Talk:Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children

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June 2005 – February 2006

WTH

"Then Afterwards, if you press the left arrow key on your dvd remote control (this only works on the dubbed special edition dvd) it takes you to a fanservice animation based around what really happened when reno and rude dropped the ground when kadaj was in the room, they werent beaten up...they were worn out from hours of kadaj loving. i accidently clicked the left button and i was surprised that square-enix would support such fanservice. Alas! i was happy....all over the dvd remote...yes, i was one happy fanboy" - The last line is obviously vandalism, I have no clue about the rest.

...Okay, the rest is so obviously vandalism. Why would Square, or Nomura for that matter, throw yaoi onto the DVD? urutapu 13:38, 23 May 2006 (UTC)

I think the whole thing s vandilism. We would've heard about it earlier if it were true. Ryu Ematsu

Split Blade Beam?!

I've seen the movie and the final battle. There is no way that, he did a "split Blade Beam". When Cloud did blade beam earlier in the movie, he had a blue aura around his sword. In the final battle with Sephiroth, he did a spash down which look like Braver. I, then, played it in slow motion. A beam didn't come out of the sword. The sword hit the ground and the force of the impact made the dents and whatnot. Thus it was Braver. In the movie, some of the Limit Breaks are hard to identify, so I can understand how someone could make that mistake. Ryu Ematsu

By the same token, he had a blue aura around his sword when he performed Braver against Bahamut SIN. However, in the original FFVII, Blade Beam can and will split when used against multiple foes, so it is a capability of the attack. Ryu Kaze 20:57, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

I forgot all about that. But it still looked more like Braver. Blade Beam actally had a beam come out of the sword. The move he did on Sephiroth didn't have a beam. Ryu Ematsu

Actually, it does. Watch it frame-by-frame and you can clearly see the blue energy waves. Ryu Kaze 15:01, 7 May 2006 (UTC)

Is the rain Aerith's limit break?

Hey people, does anyone know if the rain that starts to fall in Aerith's church is the same as aerith's limit break, of which I have forgotten the name? I don't think there is any reference made to it within the movie, but it could at least be interesting - I know it is to me - but on the other hand it could have no place in this particular article. I'll leave it for discussion/speculation... --Groovemaster D. 12:10, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, wasn't looking very good and found a reference to the limi break already. My bad. --Groovemaster D. 13:30, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Cloud and Tifa, married or not?

Does anyone know if Cloud and tifa are married? It seems to be implied within the movie when Tifa and Cloud are sitting in the room after they've awakened from being unconscious due to their wounds. The camera zooms in on Tifa's hand and, if my memory is correct, she had a ring on her ringfinger. I also seem to recall, although this as well could be mistaken, the dialogue implying that the two of them are at the very least in a close relationship, be it due to their working together, taken care of Denzel and Marlene together or a marriage. --Groovemaster D. 12:53, 1 March 2006 (UTC)

Even if sufficient fancruft existed to prove they were married, which there's not, the article wouldn't benefit from it due to the NPOV policy. Interesting thought, though. ~ Hibana 01:29, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

They are not exactly married. If anyone listened to the flashbacks occuring in Cloud's mind as he is going to the Temple of the Ancients, on one part, Tifa will comment on how they are not a real family, so that basicilly means their relationship hasen't deepened yet.

Story

I highly recommend condensing it by at least 35-40 percent. Deckiller 04:24, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

I could not agree more. I am working on it as we speak. --Megan 17:01, 12 February 2006 (UTC)

I personally would recommend condensing it even further once the film's released in English-speaking countries -- like to two or three small paragraphs. There's good material in there, but the question has to be asked: Just how much is that going to matter once the film's released in the rest of the NTSC countries and the PAL countries? An even better reason to condense it is that we don't have 10 page summaries of the Final Fantasy games themselves (though Cloud's article sure takes a stab at it), or of other movies, and it's extremely non-encyclopedic to do this.

The only reason I haven't tried doing it myself is because there's a lot of people who can read English but don't have access to seeing the film right now, so this lets them know what went on in it. That's why I suggested waiting until after the film gets it US/European/Australian release. Last Order's page is also like this, but I actually think it should be left alone, considering that it's not even going to get a release outside Japan -- and that only 77,777 copies of it were made, meaning not even all the Japanese fans got a shot at it. Advent Children, though, definitely needs to be trimmed in a couple of months. I'll take care of it myself when the time comes.

Above all, it needs to be trimmed by that time, because if it isn't, there's just going to be weeks of editing false information out of the summary due to people who didn't understand the movie, which is exactly what's had to be done here on this page since September as it is. Ryu Kaze 20:45, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

I've divided the synopsis into five parts (prologue, first, second, third act, epilogue) based on what I feel to be the major divisions in the film. I've put each of these in quotations as it is based on my opinion and is in no way official. I also feel that the description of battles in this synopsis is excessive and could be more succint. I'll be making changes shortly. Flooch 01:06, 5 March 2006 (UTC)

Holy crap. It might be easier to revert to an earlier (and shorter) version of the plot summary and editing that instead. Flooch 07:19, 6 March 2006 (UTC)

You actually did very well, so pat yourself on the back. There were a few bits of missing critical plot info, and the wording needed to be heavily tightened in some areas (mainly things dealing with presentation and sentence breaks), but I've seen to all that -- and added what I feel are more logical "act" breaks -- and it all came together really well. I applaud you. I'd been wanting to do it, but wasn't ready to take it on myself. It was far easier once someone had the gears in motion. Great job.

You can check the changes I've made here. Again, great job. Ryu Kaze 21:09, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Alright, I've made a sweep of the whole thing, and it's extremely good right now. We need to the same thing over at the Last Order page, though. I'll probably take care of that. Kudos once again. Ryu Kaze 21:45, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks Ryu, it's a great improvement. As wikipedia articles go, the plot summary is still a little excessive, but it'll have to do for now. I haven't seen Last Order, so I'd only be able to help with copyediting. Thanks ^_^ Flooch 21:51, 7 March 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome and thanks. I'll get to the Last Order page tomorrow. Again, great job. Ryu Kaze 02:20, 8 March 2006 (UTC)

We'll have to condense the page more later (after the NA and European release) to a plot summary instead of a story summary, but for now, this is appropriate, I think. I'm loath to prevent those who can't yet see the film of knowing what happens, which is why I think we should leave as much detail in as we currently have (but only that much detail). Once the NA and PAL releases come, however, it needs to be shortened as as the Last Order page has now been. Ryu Kaze 17:21, 9 March 2006 (UTC)

To clarify, I think we can still touch on the beginning-to-end nature of the film, but we don't need to go into describing the events so much as we need to just say that they happened, touching on the highlights and getting to the end. Ryu Kaze 13:40, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Since no one's objected after all this time, I assume everyone's okay with this getting a trim now that the film is available the world over. I'll be carrying it out some time today. Ryu Kaze 20:58, 25 April 2006 (UTC)

SO whaat, now there's NO story section at all?

I think it's just a fluke.

I don't understand the cellphone scene when Could's cell phone falls into the water and all his messages are being said at one time because after all of that Aerith talks which I don't get either.Basicially I don't get that whole thing with cell phone in to water.HELP??MemoriesOfThePast2, 8 May 2006 (UTC)

Clone names and Meanings?

Often the names of characters in AC and FF7 have a meaning behind them, i.e. Sephiroth - Tree of Life, Fallen leader angel of the Sephira, etc. Anyone know the meaning behind Kadaj, Loz and Yazoo? I've heard of a band or group of singers named Yazoo, and I think it's a type of flower, but I'm not sure.

              They are not clones of Sephiroth, they are Sephiroth's spirit, divided into 3 entities.

meaning

Well I can tell you the meaning of Bahamut an I cant give you the details yoll have to search that on your own iam to sleepsy right now so ill just say this Bahamut is an Islamic Gaint Sea Creature which is supposed to be larger then anything else it is said that when even a man looks upon it he would faint as his senses would be overloaded from the sight of the creature.

But *yawn* thats all I was able to put out lookk yourself youll get interesting results *yawn* good night

--Marduk of babylon

ex-SOLDIER?

The article states and follows an ex-soldier named Cloud Strife, but I was under the impression that Cloud was actually never in SOLDIER. Did I miss something? Unless the article is not referring to the group, and is using a generic term. That would be confusing, I'd think.

Well, cloud is presented as an ex-SOLDIER at the start of the game. This turns out not to be true, but having this article dive straight in the his 'corrected' background may be somehwat confusing for readers. --JiFish(^Talk/_Contrib) 18:07, 16 April 2006 (UTC)

In the movie he says himself that he believed himself to be an ex-Soldier, so really it would probably be best not to say he was an ex-Soldier at the beginning of this article which may even confuse people more.

How would it be confusing? If someone is in a position to be confused by it(in this case the only way that could happen is if they never played FFVII), then why are they reading this article? It'd be like watching Return of the Jedi without ever having seen Star Wars or Empire Strikes Back...they're responsible for not knowing the material built upon in the earlier works. Anyone who finds FFVII spoiled in any way, or finds themselves confused about Advent Children due to lack of familiarity with the game deserves what they get. Nezu Chiza 17:46, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

If someone watches the movie, then they have to have played the game to understand it. And, if they played the game, then they would know that Cloud wasn't in SOLIDER. It should state that he wasn't in SOLIDER.

Rendering time?

Can anyone find out any information on rendering time for the movie? Average time to render a single frame or whatever? 209.232.147.200 18:51, 26 April 2006 (UTC)

Planet Scar Syndrome, not "Star Scar"

The kanji hoshi (星) is used in the Japanese name of Geostigma, yes, but, please people, do not revert this meaning to "star" anymore, despite that being what hoshi means. In the Compilation of FFVII titles -- including the original game -- hoshi is used for "Planet." With the name "Geostigma" it should be obvious to anyone that this is what was meant. Ryu Kaze 23:13, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Handedness

The trivia section on handedness was incorrect in that it omitted Cid Highwind, the most infamous lefty in FFVII (and is shown in the movie wielding his spear with his left hand aside from the fact that he wields it in the game with his left hand).

His handedness coincides with his namesake, Kain Highwind, who was also a spear wielding lefty.

I cannot see why Tifa was listed as a Lefty (Reno clearly is, as he's seen wielding his nightstick with his left hand). Tifa uses incidental items such as telephones with her right hand, scrubs dishes and mugs with her right hand, reaches for her gloves with her right hand, generally uses her right hand as a "strong" hand in the church fight and grabs on to Cloud with her right hand in the boosting sequence. Did this get started because the closeup of her putting on her gloves is on her left hand? There is no other conclusiveness in either the game (but it has been years since I played it) or the movie.

Also, isn't Barrett necessarily a lefty (though probably was originally right handed before losing it)?

kefkafloyd 02:09, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Trivia is trivial, but this seems a little crufty to me. It would be different if the characters already had laterality as an attribute, like the Final Fantasy IV characters. I don't think the average reader will really care what character uses what hand and when in the movie. ~ Hibana 02:28, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

That may be, but it was already there when I found it, and removing it really isn't my place, but I felt that I should explain the correction I made. The other fact that Kadaj and his gang were lefties was probably an allusion to Sephiroth, who was clearly a lefty in the game (and in the movie). kefkafloyd 23:19, 3 May 2006 (UTC)

Red XIII

--12hernn 19:47, 25 May 2006 (UTC)Does anybody think Red XII should have had a bigger part? What about the expiriment with Areis and Red XIII? Does anybody even know what I'm talking about?!?- 12hernn

Ya I think he could have played a larger role. But if you look back in FF7, The Main role he had was taking them to "GrandFather". After that point he didnt really affect the story. Still I think there should have been more of him. Plus he is a freakin badass. I mean if you had him in your frontyard no one would F*&%$#@ rob you (written in tre barret style).

Genisis

That's just a matter of opinion, considering the only major characters in the entire movie are Cloud, Tifa and Kadaj. Observation 14:46, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

I just think it kinda SUCKS. 12hernn 04:40, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

Denzel's Question

In the last section of this article, there is a line that states:

"In the film, Denzel asks Tifa during the Bahamut fight scene, "Who is he/she" when Vincent and

Yuffie run by. This is possibly a reference to FFVII refering to Vincent and Yuffie being optional characters"

-- I do not see the point of this, as the characters being optional does not affect their genders at all. Also, Cloud and Tifa both say Vincent and Yuffie's names out loud respectively. Not to forget the Denzel was never in the original game anyways, therefore he WOULDN'T know them anyways. Observation 15:45, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

...how do their genders figure in again? o__o Denzel's exact Japanese line is "Ano hito wa?" which can be interpreted as simply as "Who's that?" or "Who're they?"—urutapu 05:34, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Velvet Nightmare inspired by a Kriss dagger?

Just a thought, but I think so since the design is pretty similar although Velvet Nightmare is not sinuous. Any opinion for/against it?

Trivia-ish

Well, this is what I was referring to: http://img346.imageshack.us/img346/9585/15xj.gif When viewed upside-down, the scene of Cloud tearing through a motorcycle resembles the flashback of Jenova falling... anyone else notice this or give a crap? Probably not Trivia material, but I figured it was worth a mention at least here. Goroliath

The trivia section is already reference-malnourished. If you can please find a source for it, it would be better because the original research present is putting the article on the verge of requiring a cleanup. ~ Hibana 22:08, 23 June 2006 (UTC)

A source for it? Sorry, don't quite understand what you're referring to... the source is the movie itself. Goroliath

Realism

"The characters would often jump hundreds of feet in the air or get knocked off of enormous structures and walk away unscathed; things that the characters could never do in the original FF7."

This sounds perfectly reasonable for a level 99 character. Or a level 60 character assuming they beat the game early. The point is you're Godlike at that stage, and the over the top action scenes are meant to demonstrate that. Especially the gun shot to the head. In no way does that imply realism. Instead, the viewer might ask how much HP the shot took off, knowing that the characters can survive guns, explosives, fireballs, giant shards of ice, blasts powerful enough to destroy earth, and a supernova. Human realism might be a level 1-10 character, and even then such a character would surpass what's "normal" for the average person. Think of a level 20+ character in D&D. Or the Greek gods.

My point in putting that statement in the article was not to say that the movie lacked realism, but that it strayed away from the traditional fighting style of the game. Obviously it lacked realism. (I mean, I don't see anyone running around summonig huge dragons in real life). But, that's okay. The game itself lacked realism by the characters ability do things like use magic and what not, so putting that stuff in the movie is fine because their getting the material from the game. The fact that the characters can jump up hundreds of feet in the air was not the type ot thing you saw in the game, however. (Yes, they do make radical jumps and things during limit breaks, but those aren't hundreds of feet up.) I am simply saying that it felt more like watching an episode of Dragon Ball Z rather than Final Fantasy. I am not even saying that it was bad; I thought it was good movie and that the fighting was cool. I am merely stateing that it was differet.

I get what you're saying. The characters might be strong enough to survive those enormous falls, but they don't fight like that.

Kadaj's Rant

I was just watching this. During the scene at the forgotten city, Kadaj's rant looked a little familar. Aside from his glowing, all you have to do is change a few words and he sounds like this guy or this guy. Kinda creeps me out. Tell what you think of my opinion if you watched the movie.--Lionheart Omega 02:51, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

I don't know much about what Pastor Ted says, and I never listen when Osama Bin Ladin talks because anyone who would kill innocent people is full of crap. But, in reference to what you are saying and to be fair, I would like to know what words you would change. I mean, if I say 'I think that you are neat', and you change the word 'neat' to 'stupid', then the meaning is dramatically altered. I am just curious as to what exactly you're refrencing to.