Talk:Nationalism

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/Archive 1

National Socialism

Should the link to 'National Socialism dot com' http://www.national-socialism.com/ under external links have a note beside it warning that it's contents could be viewed as 'offensive' by some readers? While the site isn't outright 'racist' (it's Philosophy page states quite the contrary) it does have a 'White supremacy' theme to it and a few posts that could be interpreted as Anti-Semitic in nature. The site does embody the ideology of some National Socialist movements, however I believe it should be made clear that the link points to a site that only pertains to one idealogical perspective and isn't inherently educational in nature. I believe the link should remain in the article as it does show some of the negative consequences associated with 'national pride', however some might find the site offensive and it should be marked as so, and perhaps demoted from it's position as a primary link. -Jaqel 22:14, 24 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Australian nationalism as of 2006

Australian nationalism as of 2006 [1] Tobias Conradi [[User_talk:Tobias Conradi|(Talk)]] 08:40, 3 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

not neccesarily true

"Italy's unification, however, is a good example of a 19th-century nationalist movement based upon ethnicity and/or language." I dont think it is historically accurate to describe italy's unification as based upon such ideas, as of unification italy did not speak a common language, albeit related languages which were later termed dialects with the supremacy of Tuscan/Florentine as the national standard. Eus2

black panther party

"Some of these movements are left-wing, others are centrist, while others are far right and racist, such as the Black Panther Party." is it being said that the Black Panther Party is "far right and racist"

Nationalist movements in Pakistan There are some nationalist movements in Pakistan which are known as Jeeay Sindh .Balochistan nationalist movement and Siraiki movement .Siraiki national movement demands independent province in Pakistan

Historical effects of nationalism (Britain and Ireland)

"The Acts of Union and English expansion and attempts at conquest of Wales, Scotland, and Ireland were a result of English nationalism. All of the Scottish, Irish and Welsh wars and rebellions against English rule were an expression of Irish Nationalism, Scottish Nationalism and Welsh Nationalism"

I'm not happy with this statement. It's POV, it's historically dubious and it conflates many different events. The Scottish wars of independence took place at a time when England was ruled by a French-speaking nobility - was English nationalism really the dominant factor there? As for the other conflicts - what about other factors (especially religion)? --Nydas 22:43, 12 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Removed the section. One could argue that the Declaration of Arbroath was an example of nationalism at work, but I felt that it would look desperately out of place, being 'four centuries' earlier than the next example.--Nydas 08:23, 16 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Racism and Nationalism

Isn't it safe to say, the role of "race" in racism, is equivalent to the role of "nation" in nationalism?

Nationalism and Patriotism

Opening a can of worms here...

This article and the patriotism article cover similar ground, but the link between them is weak. I'd suggest a seperate article examining the differences (if any) between patriotism and nationalism, which they both link to.--Nydas 20:23, 23 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Nice picture, but ...

..."Lady Liberty" had much more to do with individual liberty than nationalism. Anyone have a better one? Meanwhile there must be a spot for this one in "French Revolution."Sfahey 22:38, 24 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I selected this picture. It's already used elsewhere, including the French Revolution section. I think it's appropriate for a number of reasons. It depicts a national flag and a national struggle. It shows all the economic classes of France working together - the very essence of nationalism is that it transcends class boundaries. For academics, the French Revolution is a common starting point for nationalism (although earlier examples may exist). Individual liberty and nationalism are not always distinct from each other, particularly for France - see Marianne. The fact that she's called Liberty in the painting can't be that important, can it?--Nydas 11:10, 25 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Wrong revolution, even! This did not commemorate the French Revolution that Sfahey is thinking of. It's an excellent icon of nationalism, as Nydas points out --Wetman 09:08, 28 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Oops, you are so right. But that leads to another can of worms, re French Revolution, which I choose not to open.Sfahey 18:15, 29 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

One of the first nationalists?

I was watching a tv documentary on islam's muhammad and it was said that at one point he forced the different clans of "Medina"(or sth) to co-operate with the Constitution of Medina. could that be considered an example of early nationalism?

Language section - biased?

I think that the sentence "Some politicians, such as Pat Buchanan have consciously opposed the rise of Spanish as a second American language, for fear that it would undermine unity in the American national character." - seems biased.

Selecting Pat Buchanan, who's a bit of an extremist, to represent MANY politicians, on both sides of the aisle, who believe that a national language should be established, sends the message that the idea is extreme like he is.

Pictures

Ithink we should focus on adding more pictures as this is a area seriously lacking in this page. I was going to nominate this for Featured article but I do not believe the quality or amounts of pictures are justifiable. Felixboy 17:32, 5 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

You're absolutely correct, although it'll be a challenge finding a large number of uncontroversial pictures.--Nydas 17:24, 6 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Image at "Nationalism and extremism"

The image displayed near the section "Nationalism and extremism" has a comment "Killing of 5,000 Jews in Kaunas by Lithuanian nationalists in June 1941". The comment itself is not cited and is of very dubious nature. The events that it refers to were spontaneous, took place in some industrial garages and could have entailed about 50 Jewish victims, but 5000 is a very inaccurate and unfounded number.

Bias towards Flemish separatism

In the section Nationalism#Types_of_nationalism, subsection State nationalism, the author links 'Flemish separatists' to the article about the political party Vlaams Belang. Though this party certainly has Flemish independence as a major goal, not all Flemish separatists belong or support this party. Based on the controversy caused by this party (on grounds of racist policies) the author clearly tries to discredit all separatists by automatically linking them to Vlaams Belang. I therefore move that this link be changed. I see two possibilities as new links: either separate the link and link Flemish to Flanders and 'Separatists' to Separatism, or link to Flemish movement. The last solution would have as an advantage that immediately links to a more specific article, though because there is a possibility that the article might be merged in future, it might be better to use the first solution for the time being, until the possible merger is resolved. Any thoughts on which would be best? Or perhaps someone has another possible solution?

It would in that case be merged with Flemish independence - we could link to that. I do, however, think it should link to Flemish movement until that merge is finished - after all, we do not know what lies in the future! Jobjörn (Talk | contribs) 13:08, 20 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Changed the link to Flemish movement Lord Flashheart 15:34, 26 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Basque separatists

Linking basque separatism to ETA is quite a bold move. According to democratic states and Wikipedia itself, ETA is a TERRORIST group, although their aims are separatist they can not be representative of the basque separatist movement. I have replaced the link with Basque nationalism, which is a democratic movement quite representative of the feelings of many people.

Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Orcadian

A new user, User:Mallimak, is trying desperately to invent a new nationality (or perhaps ethnicity, it is unclear) called "Orcadian". Could some of you guys please look at his contributions, and especially his creation from a Redirect: Orcadian. Please see Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Orcadian. --Mais oui! 09:25, 13 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Portugal as the first European modern nation-state

May someone confirm if Portugal is the first European "modern" nation-state, by the ends of XIII century? Or at least as we may consider a "nation": with a defined territory, people, language, and a centralized government? And, if so, isn´t it worth to be cited in the article? Thanks. Tonyjeff 00:35, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The lists at the end

Historical effects of nationalism, nationalist movements, see also - do they actually add anything to the article? They could potentially grow to hundreds of entries each.--Nydas 14:28, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]