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This is an old revision of this page, as edited by Bogdangiusca (talk | contribs) at 22:03, 9 December 2005 (→External links in signatures). The present address (URL) is a permanent link to this revision, which may differ significantly from the current revision.

This template must be substituted. Replace {{Requested move ...}} with {{subst:Requested move ...}}.

Supporters

Supporters of this rule include: Ed Poor, Koyaanis Qatsi (strongly), Eclecticology(mostly, but I do forget to do it sometimes), JHK, 24 (mostly), user:Tsazack, Hyacinth

Opponents of this rule include: Anon.

I added the tilde tool to this page (as well as Editing help) because it took me a hell of a long time to hear about this. - user:Montrealais

What was the point of implementing the "sig" preferences option? Having one name on your user page and something completely different in the sig is just daft. It serves no purpose other than to confuse -- Tarquin 11:42 Mar 11, 2003 (UTC)

Your opinion about what is daft, is noted, Tarquin. May I presume that you know of what you speak? -豎眩sv
I have changed my username to match my sig. This is at least the third time I have made changes purely to please Tarquin. I hope he can now wiki in peace. -º¡º

Something just struck me. Why when we write ~~~~ does it link to the user page and not the user talk page? When we hit someone's usernic we usually want to leave them a message, not read their main page. I've been leaving a message on some pages in visiting four people, it involved eight journeys, to a user page, then talk page, next user page, then talk page, etc etc. Can that be changed? After all, if we want to see their user page, we can always go to it from the talk page, but as 9 times out of 10 we want the talk page, it would make sense to make it the default, with the longer route reserved for the rare occasions when we actually want to go to their main page. Any observations? FearÉIREANN 01:35 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

This has come up before and there are arguments for and against it. One major problem with that approach is that we will end up with mixed signature types unless we do a massive conversion, which might be confusing. Also, I think links should reflect the content of their pages -- when I click on a user name, I expect to see something about that user.
On the other hand, it is clearly very inconvenient to post comments with our current system. Brion has written a quick hack to put at least a shortcut to the edit page on the user page ("Leave a comment for this user"); this would mean that you effectively have to click the same number of times as with your solution. Eventually what I would love to see are some nice tiny icons that appear next to each username, one, maybe like the blue (i) logo, shows the user page, one, maybe a speech bubble, shows the talk page, one, a speech bubble with an exclamation mark in it, opens the talk page in edit mode. Because that would be much different from the sigs we have now, it should be reasonably non-confusing. In the meantime, I think Brion's solution should work fine. --Eloquence 02:16 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)
agreed -Smack

This comment was the first reply to Jtdirl, but clearly he didn't like it: Maybe a dual link would be better. -- Tim Starling (Talk) 01:37 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Oh sugar! Sorry Tim it must have got erased in the edit conflict I found myself in. Mea culpa. Mea maxima culpa. (Or as we supposed Irish speakers would say Tá brón orm!) FearÉIREANN 05:22 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)

It's alright, it was just an honest mistake, and easily corrected. Save the multilingual apologies for when you burn down my house or shoot me or something. -- Tim Starling 05:38 15 Jul 2003 (UTC)
New comment on old talk - Note that this old problem has been mitigated to an extent - By fiddling with the nickname string in the user preferences it is possible to provide a link to both the user page and user talk page in the same signature. The software puts [[User:UserName| sig ]] around the sig string. So by making the sig string nickname ]] [[User_talk:UserName|(talk) you end up with [[User:UserName| nickname ]] [[User_talk:UserName|(talk)]] replacing ~~~~ and a get a link to both pages. Many users now implement this (with lots of interesting variants! Word has it that User:Dori was the first to come up with this trick. Pete/Pcb21 (talk) 12:34, 13 Feb 2004 (UTC)

templates in sigs

Regarding the statements Do not use page transclusion or templates for signatures (signatures which include {{User:Name/sig}}, for example). This is usually seen as an avoidable drain on the server and database., what is the evidence that these cause a drain on the server and database? Is this drain theoretical or has the effect been documented? And just how serious is this drain. It seems that using a template for long signatures makes talk pages considerably less cluttered. That they might be a target for potential vandalism seems a non-issue as anything in Wikipedia is a potential target for vandalism. I guess the negatives of using templates in signatures isn't very convincing as presented here. older≠wiser 18:25, Feb 16, 2005 (UTC)

Certainly, a simple text signature (like mine) stored with the page content is less of a burden than yours which is transcluded. First of all, the system has to maintain links to your transcluded signature (see Special:Whatlinkshere/User:Bkonrad/sig). Obviously, the more places you sign, the more links must be maintained. Second, whenever you do change your signature, all those talk pages are purged from the server caches, and must be regenerated (see Wikipedia:Meta-templates considered harmful for a similar discussion of the issue). Third, your signature page is a vandalism target, and will be forever, even if you leave the project. It's not much of a signature if anyone can change it in the future. Lastly, under current policy, someone could request deletion of their /sig page (since it is in your userspace). What happens then? All of this is avoided if we say here and now that only simple, static signatures should be used. -- Netoholic @ 18:48, 2005 Feb 16 (UTC)
Why did you revert my edit to this page? It is, after all, not policy, and making it appear so is somewhat misleading. Your crusade is a mysterious one, and I'll be glad to conform to such a policy if it ever exists, but for now it does not. User:Rdsmith4/Sig 03:35, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)
That seems like a false argument. So, you aren't saying the conclusion and reason is wrong; you're only complaining that it isn't policy? I have explained the very real technical problems above. I ask that you change your signature to a static one, and direct anyone else you see who uses a template or transclusion to this page so that they can take action. -- Netoholic @ 05:13, 2005 Mar 7 (UTC)
My signature, "— Ram-Man (comment) (talk)", has the advantage of providing someone with a link to my talk page. I copied this from someone else and it is very useful. As to the concerns listed, my sig page is protected, and it is also never going to be edited. If I need a new sig, I will create another "/sig2" page in place of the existing "/sig", thus two of the concerns do not apply here. On another note, we have not banned template usage in other situations. A number of templates that I have personally used in Wikipedia articles have become obsolete and needed to be deleted. The same concern applies. So as far as that goes, the amount of overhead is the same as any other template. So what is the problem? -- RM
The difference is that signature templates/transclusion do create avoidable overhead. The overhead on regular templates is acceptable, since it goes into the presentation of the encyclopedia. User signatures are simply meant to be a means to an end, to foster background communication. Adding direct overhead by using anything other than a normal-text signature just adds burden to the server, which is somewhat self-serving, really. -- Netoholic @ 02:24, 2005 Mar 29 (UTC)

I recently started using a template and just got alerted of the fact that it takes up resources. I came here to see how big the impact really is, but i can't find information that would allow me a sober assessment. Can anyone provide some numbers? Thanks — Sebastian (talk) 20:16, 2005 Apr 26 (UTC)

Why not use {{subst:your sig}} and maybe add it to the page as the suggested method? pamri 07:23, July 13, 2005 (UTC)
The sig I had in mind looked similar to this. It was long and cluttered edit and diff view. — Sebastian (talk) 16:44, July 13, 2005 (UTC)
I strongly agree. If Wiki wants us to sign our posts, why can't we customize our sigs?

Tsazack 20:59, 5 October 2005 (UTC) (talk)[reply]

signing for others

i know there is a help topic on how to add someone elses signature when they have forgotten it, that should link from here. I'd do that, but I can't even find that article. SchmuckyTheCat 15:37, 24 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Agreed; there needs to be something on {{Unsigned}} AySz88^-^ 17:29, August 31, 2005 (UTC)

Things to avoid: Appearance

Under "Things to avoid: Appearance" it states that "(it) is possible to be playful with the signature, for example by including ornamental Unicode characters (☻♂♖♥★, etc.) and using <font> HTML tags to change the color and/or size", yet it does not state if this is to be avoided or not. The way I read it is that it is acceptable to use Unicode characters and font tags. Witch is it? ·Zhatt· 20:50, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

from what i read, it isn't acceptable, i may be wrong. --Sstabeler (talk) 10:43, July 30, 2005 (UTC)

Personally I'd prefer a complete absence of "playful signatures" and for everyone to have a very simple and obvious one - yes, like mine. ;) It's a small but very common irritation to have to hover over a link in someone's sig to find out which bit is the link to their Talk page, and given the importance of inter-user communication on WP I think clarity should have precedence over creativity. I seem to be in a minority though, and I can't say it's the biggest problem WP possesses, so I'm not expecting any real changes. Loganberry (Talk) 12:07, 2 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Same here. Exploding Boy 23:04, September 8, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. Zhatt 22:54, September 8, 2005 (UTC)

Timestamp generated by ~~~~

I think it would be nice if the timestamps generated by ~~~~ were displayed in your local time. Your timezone is something you can set in your preferences, and pages like "my watchlist" display dates in your local time. Also, properly formatted dates (such as November 8 1980) are displayed according to your preferences.

I'm not sure where the proper forum to voice this opinion is, so I thought I'd start here. Any thoughts? Has this been proposed and rejected already? JerryOrr 00:34, 15 September 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Good Guide FrogieFever 02:58, 11 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Help with signature date, please

I am trying to make my signature comply with ISO 8601 international standard date format. I have that set correctly in my user preferences, but no matter what I do I can't seem to get my signature to output with the proper date format. I have tried overriding the "Nickname" preference, inserting: 

   [[{{CURRENTYEAR}}-{{CURRENTMONTH}}-{{CURRENTDAY2}}]] {{CURRENTTIME}}

but that does not insert the actual current date and time, it merely inserts the variables. This is more than a little frustrating: ISO 8601 is the international standard date format, and it ought not to be this much work to get Wikipedia to display dates correctly rather than in the bizarre "day month year" format that appears to be the default. Is there something I am missing? BBlackmoor (talk) 20:38, 18 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Correct your date preferences, not the signature preferences. User:Nichalp/sg 13:46, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
That's the first thing I tried. My date preferences appear to have no effect on what my signature looks like. -- BBlackmoor (talk) 14:32, 23 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
User:Mzajac might be able to help you as he too has this format. User:Nichalp/sg 14:39, 23 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for the help, everyone.[1] -- BBlackmoor (talk), 2005-10-24 T 21:04:56 Z

Forced Signatures

Is there a way to take away the option, so people are forced to give the ~~~ or ~~~~ into their post?

ImaTard 01:53, 20 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Could you be more specific? User:Nichalp/sg 14:39, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
What ImaTard means is, isn't there a way to make people sign their names, or, if they are not members, numbers, so we can at least relate to them?--ViolinGirl 20:48, 25 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

"Non-confusing" sigs.

A recent Arbcom decision mandated (in that particular case) use of a "non-confusing" signature. This would seem to be the place to address the issue of "confusing" sigs in general. In particular, ought it to be the case that signatures:

  • Link to the user's own user (and/or talk) page;
  • Textually contain, or visually resemble the user's actual username; and/or
  • Be free of meta-syntax, that would cause problems if copied verbatim.

Two of the above would have been possibly at issue in the case I'm thinking of, though no standard of confusing/non-confusing was actually specified. Other instances also spring to mind. Is there consensus for general guidance as to any of the above? Alai 19:32, 24 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Page Rename?

Hi,

Just wondering, what do people think of renaming this page to Wikipedia:Please sign your posts on talk pages.

BenAveling 20:33, 24 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]

That could involve a lot of policy renames, if we extend the principle... Mind you, this is perhaps the exception in being in the imperative. What about Wikipedia:Signing your posts on talk pages? Alai 05:51, 26 October 2005 (UTC)[reply]
I think the imperative is fine - that's the way this tag is usally used. Regards, Ben Aveling 04:20, 8 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Hi,

Just a heads up that I'm going to raise this at Wikipedia:Requested moves.

Regards, Ben Aveling 07:42, 2 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Let's make 'no images' MUCH stronger

The image server is over-stressed again, and 'vanity' user sigs are one of the most expendable uses of images (IMHO, of course). Can we please ban them instead of just "discourage"ing them, as discussed at Wikipedia:Village_pump_(policy)#Unnecessary_images_are_killing_performance.2C_and_should_be_banned. I'd like to see stronger admonitions against blinking and Unicode, etc., as well--I don't know what they are, but this[2] user sig shows as nothing but question marks or boxes on IE, Netscape, Mozilla, Firefox, and Opera. Niteowlneils 22:42, 10 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Talk page link in my signature has stopped working

Can anyone help? I didn't change anything and all of a sudden it was like this. Grant65[[User talk:Grant65|(Talk)]] 09:54, 15 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Noticed that too. You need to change your Prefs, check the '[v] raw signature' and edit your nickname to a *full* link. HTH, --bitterMan.lha 15:02, 15 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]
I noticed I was in the same boat today and just couldn't figure out what was wrong. Thanks for the help there. Doug A Scott (talk) 16:48, 25 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]
This happened to me, as well. What on earth? John k 07:30, 17 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia:Signatures should not contain images

...or should they? Please join the discussion there. Radiant_>|< 23:52, 15 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

anon sigs

Is there a template for the previous comment was from anon user xx.yy.zz? I couldn't find it under 'cat:Wikipedia_templates' or similar. I'd be happy to link it in somewhere. Srl 20:51, 19 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

thanks Srl 01:23, 20 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

Moving this page to "Please sign your posts on talk pages" would make what is often used as an instruction more polite.

On the downside, cleaning up the resulting redirects might mean more than the usual work because people often write "please Wikipedia:Sign your posts on talk pages" and a decision on what to do with those would be needed.

Regards, Ben Aveling 07:52, 2 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Add *Support or *Oppose followed by an optional one sentence explanation, then sign your vote with ~~~~

Discussion

Add any additional comments
  • Okay, I'll bite. Oppose. I prefer conciseness over politeness in titles. (Besides, when they say "sign your talk pages", I think they really mean it—"please" can sometimes be disingenuous; for example, how often have you seen those little stickers on rental tapes (in the USA anyways) that read: "Please rewind—or 50 cents charge!")
    -,-~R'lyehRising~-,- 10:22, 3 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

165.230.149.151 23:36, 6 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I propose that we add this to the WhatToAvoid section. Zocky 19:40, 9 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

External links
Mass posting of links to a particular website is strongly discouraged on Wikipedia. Posting a link to an external website with each comment you make on a talk page is likely to be viewed as spamming or an attempt to improve your website's ranking on search engines. If you have to tell other Wikipedians about a good website that you are associated with, please do so on your user page.
comments
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