic. Moral panics are just about this type of silliness.Barbara Shack 17:21, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • My point was not that the concern over pornography on the Internet and suchlike is silly (though most of it is :-), but that having an article that basically says "Some people worry about this stuff, and maybe their worries are justified, but maybe not" doesn't inform or educate the reader about abuses of the Internet. The place to document concern over Internet pornography and Armin Meiwes is in those articles, not in a vague editorial. ---No-One Jones 17:32, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge salvagable content into Internet and redirect delete as history has been moved to Public concern over the Internet. Anthony DiPierro 17:17, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. This article is a POV rant. I don't see it as fixable other than moving it into a "misuse of technology" article if one exists. HectorRodriguez 17:55, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Don't give Anthony ideas - that would be just as POV not matter how it is written because the title and context is POV to begin with. - Texture 17:59, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • Agree that the title is POV. That's why I recommended moving to Internet and redirecting. Anthony DiPierro 19:09, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • I think all these (even as redirects) need deletion. They are not appropriate since they, even as redirects, are POV titles. Got confused about your intent to move to Internet when you started updating the POV articles. - Texture 19:17, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • What is POV about the current article? Anthony DiPierro 19:09, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • The title is POV. Misuse of the internet imples that the internet has "right" and "wrong" uses. If moved to "Concerns about Internet usage" or something, I'd support keeping it. The only other problem I could find with the reworked article is the use of the hand wavy term "abounds", which is somewhat POV. ShaneKing 03:06, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • How can the word misuse NOT be pov? It implies that there is a particular way that we should be using the net. Delete. Mrdice 18:03, 2004 Feb 13 (UTC)
    • Delete: inherent POV. Wile E. Heresiarch 18:30, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Move this poll to redirects for deletion, as the page is merely a redirect. Anthony DiPierro 07:36, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Avipodopteryx -- completely made-up. --No-One Jones 18:40, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete unless verified. Anthony DiPierro 19:10, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Can't find the word outside unless it's misspelled. Reading the entry--clearly bogus.Elf 20:15, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Patent nonsense, delete immediately. I live in So. Indiana and we have no Wha Bowl or Orange Tutu Thing. -- Smerdis of Tlön 21:10, 12 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, no doubt. --WormRunner 01:09, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Does not exist - pure fabrication. --MPF 02:39, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. More SmartBee fiction. RickK 03:30, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Complete Nonsense, Even if it is amusing. Sailorcattious 03:10, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Move to wikibooks, as per precedent. Fuzheado 04:21, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • m:transwiki to wikibooks and delete Gentgeen 12:56, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Talk:Rebeca Martínez just some guy with some studies (I presume), talking of what an outarage or whatever, was the killing of this baby. --Antonio Obscure reality Martin
    • delete, the article is taking shape but this talk page is just a rant about doctors killing twins fabiform | talk 09:29, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep - The talk page you suggest deleting discusses possible selfish motives on the part of the doctors but I do not find it worthy of deletion under any existing guidelines. I had questions myself when I heard that the fully formed head (if not the body) of a siamese twin was going to be severed, and thus killed for a reason other than to save the life of the other twin. Rather than delete the text, it should be discussed. Give that person a reason why you don't agree with their evaluation of the surgery. - Texture 15:00, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Obviously we should keep the article page, and how can we delete the talk page for a valid article page? --Daniel C. Boyer 18:36, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 13

  • Formula fiction — Substub, dictionary definition (and not a particularly good one). There could be a good article about formula fiction, but this one has shown no signs of becoming one; it has not changed since Jan. 2003. Dpbsmith 00:23, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep stub. Anthony DiPierro 00:35, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Redirect and merge with Genre fiction, which already covers similar territory more thoroughly. Smerdis of Tlön 02:00, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Why wouldn't it be good in the future? BL 04:25, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
      • I have tried to expand this, and distinguish it from genre fiction. -- Smerdis of Tlön 15:32, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • "Formula fiction" and "genre fiction" are still not quite right. Might be heading in right direction. Elf 20:57, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • It's improving. Keep. Karada 23:27, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Won't this always be an essay? How could this become an encyclopedia reoprt? All genres have formulas. A good Wikipedia entry would identify formulas in genres, under each genre. Wetman 23:44, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Al Gore Platform. Wikipedia is not a website for political campaigns. RickK 03:59, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Also note the copy at Al Gore's opinions
    • Very useful content. Merge into Al Gore article. →Raul654 04:05, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Describing a political campaign is very encyclopedic. Keep. BL 04:25, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
      • It's not a description of a political campaign. It's a collection of quotes. Read it.--Jiang
    • Keep. If you're not allowed to list a politician's policies, then you can't really write a very good article about them for an encyclopedia! ShaneKing 04:42, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Please read the article before voting. We did not "write" that article. Al Gore did. His views may be (and indeed are) mentioned as part of his biography at Al Gore. A collection of quotations is inappropriate.--Jiang
    • Delete, it is not even a platform. He never ran on issues like gay marriage or the Iraq war. Also wikipedia is not a collection of quotes, which this article is. - SimonP 07:26, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • delete, see wikipedia:what wikipedia is not.--Jiang
    • Delete both. Ask yourself, "What is it we're trying to make here?" Bmills 09:38, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • What is wrong with having a page that shows Gore's platform? I would rather have quotes that describe his stands than someone else try to characterize them for him. Plus, if you look at the Howard Dean page, where they show his views, they are also quotes. So what is the big deal? Everytime I take time to do something about Al Gore, the same people throw a fit everytime. But what I do is not something out of the ordinary, it comes from other Wiki pages, but they have no problem with them. I think you are on the wrong side of the issue here and the people's voice has spoken. This page provides a first hand look at how Al Gore stands on the major issues, and again, it is him speaking for himself, which is better because of clarity. So please leave it. ChrisDJackson
        • The difference of course being that Dean's opinions are not given a page to themselves but are placed in a context (his life) as befits an encyclopaedia. Bmills 12:51, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
          • The Dean page has quotes under views, just as this page does. Now if you want to merge it with the main article, go ahead, but I don't see what the problem is. ChrisDJackson
    • m:Transwiki to Wikiquote:Transwiki:Al Gore. Gentgeen 12:59, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep: useful material on an important person. A collection of quotes is a pretty crappy article, but the article needs to be there and it's better than nothing. Encourage someone to put some analysis into it. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:48, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Don't worry about it now, I have done more work on the Gore page and added a views section that does not have quotes, but statements on how he stands. But there is already one person bringing up a rip about that. I just don't see why you all are so intent on bugging me on everything I do with this page. It is redundant and I would like it to stop because I am only trying to help. [[[User|ChrisDJackson]]]
  • History of heterosexuality Mere speculation, not a shred of evidence bar a biblical quote or two, which could just as well go into history of religion or some such. Probably beyond help. Tannin 09:17, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Secretlondon 09:25, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Mostly empty headings, and some of what is there is tedious and tendentious. seglea 09:35, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Page history indicates that this article was created to make a point. Bmills 11:20, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: headings are almost an exact copy of headings in History of homosexuality, it does appear this article only serves as a POV exercise. -- Graham  :) 14:03, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete heavily POV article. The least that could be said about this is it should be History of term "heterosexuality" but even in that case it would need substantial revision. --Daniel C. Boyer 18:34, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Del. It's a stalking horse (though not nearly as ridiculous as List of heterosexuals. Delete. --No-One Jones 22:28, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)-- reformatted by Jerzy 23:14, 2004 Feb 13 (UTC)** Keep stalking horse, a real term. Secretlondon 22:53, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Del. unless it is changed to a more serious article on the history of the concept of "heterosexuality" Davodd 09:50, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
    • Ah! Ah! Ah! They met, they got married, they had little children and they lived happily ever after. Boring! Delete. Muriel 13:27, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • It complements History of homosexuality. Keep. Exploding Boy 14:00, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
      • I disagree. History of homosexuality is a growing account of the culture, beliefs and opinions of or directed towards an oppressed minority over the last few thousand years. This is already complemented by history in general, which is traditionally heterosexist in its viewpoint. For a similar account of heterosexual people in the same time period, open any history textbook, it's there. -- Graham  :) 14:13, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Whole books are written on the history of sexuality, this would help some ppl see thier sexual past (and how it relates to other orientations). This topic is as valid as homosexuality history. Giving an account of the culture, beliefs and opinions as specifically relating around heterosexuality (not the standard history textbook line, which does not focus on sexuality) is needed (especially about "opinions of" or "directed towards" other orientations (not just homosexuals, but bi and transgender individuals) ... this article would be informative in such a light; ie. how wrongs have been commited, how things have changed, and what is occuring today concerning heterosexuality). The History of homosexuality is as "heavily POV article" and "makes a point", so this isn't anything different. As to being an exact copy of headings ... don't reinvent the wheel (and as it grows it can change headings). To solve the problem of empty headings, place a stub msg. History of homosexuality is a "covering that serves to conceal intentions" as much as this heterosexuality history article. The History of homosexuality can also compare contrast to the history of heterosexuality. As for interesting articles, "They met, they spent time together, then they died" is not interesting, IMO ... in contrast to "They met, they got married, they had little children and then they died". If this is deleted, the homosexual one should be too. All for now </end rant> ... JDR 21:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Contains just a little meaningful material; should be transformed into a balanced History of sexuality. - Seth Ilys 14:42, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Michael Moore and US foreign policy - irredeemable POV. Secretlondon 09:22, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Put anything of value in Bowling for Columbine before deleting. theresa knott 11:02, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • The current version of the page does not strike me as overly POV, but the content seems to belong more properly directly in Bowling for Columbine (which is not yet so large an article that the two can't be combined). This page title is wrong for the topic, though. Merge then delete. Rossami 14:07, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - POV - Texture 14:51, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. HectorRodriguez 23:59, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge back into state terrorism and redirect. The list is cited and attributed, which makes it NPOV. Anthony DiPierro 06:39, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge into state terrorism and delete. Politics is (are?) important, the connection with Michael Moore is not. Wile E. Heresiarch 07:48, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • "merge into article and delete is not a valid option (except for public domain text) because it destroys the information on authorship of the content." Wikipedia:Deletion policy
    • Just for context: I created this article after pulling it out of state terrorism because Moore's random (fictitious) list had no place there, both because it does not on the whole pertain to terrorism at all, and his long list of opinions is not suitable encyclopedic material for a subject as broad as state terrorism, belonging instead under some "Michael Moore" head. Thus, this article was a compromise to keep it at all. I agree it is worthless and should be destroyed, but anyone else who favors this should also propose how to keep the peace after doing so. -- VV 10:07, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete See my case at Talk:Michael Moore and US foreign policy. 172 12:36, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Merge into Bowling for Columbine and redirect. 172 has made a very convincing case. --No-One Jones 12:49, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • OmniVoid while this looks sensible, even professional, it gets exactly zero google hits, which it not what you expect from a new network protocol that has any reasonable chance of being used. DJ Clayworth 18:09, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - added VfD message on page - delete unless someone can provide a single link or reference to provie its existence. - Texture 18:14, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. You know, I'd say this article is a worthy candidate for Still more bad jokes and other deleted nonsense. Denelson83 19:16, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Either "original research" or a prank. Dpbsmith 20:34, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Looked unlikely when I first mentioned it on cleanup. Elf 20:40, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. There's no RFC for it or any other standards track, looks like original research. Jor
  • St Gregorys - fictional. The third largest channel island is either Sark or Alderney. There is no St Gregory's. Secretlondon 19:38, Feb 13, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Unless perhaps we're in an alternate universe? Sounds believable, dunnit! Elf 20:49, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • He does mention it is volcanic, so maybe it just rose up out of the depts… Get rid of it. Jor 21:25, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Fictional. Googling "Svenby" turns up no tourist information. Dpbsmith 23:10, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. I think I recognise the writing style of a previous troll. Karada 23:15, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 14

  • Bhookay_bhedhiye - looks like nonsense to me Brian Rock 03:37, 2004 Feb 14 (UTC)
    • Delete. Nonsense. RickK 04:20, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - looks like a gaming group of friends trying to make themselves a page. - Texture 16:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Ditto. Elf 22:21, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Nothing links here, some private club's page. Jacob1207 22:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: vanity. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Happy Birthday, Cookie Monster--nonfamous children's book, can't grow past what's here. Meelar 06:55, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Add infomation either to Seaseme Street or create a new article about books based on Seaseme Street then redirect. Saul Taylor 13:53, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. No content on page (just title & year of publication). Jacob1207 22:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: content free. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Probability and statistics and ProbabilityAndStatistics and Probability and Statistics Fairly useless orphans. Davodd 09:05, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Hmm. I was in a "Probability and statistics" class at three different universities so in my mind the phrase always goes together. (As it says on the page.) Although at the moment nothing links to them, it seems probable that something will, and then the pages would reappear. But I'm not violently opposed to deletion. Elf 22:10, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. If deleted it would be recreated. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Toz Looks like self-promotion Lee M 14:27, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - vanity/promotion/lame request for attention OR identity theft attack as a joke or malicious attempt to spam someone. - Texture 16:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. WTF is an "identity theft attack?" Anthony DiPierro 17:25, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Pretend to be someone you don't like... go on the web as them and post their real life phone number, email address, ICQ/Instant Messenger address, postal address, etc... then either request people to contact the person you pretend to be or make inflamatory posts to create a flood of resonses to the person you are pretending to be. It is a common way to attack spammers. - Texture 17:45, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
        • What crazy terms you kids have these days. Anthony DiPierro 04:47, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Oxford Revelation Rock-Gospel Choir Looks like an advertisement rather than an encyclopedia article. The group in question is hardly important enough to warrant an encyclopedia article anyway. G-Man 16:18, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Verifiable. Anthony DiPierro 17:27, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • It may be verifiable but that doesn't mean it warrants an encyclopedia article. Are we to have an article about every obscure gospel choir G-Man 18:32, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Checking their web site, looks like one of a zillion small casual choirs. Elf 22:57, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Del. --Wik 05:29, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
  • Novatianism - dictionary definition. should be moved to wiktionary - Mark 15:20, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete, move to wiktionary - Texture 17:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep/rewrite to stub; looks like could be an interesting topic. Elf 22:20, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep/rewrite - An important and influential schism. Mkmcconn 22:25, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Changed from a dictionary entry, to a brief stub. Mkmcconn 23:04, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep: informative. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC
    • Have another look. It's getting better. Wetman 06:49, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC))
  • Ashley marie - 15-year old's vanity page - Texture 17:50, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Predict Anthony's vote: "Verifiable and Famous. Keep" →Raul654 18:09, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
    • Why not just move it to a user page? I've done that before (whether they wanted me to or not :)) Adam Bishop 18:14, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • They would need to get a user name first. Maximus Rex 22:29, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)~
    • Move to user page and delete. Davodd 18:37, Feb 14, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Newbie mistake. Maximus Rex 22:29, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Jacob1207 22:39, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: vanity. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Rampant Mouse - promotion of website - Texture 18:20, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Interesting website, might buy a sword or two from them. But delete the article, it has no place here. -- Graham  :) 19:35, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. Promotion of website. Elf 22:23, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete: advert. Wile E. Heresiarch 05:01, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Persection of Muslims - A misspelling that's a redirect to the correct spelling; nothing links to it. Elf 22:01, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Tank top a little nonsensical, not very informative Dysprosia 23:42, 14 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Needs work, but keep. RadicalBender 00:21, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Needs a picture... any idea where to find a copyright-free picture of a tank top?
    • Keep. Needs work, but is informative. Davodd 02:32, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Articles on types of garments are valid. Cedars 05:15, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep - its much better now: originally I was talking about this version Dysprosia 05:32, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)

February 15

  • Petra, Jordan. I made a mistake, beg you pardon Plàcid 02:03, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Is a redirect now. Seems useful enough. -- Timwi 02:29, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Predestination (Calvinism). This page is essentially a polemic against the doctrine rather than an imformative definition of it. Regardless of my opinion of the doctrine, i would expect as a researcher, to find a posiotive definition of the doctrine with links to arguments against it. notsnhoj
    • Should probably be listed on Wikipedia:Cleanup, not here. RickK 04:56, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • The article was created with a practical purpose in mind, which has since been satisfied. Its essay form probably qualifies it for deletion. However, it was written more than a year ago, and has been linked from several other articles. Rewriting may be a less messy route. Mkmcconn 07:55, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • List of porn stars who died from unknown reasons - one of a series which raises the questions: 1) Do we need a list of any porn stars, living or dead? 2) Do we need lists of anybody's causes of death? Lee M 05:34, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • And beyond that, is this going to give rise to inevitable lists of "porn stars who died in car crashes," "porn stars who died from falling into open manholes," "porn stars who died in curling iron tragedies"....? Delete! Exploding Boy 05:39, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • YES WE NEED! DELETING THIS WILL DESTROY MY SERIES OF DEAD PORNSTARS : List of dead porn stars - DELETING MY HARD WORK IS HARASSMENT OF NEW USERZ! KEEP! Anticapitalist3 05:38, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • I have no problem with keeping a List of porn stars. We probably don't need all of these multiple lists, though. RickK 05:36, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete the various entries with lists of various ways in which the porn stars died (accidentally, from drugs, etc), but keep a general list of porn stars. Moncrief 05:40, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. - UtherSRG 06:22, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. We wouldn't have this kind of list for other "types" of people, (Goths, vegetarians, truck drivers, and so on, ad nauseum...) so why for porn stars? PMC 07:44, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Del. JDR 10:02, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • List of dead porn stars - It's creepy, and it's unnecessary. A list of porn stars with a note beside each name giving cause of death (if no longer with us) would surely suffice. Delete. Exploding Boy 05:42, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • NO! THIS IS EXTREME UNJUSTIFIED HARASEMENT! KEEP! Anticapitalist3 05:48, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Exploding is exactly right. One all-encompasing list of porn stars with a column for cause of death (if they are departed) should more than suffice. Merge all the relavant lists there. →Raul654 05:46, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. - UtherSRG 06:22, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. We wouldn't have this kind of list for other "types" of people, (Goths, vegetarians, truck drivers, and so on, ad nauseum...) so why for porn stars? PMC 07:44, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. WINP. JDR 10:02, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • List of porn stars thought to be dead - One of the new "porn star" entries. I have no problem with information about porn stars, but this is a particularly useless entry. WHEN were they thought to be dead? Who thought they were dead? Are any of them dead now? None of these questions are answered. Presumably a porn star who three people thought was dead in 1977 but who was fine but then later did die in 1986 could be on this list. Delete. Moncrief, 05:48, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • THESE QUESTIONS ANSWERED AT THE EXTERNAL LINK! U VFDED THE ARTICXLE JUST SOME MINUTES AFTER I CREATED IT! THIS IS HARASSMENT! I STILL HAVE WORK TO DO AND I WILL WRITE ARTICLES FOR EVERY PORN STAR LISTED! Anticapitalist3 05:52, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • There's certainly no problem with that, so long as you use proper case and the articles are NPOV. RickK 05:56, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • It's certainly better than List of porn stars thought to be dead that turned out not to be, which we also have. RickK 05:50, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • it's not harassment and there's no need to yell (hint: turn off your capslock button). Even if -- especially if -- you write articles for each and every porn star listed, there still doesn't need to be more than one List of porn stars. Delete. Exploding Boy 06:01, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
  • List of porn stars who died from AIDS. See all posts above. Once again, there is already a List of erotic actors. Exploding Boy 06:21, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete - UtherSRG 06:22, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. We wouldn't have this kind of list for other "types" of people, (Goths, vegetarians, truck drivers, and so on, ad nauseum...) so why for porn stars? PMC 07:44, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. This is the only one of the porn star lists that makes some sense, since the list criteria AIDS (maybe it should be renamed into HIV though) is closely related to the pornstar profession. A list of goths by cock size? No! A list of goths that died from makeup gun accidents? Yes! CYvH 09:54, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. Why for porn stars? Because they fuck for thier employment. JDR
    • Keep, or incorporate somehow into List of HIV-positive individuals; but verify the information. This is data I can easily imagine someone looking for... - Seth Ilys 14:34, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • At very least the title of this list is inaccurate: people do not die "from" AIDS, they die of opportunistic infections and diseases that occur as a result of having a weakened immune system. A more appropriate title would be "Erotic actors who have died of AIDS-related causes."
      • With respect to 'died of aids' vs 'died of opportunistic infections caused by aids' - while you are correct, I think you are splitting hairs needlessly. →Raul654 14:41, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
  • List of porn stars who died accidentally Exploding Boy 06:22, Feb 15, 2004 (UTC)
    • Caedite eos! Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius! Wipe out all these ridiculous porn star lists. --No-One Jones 06:32, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Keep. List of accidentally killed popstars wouldn't be removed either. Mrdice 06:58, 2004 Feb 15 (UTC)
      • Delete. Changed my mind, after seeing the number of lists Mrdice 06:59, 2004 Feb 15 (UTC)
      • Delete. Agree too many overly detailed list topics. Elf 07:34, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • Delete. We wouldn't have this kind of list for other "types" of people, (Goths, vegetarians, truck drivers, and so on, ad nauseum...) so why for porn stars? PMC 07:44, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • For a simple reason: people are interested in actors, politicians, and celebrities. It's often asked, is so-n-so still alive? And where do you go to answer that question? A reference work, hopefully. Most of these actors meet or surpass the 5K distribution threshold.-- ~ender, 2004-02-15 03:49:MST
    • Delete the whole series. These are absurd, but any useful content could be merged with the aforementioned erotic actos list. Cool Hand Luke 08:00, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
      • Delete series after merging - but distinguish between porn star and erotic actors.-- ~ender, 2004-02-15 03:49:MST
    • Keep. JDR
  • Gold record Please delete this article I created - I have since found Gold album which is perfectly satisfactory, and have therefore turned this article into an orphan ready to be deleted.
  • Platinum record Please delete this article I created - I have since found Gold album which is perfectly satisfactory, and have therefore turned this article into an orphan ready to be deleted. Robert McFaul
    • Perhaps a redirect page?
    • I made them both redirects to Gold album. Keep the redirects. RickK 06:27, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
  • Bakta -- prank article by some students probably. See its talk page for more. Jay 11:10, 15 Feb 2004 (UTC)
    • delete, Complete nonsense. None of the 'philosophers' can be found with google nor in the 'Encyclopedia of Eastern Philosophy'.
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