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[[da:Wikipedia:Landsbybr%F8nden]]

Summarised sections

This is a list of discussions that have been summarised and moved to an appropriate place. This list gets deleted occasionally to make room for newer entries.

NASA text, PD?

-> User talk:Zanimum

Hear now the GodKing

-> Wikipedia talk:Press coverage

I think that adding links to the corresponding page on http://nutritiondata.com to food-related articles might be a good idea. Do other Wikipedians agree, and does anyone know of a nutrition site which might be better? Eurleif 00:41, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)

Yes, adding links looks useful, I started linking food and nutrition to the homepage.--Patrick 10:53, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

New feature

You can now paste an IP address into the search box and click "go", and it will take you to the contributions page. -- Tim Starling 03:26, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)

Cool.. but there's a bug :o) It doesn't take care of articles which have the name of an IP address. For e.g., 127.0.0.1 is the name of an article, but giving it in the "Go" button doesn't take it to the article. Jay 12:28, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Oh diddums. You won't be able to access the only two articles in the entire database which are named after IP addresses: 127.0.0.1 and 155.69.5.236 with the go button! I guess I'd better disable it, I wouldn't want you having to type the URL. -- Tim Starling 14:17, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
Why not check if the page exists before going to the contri list? Just moving the if block down right before the "No match" should do the trick.--Eloquence* 15:34, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
Make that one article. I orphaned 155.69.5.236 and deleted it. UninvitedCompany 16:05, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Zero: 127.0.0.1 is a redirect. - Woodrow XXIIIII, Emperor of the United States, Minister of Ministry 19:49, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

image upload problems

I tried to upload some images but kept getting 'This image cannot be displayed because it has errors'. I think others may have the same problem. Is this a software/system bug? -- Kaihsu 12:53, 2004 Apr 29 (UTC)

Which images do you refer to? The last two you uploaded (Image:StopIqaluit Copyright1999KaihsuTai.jpg and Image:RichardHarries20040428 CopyrightKaihsuTai.jpg) display fine here. Maybe you should clear your cache? andy 12:59, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Seems to be working now. Image:BeachBarahona2001 CopyrightKaihsuTai.jpg -- Kaihsu 13:14, 2004 Apr 29 (UTC)

Reg. Privacy

Could anyone please tell me how Wikipedia handles privacy issues? For example, keeping passwords and keeping the watchlists. Is it readable by any others? TIA --Rrjanbiah 14:27, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Well, there is the draft privacy policy, but as far as passwords go, no other users can access your password. No other users can see your watchlist either. AAMOF, there was a discussion about implementing a feature that would allow users see others' watchlists not too long ago and it was overwhelmingly voted down. You can see all the edits that any user has made, however. As far as what guys working on the server-end can see, I don't know. They probably can see your watchlists, but your password is most likely encrypted. —Frecklefoot 16:42, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)


Developers have access to the hash of the passwords, but not the passwords themselves. They could also see your watchlist if they wanted, and details such as when you logged in etc. Sysops used to have the ability to read watchlists a while ago, but I believe this was removed, and is certainly not possible now that special:asksql has been disabled. Also, contrary to popular misconception, only developers can access your IP, not admins, stewards or anyone else. Angela. 17:42, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
Oh, Thanks a lot for the explanation. BTW, it would have been much better if the IP itself is hashed and stored. --Rrjanbiah 05:13, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
(Speaking as a computer engineer) - no, that would actually be very bad. If the hash of your IP address were displayed, it would be trivial for someone to come along, hash the 4294967296 possible IP addresses, and figure out which one is yours. Poof, there goes the privacy of your IP address. →Raul654 05:22, Apr 30, 2004 (UTC)
If I understand right, Angela says developers can view the IP of the *registered* users. So, if the IP is *really* necessary for some login modules or country detection, it can be better md5/sha hashed and stored. But, YMMV --Rrjanbiah 09:20, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Why did Wikipedia call it the "so-called great train wreck of Nashville"

Why would you call it the "so-called" great train wreck in Nashville, Tn on July 9,1918. 101 people died . Many were soldiers returning from WWI and over have of the victims were African Americans going to work in the Dupont plant.This was very gruesome and tragic event. The newspaper says that wagon loads of body parts were taken to the morge. One witness said that the young mother sitting next to him was decapitaited and her arm was shoved "into her baby." I don't know what Wikipedia ment by the "so-called" great train wreck, but it sounds like a terrible wreck to me. The 1998 article reads "worst train wreck in US history." I am obviously offended by your statement . You should change that before a survivor or relative of someone who was killed reads it.i understand that ignorance was probaly the reason for this offensive blunder. So you are forgiven, but you need to change the statement.

You may want to edit the reference in the Nashville, Tennessee article and write a short article about the event. -- User:Docu
It sounds like you are right and the article needs to be improved. Sometimes people go overboard when striving hard to write from a neutral point of view. Pete/Pcb21 (talk) 22:26, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Admin removal

How do I nominate someone to have their admin status suspended or revoked?TDC 18:57, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)

I suggest you work through the dispute resolution process first. You could start by discussing it with the admin concerned and if that doesn't help, seek other comments on requests for comment. If after this, you still feel their actions need to be reviewed, you can ask for that at Wikipedia:Requests for review of admin actions. There is no such thing as "nominating someone to have their admin status suspended" though. All you can do is ask that others review the situation. Angela. 19:07, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
This is not so much about one incident, but a repeated history by a specific admin abusing admin privileges. Perhaps the Admin Nomination page might work? TDC 19:13, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
No, that wouldn't be a suitable place for it. The links at the end of that page will just direct you to Wikipedia:Requests for review of admin actions. De-adminship is a very rare occurrence, so it would be best if you tried to work out your dispute with the admin concerned in an alternative way. Angela. 19:27, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)

Latin name redirects

The first time I looked at the Deletion log, I noticed people deleting latin name articles that redirected to the organism's common English name article. Why would they do that? Does Wikipedia is not paper not apply to redirs? Also, wouldn't the latin names have more currency in non-Eng nations, so the redirs would be quite helpful? Also, some articles, like List of freshwater aquarium fish species specifically use the latin name redirs. Niteowlneils 19:20, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

In general, such redirects should not just be deleted without going through redirects for deletion, if at all. Perhaps you should ask the sysop who was deleting them if there was any reason for it, and if not list the pages on Wikipedia:votes for undeletion. Angela. 19:32, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)
Would you quote some samples, if you list them I can restore them (I can't see them in the log). I haven't seen any on Wikipedia:Redirects for deletion lately. Maybe you want to create a special message to be added to these redirects, to better identify and trace them, e.g. MediaWiki:R_for_scientific_names (see msg in Wikipedia:Redirect#How_to_make_a_redirect ) -- User:Docu
I don't mind helping with the 'leg work' of restoring them, I mostly wanted to double-check whether there was some policy that said they were undesirable (I checked several naming convention pages, and project pages related to the animals in question, but found nothing pro or con RE redirs). I take it from your response that they are considered desirable. A couple are Hapalochlaena maculosa and Hapalochlaena lunulata. While researching this, I noticed one other category of redir deletions that I am curious about. Is there some policy that (assuming there is no other valid topic for the title) names of users can't be used as redirs to their user page? (EG Dgrant) Perhaps these questions should be addressed at Wikipedia:Redirect#What_do_we_use_redirects_for I'm not sure I understand what exactly you mean with your tracing page suggestion? Niteowlneils 20:21, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Both of those two were deleted by User:UtherSRG, and the comments suggest it's something to do with double redirects. I don't understand, but Uther generally is a level head, so if you ask him he might have a more enlightening explanation :) -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:25, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)
I undeleted Hapalochlaena maculosa. It's now a redirect to Blue-ringed Octopus, to add the new {{msg:R_from_scientific_name}} it would need to redirect to Greater Blue-ringed Octopus though. -- User:Docu
I've looked through the deletion log (which has around 10 days of stuff) and while I'm sure I could have missed a few, there certainly doesn't seem to be someone making a policy of doing it wholesale. Yes, the latin redirects should exist (even if they aren't currently referenced). -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:19, 29 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Special:blockip

I promise I'll learn how to report and look up bugs to the system after tonight, but this is one that requires fairly immediate attention and I don't know how to sort it. User:192.195.64.72 is on a personal crusade to blank various pages he doesn't like. I have tried blocking them following appropriate warning, went through the appropriate system, and they are carrying on using the same IP regardless. Is there a problem with the blockip tool? -- Graham  :) | Talk 01:25, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

It's a known bug. Sometimes you need to do it twice before it works. I believe it's been fixed in 1.3. By the way, bugs can be reported at SourceForge or discussed on m:bugs. Angela. 04:00, Apr 30, 2004 (UTC)
What's the estimated roll-out date for 1.3? →Raul654 04:27, Apr 30, 2004 (UTC)

Welcome msg suggestion

This may sound weird, but I don't leave 'welcome' messages, and don't want to start now. But, doing some RC patrol I stumbled on a series of contribs from a new user, and I hope that someone from the Welcoming Committee will leave the user a welcome. It's User:Lynnea9. About a dozen new articles on valid topics within about 40 minutes indicates enthusiasm that should be encouraged. But the user could use the benefit of pointers to some of the Style, etc. pages, as the contribs tend to be unformated and barely stubs. I've been working on cleaning up the entries, but I would like her to get a welcome (from someone other than me). Niteowlneils 05:42, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Yes, it does sound weird. There's no reason you can't send a welcoming message, and it both helps the newbies feel like they belong and subtly tells the worrying ones that folks do notice what they do. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 13:44, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

"Wikispam"

I just thought the word wikispam might be a good catch-phrase to describe those dubious and sinister articles that are thinly-veiled commercial solicitations. See Eyeplaygames.com, an article that should be deleted precisely because it is "wikispam". Anyway, I'd be interested to know what wikians think of wikispam, how to make it std. jargon if enough like it (ie add it to some admin page somewhere), or if there's already a word for these types of articles. Alcarillo 06:47, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I like that word, I just added one article at WP:VfD of that kind and used the term for it. There are two kinds of wikispamming I came across so far - one is to create an advertisement article, the other is trying to sneak in external links to the spammer's website. The second one may also just be trying to get a better google ranking by having more incoming links. andy 07:52, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Glad you liked it! Hopefully it will gain further acceptance and be inshrined in wikipedia jargon with its own description. (BTW, this is an example of what's best about wikipedia, and it reminds me why I still come here.) Alcarillo 08:11, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Anyway, I took the lead and created a page describing Wikispam (since merged into wikipdia:spam). Alcarillo 08:28, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
That's Wikipedia:Spam, not wikipdia:spam. pstudier 20:34, 2004 Apr 30 (UTC)
Note that the word WikiSpam has been used fairly widely for a few years now, I don't think Alcarillo can claim credit for coining it. -- Tim Starling 01:50, May 1, 2004 (UTC)

Hacker clans

I came across Hacker clans on RC patrol, but I don't know the material well enough to know if it is legit or vanity. I don't want to post it to VfD if it is legit. Anyone? SWAdair | Talk 08:50, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

the first part of the article looks legit, but I personally haven't heard of any of the "known clans" (though that' doesn't mean much) it is a little strange that the article fails to mention the "Legion Of Doom" or "cult of the dead cow" since these are the most famous. theresa knott 16:25, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Andy Kaufman: Dead or Alive?

I have to leave for the weekend, therefore since I can't follow this up, please feel free to act as you feel appropriate:

Andy Kaufman died on May 16, 1984. He said that if he were to fake his own death, he'd re-emerge 20 years later (more info in the link). Maybe this can be featured as a brief event notice somewhere on the 'pedia. Some might want to know about it in advance, even if only to remember the character. I didn't know where to put this information, and whether it's appropriate, so here it is, in case anyone cares. --Gutza 13:14, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

One can only hope. Anyway, I mentioned it in the article. Alcarillo 15:37, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

The wiki will be locked starting in a few minutes?!?

Why, and for how long? Niteowlneils 17:41, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I have no idea how long it will be for but they're setting up some new hardware (yay) today: Hardware status. fabiform | talk 17:48, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Cool. Thanks for the link. It seems to imply any outage will be brief. That's good news. Niteowlneils 18:28, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Awesome source for public-domain woodcuttings & line drawings

I just dug out an old book (The Clip Art Book, 1980; Amazon link. You have to scan in the illustrations, but there are over 5000 pictures of all kinds of things. There are line drawings of probably famous people (not labeled), tons of pages of old tools (many of which I cant' identify), lots of pictures of a wide variety of horse-drawn carriages & all other kinds of older transportation, people doing all knds of things, plants & food, anatomical sketches, architecture, sports, costume & clothing, weapons & hearldry & armour, animals... jeez I could be here for the rest of my life scanning them in. Get it and start scanning! See what I've uploaded for European dueling sword and Tonsure. Elf | Talk 18:06, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

There seem to be more than one book of public-domain images...it would be great if people could get them all online. See also, for example, the appropriately named Scan This Book by Mendenhall (2500 images). —Steven G. Johnson 19:59, Apr 30, 2004 (UTC)
It *would* be wonderful; two problems: This particular book is nearly 400 pages, and it'll be rare to find someone with that much time; also, the *page layout* is copyrighted, so in theory we cannot scan in an entire page but must do it an image at a time. ("The selection of illustrations and their layout is the copyright of the publishers, so that one page or more may not be photocopie or reproduced without first contacting the publishers." It's possible that someone could contact the publishers, explain wikipedia, & get permission. Elf | Talk 20:05, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)
Important distinction being made here. It seems that the images are not individually copyrighted, but the book is. Have a good think about this. It means we can't do what you suggest and scan the whole thing in. What we can do is to use scans of individual images, in appropriate articles. That's what it all means.
And this makes sense. While this particular book may now be out of print, the publishers and the artists they employ still need to eat, and producing whatever clip art books are currently in print is how they do this. To use their work to provide an online alternative is an attractive idea to us, but it's neither fair nor legal. Andrewa 20:59, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Current events

April just disappeared a couple hours early of UTC, and the page seems way to empty! Where is the link to the previous month. It's been a few months since I have been at the wikipedia, but didn't we used to keep the last months news up there for at least a day before?! Also, the history is gone, did someone delete it and over write it? { MB | マイカル } 21:55, Apr 30, 2004 (UTC)

  1. Don't panic!
  2. The current events page is moved each month to become the historical page for that month - so the page recently known as Current events, history and all, is now at April 2004. The current Current events page is essentially a brand new one, which will eventually become May 2004.
  3. Moving it ahead of 00:00 UTC was probably carelessness on the part of the user in question (Kaihsu by the looks) - although it is endlessly arguable which timezone should be followed, since some parts of the world will remain in April for several hours yet.
  4. As for what to do around the time of transition, so that the page is not simply blank, there was some discussion (now archived) about this very issue a few weeks ago. There are various complications involved, and I don't think any real conclusion was reached.
Hope that clears things up! - IMSoP 22:51, 30 Apr 2004 (UTC)

If you have a newspaper from today..

.. head over to Talk:Abu Ghraib and let us know how coverage in your paper was of the Abu Ghraib prison incident. We'd like to add some empirical data to the article about a disparity (or not) between US and European media coverage.--Eloquence* 01:19, May 1, 2004 (UTC)

See talk:Abu Ghraib for a discussion of this project. Meelar 01:19, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Fundraising through Increased Book Linking

I'm very new to this so forgive me this is a yawn inducingly old idea.

I've noted the way books are to be cited, and the page which clicking an ISBN number takes you to.

I also note that this provides a source of funding as some click-thrus will give Wikipedia money for any sales made on referral.

For the uninitiated, you can see an example here.

What I was wondering is, would there be any value in having a Book Citation Drive to push up the number of book sales that Wikipedia earns commission on?

Of course, we would want to make sure additions are relevant - you can see the 3 I've added to the Dad's Army article at Further Reading

I figured if you had a splash on the front page and some other reminders strategically placed, it might cause an increase in citations and funds.

If you wanted to be gung-ho about it, Wikipedia could be a lot more aggressive in funneling click-thrus to those retailers Wikipedia can get money from - but I suspect that's against the spirit of Wikipedia. --bodnotbod 01:45, May 1, 2004 (UTC)

Well, shortly after the amazon partner link was added as an experiment Jimbo declared the experiment as being over as the income generated was quite small - and probably also because some wikipedians issued bad feelings about working together with amazon, as the patent policy of amazon is somewhat controversial. However that link wasn't removed even after the experiment was declared over, so maybe Jimbo should check again if it gained any significant income since.
But even if there were no affiliation programs used, adding books in a "resources" or "further reading" section makes perfect sense, as well as adding the ISBN for books which are listed already but lack that number. I myself do that regularily, but I limit myself to books I have read, so I can recommend that book to a topic. Searching through amazon to find a book related to the topic of an article just to add book title is not a good idea IMHO. andy 19:58, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Should we report vandalism that we fix?

I have reverted a case of minor vandalism. I mentioned revert in the editing explanation. Should i do anything further to report the vandal (an IP address), or does someone (or some process) examine reverts to track such incidents?

Richard Myers

Yes. It gives the rest of us a heads up to keep an eye on the vandal's other actions. RickK 04:40, 1 May 2004 (UTC) [reply]
OK. Report it here? Or...?
(Answering my own question)
I was already familiar with this page: Wikipedia:Dealing_with_vandalism
I have found two additional pages which are helpful: Wikipedia:Dealing_with_vandalism and Wikipedia:Vandalism_in_progress
thanks, richard myers
In response to the original question, I would urge caution - an isolated case of minor vandalism may not be true vandalism at all, merely a newbie test, and labelling the user a vandal is likely to be counter-productive (see also Wikipedia:Clueless newbies for an alternative label that may be more suitable). What's more, even if made in bad faith, the best reaction to such edits is simply to revert them. If, on further investigation, you find that the user has made many such "bad faith" edits, then it is worth adding a notice on Vandalism in progress; alerting the community to a user who has made one or two bad edits is a waste of both your time and those who follow it up. - IMSoP 19:25, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

User:Enforcer

...keeps making claims about Wikimedia needing to register with the state of Florida, or something. Any lawyers or anyone tell me what our status is? Meelar 05:32, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Where are these claims? Andrewa 05:52, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
See User:Enforcer, as well as User talk:172. Meelar 05:54, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
Jimbo has written a comprehensive answer to this on the en.wikipedia mailing list (essentially: the claims are false, and he endeavours to go "above and beyond what is required of us"). The post also covers various clarifications of the status and roles of himself, Bomis, and the Wikimedia Foundation; and his vision of the future, including a well-run and transparent Foundation. Recommended reading for anyone interested in the wider picture of how Wikipedia and its sister sites are run. - IMSoP 17:04, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

are rubber/plastic bullets still in use in northern ireland?

This sentence was stranded in another section, so I turned it into a header. I think it's been moved to the Ref. Desk anyway, but I'm not sure. - IMSoP 17:04, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

New hardware

The thing is that this is not a discussion, but I have read above someone was setting up some new hardware and (as I feel it is faster I think it has been already set up) I wanted to say many thanks and a big cheers to whomever did it.

If the above is incorrect, please remove. Pfortuny 10:08, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, the servers were down yesterday and there was an OpenFacts screen that mentioned new servers were being put in. Is there a page where we can see details of what's changed? As a newbie I'm curious about the hardware set up and funding situation (healthy/unhealthy?). --bodnotbod 18:04, May 1, 2004 (UTC)
See meta:Wikimedia servers and meta:Wikimedia#Financial situation, repectively. - IMSoP 19:12, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

<span> and language tagging

Wikipedia does not allow the HTML tag <span>. Why?

Very often we insert some non-English words in English texts. It is desirable to always mark them as belogning to a particular language.

The best way to do it is to write like this: <span lang="xx">some foreign text</span>.

But the <span> tag is not available. Of course, one may write instead like this: <font lang="xx">some foreign text</font>, but it is not so nice (because we do not want to change font, but only to change language).

So it is necessary eigther to allow the tag <span>, or to invent some Wikipedia-specific way of language tagging (which will translate into <span></span>). — Monedula 11:05, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

See the Wikipedia-l thread on the mailing list for last month's discussion on it. There were a couple of related posts on Wikitech-l as well [1][2]. Angela. 12:41, May 1, 2004 (UTC)

Perhaps we should have some pseudo-tag for language marking? Something like

<lang xx>some foreign text</lang>, which will translate into <span lang="xx">some foreign text</span>?

Cut-and-paste move

Can a more knowledgeable/experienced admin fix the cut and paste move of Loch Ness monster to Loch Ness Monster, if possible? There's a page on how to fix cut and paste moves, but I'd rather not fool around with it. Thanks, Minesweeper 11:13, May 1, 2004 (UTC)

As the history of one starts more or less where the other one ends, one can delete one article, move the other there, and then restore the deleted one. It's a bit too messy when they have an overlapping history .. anyways it's merged now. -- User:Docu

GTA <-> Grand Theft Auto

Can an admin move GTA to Grand Theft Auto so that the former can be turned into a disambig page for Grand Theft Auto and Greater Toronto Area? I don't think it makes sense to have a spelled out title redirect to an acronym. -- Kimiko 19:40, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]

it should be a move to Grand Theft Auto (game) or something. Grand Theft Auto is also a movie (I think a Roger Corman one) on which the original name is (nominally) based, and the name of the crime. So I'd argue both GTA and Grand Theft Auto should be disambigs. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 19:56, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
Urgh. Not Roger Corman, but Ron Howard - IMDB. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 19:58, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
Agree. I was planning on making Grand Theft Auto a disambig page too. It already has two only vaguely related parts (game and felony). -- Kimiko 19:59, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, I'll make the moves, and I'll message here once I'm done. Consider both "in use"-- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:03, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
Done. I think it's okay, but revisions (and redirect-skipping) welcome. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:25, 1 May 2004 (UTC)[reply]
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