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Calling all Junta members
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: There is no rule. In practice the sysop who "actions" a VfD day has a degree of latitude with regard to which votes they choose to count as valid (a latitude mitigated by the inevitable recriminations should they be felt to misstep). Obvious sockpuppets tend to be discarded out of hand, and in general most other votes seem to count. An imperfect scheme for an imperfect world. -- [[User:Finlay McWalter|Finlay McWalter]] | [[User talk:Finlay McWalter | Talk]] 23:00, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
: There is no rule. In practice the sysop who "actions" a VfD day has a degree of latitude with regard to which votes they choose to count as valid (a latitude mitigated by the inevitable recriminations should they be felt to misstep). Obvious sockpuppets tend to be discarded out of hand, and in general most other votes seem to count. An imperfect scheme for an imperfect world. -- [[User:Finlay McWalter|Finlay McWalter]] | [[User talk:Finlay McWalter | Talk]] 23:00, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
::I agree with Finlay. Obvious sock puppets and anonymous votes are not counted. Unsigned votes are almost never counted (unless the admin decides to check the page history and try and find out who it was -- a rare thing, usually not done, I think, unless the vote might tip a page one way or the other). In general, any account that has not edited beyond voting on VFD is ignored (even if it can't be traced as a sock puppet to a particular user) under the reasonable (I think) assumption that it's either a sock puppet we haven't identified, or a banned user wreaking minor havoc. [[User:Jwrosenzweig|Jwrosenzweig]] 23:09, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
::I agree with Finlay. Obvious sock puppets and anonymous votes are not counted. Unsigned votes are almost never counted (unless the admin decides to check the page history and try and find out who it was -- a rare thing, usually not done, I think, unless the vote might tip a page one way or the other). In general, any account that has not edited beyond voting on VFD is ignored (even if it can't be traced as a sock puppet to a particular user) under the reasonable (I think) assumption that it's either a sock puppet we haven't identified, or a banned user wreaking minor havoc. [[User:Jwrosenzweig|Jwrosenzweig]] 23:09, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

== Calling all Junta members ==

<center><i>
'''Junta Oath'''
Out here in the wiki
I fight for my edits
I get my back into my reverting
I don’t need to quickpoll
To prove I’m right
I don’t need to be forgiven
</i></center>

All right members. Let's congregate at the usual place and time. We've got business to discuss, don't forget to switch codes every once in a while; we were almost found out last month.

Revision as of 01:07, 30 March 2004

Village pump sections
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[[da:Wikipedia:Landsbybr%F8nden]]

Template:Communitypage

Moved discussion

Questions and answers, after a period of inactivity, will be moved to other relevant sections of the wikipedia (such as the FAQ pages), placed in the Wikipedia:Village pump archive (if it is of general interest), or deleted (if it has no long-term value).

(New questions from JB82 moved to bottom of the page)

I got an Almanac here from Germany, 1980. The publishing house can't be found on the Internet; No idea what's happened to them. Anyway, my question:

The book consists mostly of tables and short descriptions/explanations of words. I don't think the content is reproducible in any other way, as the tables are usually made up of only few words. Can I quote stuff from there? One example would be Nobility, where I just expanded the list of nobility titles. Even if I wouldn't have used the book as reference, I doubt the table would have looked much different... so, what's the answer to this? The book is full of information that I could obtain otherwise (e.g. by compiling tables myself out of several other books or websites), so I don't really have an idea on what copyright says for this...

Oh, and it's only about text. I wouldn't dare to scan any image and put it on Wikipedia. :) -- Tomcat 11:32, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Under US law, lists of objective information are not subject to copyright. The matter was extensively considered in court some time ago, when the phone company tried to claim copyright on its telephone directories. Mkweise 17:04, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)
See Feist v. Rural →Raul654 17:19, Mar 28, 2004 (UTC)
However, the case you cite is a little more complicated than that. It is generally acknowledged that objective history and lists of facts are not subject to copyright. The issue in that case ievolved, as many such cases do, on the question of what "art" (so to speak)--that is, what (if anything) did the phone company add to the information that was not simply a compilation of fact. We need to be aware that in that case, the party defending against the phone company used the phone company's book as a jumping off point for their own research. Publishers of lists, maps, and such often put in harmless but bogus information to catch copiers. The defendant here laboriously affirmed each name, address and telephone number as accurate before including them in its own book. The phone company unsuccessfully alleged that even using their book as source material was a violation of copyright. So I would be cautious about cribbing a published list unless I also was certain that it was either public domain material or fair use. Cecropia 17:18, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)


Image Cache Problem?

I uploaded a new, larger version, of a file, Vassar_Logo.png, but it keeps displaying the old version.

The image page, has the updated image size, because the rectangle to show the image has expanded. but it fills in the old version. I see that the file size of the upload file matches the size of the original on my machine, so I know I uploaded the proper image.

18 hours have gone by and it is still using the old image. Is there a way to tell tell wikipedia to use the new image? NickP 11:41, Mar 28, 2004 (UTC)

It worked for me once I cleared the cache with the Shift-Reload forced reload. andy 12:18, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)


Is it just me, or is the watchlist feature broken?

For the last half hour or so, when trying to access my watchlist I get:

A database query syntax error has occurred. This could be because of an illegal search query (see Searching Wikipedia), or it may indicate a bug in the software. The last attempted database query was: 
 SELECT cur_namespace,cur_title,cur_comment, cur_id,   
 cur_user,cur_user_text,cur_timestamp,cur_minor_edit,cur_is_new FROM watchlist,cur USE INDEX  
(name_title_timestamp) WHERE wl_user=7534 AND (wl_namespace=cur_namespace OR 
 wl_namespace+1=cur_namespace) AND wl_title=cur_title AND cur_timestamp > '20040328001448' ORDER 
 BY cur_timestamp DESC
from within function "wfSpecialWatchlist". MySQL returned error "1030: Got error 28 from table handler". Mkweise 12:19, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Alfred hunt engineer in nigeria

I have recently recieved a e-mail about a cousin of mine and I don't know what to do it is from a attorney that is representing my cousin it seems that he and his whole family died over their in a car accident. he is looking for information to deal with the estate. is their any way you can check old records? we had no idea he died... can you help up Ron Hunt

I think this is a Nigerian scam (Nigeria seems to be the current capital of internet and telephone scams, I'm afraid). It's very unlikely that an attorney would email you without writing first. Be very aware that any confidential information you may give out may be used to defraud you or to obtain credit in your name. If you think there's any chance that this might be genuine, contact the Nigerian Embassy or Consulate nearest to you. They can verify the details of the persons death, and can confirm that the lawyer is who he says he is. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 17:14, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Details on this can be found at Nigerian scam. Jgm 17:17, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

English Versions

There are two main recognised ways of spelling English. British and American. I was wondering, is there any way of customising the spelling on the page so that a reader can automatically get his spelling as the case in date variations? Wiki programmers should take up this issue. Probably an array of words could be cross referenced. Nichalp

Automatic procedures and language don't go well together at present, and I don't think there is a simple find-and-replace that can shift between AE and BE; there is more to language than spelling, even though the difference between AE and BE is small. This subject is partly dealt with in the Wikipedia:Manual of Style, esp the section Usage and spelling. The convention seems to be consistent within articles. — Sverdrup 14:33, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
If the authors of word processors can find an acceptible solution to language translation, there's no reason why Wikipedia shouldn't incorporate the same. Although I agree that there is more than spelling to language variations, spelling differences are the most visible. Nichalp 18:55, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)
While it sounds relatively easy to convert color to colour or to delete an L in travelled, thinking the proposal through further reveals major problems: would you convert a textual quote from Shakespeare or the title of a U.S. tv program? I'd certainly hope not, so we'd need a <noUsUkconvert> tag. And the next request would be automatic conversion of punctuation rules, or of the which/that distinction that USians are so quick to stomp on but that UKians largely don't care about. I think our programmers' time could be more usefully spent pursuing other enhancements to the software. The use of different styles of English here isn't really a problem, so long as everyone – on both sides of the Atlantic and both sides of the Irish Sea, on the soft underbelly of Asia, and right round down under – learns to rejoice in diversity and respect the different ways of saying, and punctuating, the same thing.–Hajor 19:22, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Accessibility

I ran the wikipedia main page in [Bobby] which checks web pages for accessiblity issues.

  • It failed!!

I strongly feel that Wikipedia software writers should help make pages more accesibility friendly so that 'challenged people' should not have a problem. What do you think? Nichalp


Try the text-only version. Mkweise 20:40, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

For the record, I checked our main page for w3c compliance, and it failed. see here →Raul654 19:32, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)

HTML tags

I wish the authors of wiki software do add some more HTML tags & attributes. eg SPAN attrib:title

What's more is that it doesnt qualify as a clean page when I tried validating the main page in w3c.org page validation.

Nichalp

More important missing tags (to me) are <del> & <ins> for talk pages, and <acronym> & <abbr> for articles. — Jor (Talk) 20:51, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Skins

Hope Wiki guys can provide us more skins

Nichalp

It is rumored that there are people testing out new skins at the wikipedia test platform — Sverdrup 14:24, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

User:666

User:666 says on his User page, My edits are licensed under the BSD license.. Can someone tell us if this is compatible with the GFDL? RickK | Talk 21:02, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

As a matter of policy, it doesn't seem to me that a user can separately license his edits, as it would destroy the licensing integrity of any article the user made even a small edit to. If the is has any potential at all for legal conflict perhaps the boilerplate should read
All contributions to Wikipedia are released under the GNU Free Documentation License and no other conflicting license may be claimed. Cecropia 21:12, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)
He's just messing with you—when editing a page, a user accepts Wikipedia's license terms. But see fsf.org for their view of the BSD license if you're interested. Mkweise 21:14, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)
A writer retains rights to whatever they submit to Wikipedia, but they cannot then impose a more stringent copyright. If the writer submits the work to another site with a more stringent license, republishers of the second site with the savy to find the more lenient prior copyright can avoid the more stringent terms of the second restriction. However, if a writer decides to declare all of their contributions to Wikipedia to be public domain, the work can then be republished with no GNU restrictions. A writer may also resell their work, even though it is already published under GNU. If a naive publisher does not know the work is already available under a GNU license, the writer may earn income from the work, but the publisher may not then claim copyrights to the GNU work, except in so far as the publisher has formatted the writers original UNCOPYRIGHTED work. So Wikipedia puts a GNU stamp on whatever they get from a writer, but a writer may use that same work to seed whatever other copyrighted versions they care to create, if they can find a market for material very similar to something already available under GNU license. I hope this clarifies matters somewhat.
I believe there is a word to describe their behaviour, however it escapes me at the momement. Maximus Rex 21:15, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Possible problem with Opera browser and ”

I have observed the following on the danish wikipedia.

If a person is using Opera (7.23), the following is happening on a page when Save page is pushed:

Text as the following ”åben by” is changed to ?åben by?.

BrianHansen 21:07, 28 Mar 2004 (UTC) (http://da.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruger:BrianHansen)

Brian, there seem to be numerous problems with Opera 7.2x browsers (not, I believe, earlier ones). It seems to differ from other browsers with regard to some details of float css, it has some undoubted bugs calculating box widths where the box contains R-L languages like Hebrew and Arabic, and it's known to perform character-translations while doing form submissions (indeed, some subsequent poster on this page has inadvertently changed your original posting, likely because they did so with a late model Opera browser). All in all, fond though I am of Opera, I'd say 7.2x is broken and wikipedians use it here at their own risk. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 02:44, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
7.5 has no such problems fortunately. — Jor (Talk) 12:34, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Hungarian Counties

There is a new WikiProject called Wikipedia:WikiProject Historical Hungarian counties. This is similar to the historical Swedish provinces project. Anyone who wants to join may do so.

--Dagestan

Okay, here's the first one so far: Bihar

Uhhhhhh.....anyone?

Don't be disheartened. After all, one would reasonably expect many (most?) of the folks interested in Hungarian Counties to be Hungarians, and thus (generally) located in Hungaria (sic), and consequently tucked up, warm and snug, in bed. I'd give it a day or two (oh, and you should probably crosspost on the hungarian wikipedia's village pump too). -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 01:44, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
There is the chance that you may be the only contributor for that project for some time. I have experienced the same when I started a project on the provinces of Thailand, where I finally had to create all the articles myself - that was no problem, it only took longer to finish them. But you will experience at least one part of the wiki principle - spelling or grammar errors will be fixed, even if it's a more exotic topic. But don't let this stop you from pursuing with that project, quite the contrary - and maybe the already finished articles may attract new contributors later. andy 11:46, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Listing user subpages

Is there an easy way to list all subpages of a particular user page? Is using what links here from the user page reliable? In particular I'd like to list all subpages of User:Information-Ecologist and User:Information-Habitat (who may be the same person). The reason is that I've listed some of them for deletion but I seem to have missed at least one that should have been included, so the next step seems to be to get a list of them all. TIA Andrewa 00:50, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I might have answered this myself, or rather it was answered in the discussion at #Getting_a_complete_what_links_here_listing, see Wikipedia:SQL query requests. Andrewa 14:01, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Wikipedia on CD-rom

Is there a way to get a (snapshot of) Wikipedia on CD-rom? I know this is against the interactive nature of Wikipedia, but I would like to have it for my students without internet access. Anybody knows how it can be done? -- Kjetil Halvorsen

Kjetil, we don't have a great solution, but there are two schemes for static dumps, both described at Wikipedia:Database download. You might like to try the "terodump" thing, although I can't personally vouch for it. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 01:51, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)


Kobe Bryant's Accuser

There is now a page entitled Kobe Bryant's accuser. It does not currently include a name. I hope that we can have a debate about whether or not to include the woman's name at Talk:Kobe Bryant's accuser. moink 01:15, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

By copying and pasting rather than moving the page you have removed the history information and infringed the copyright of the contributors. Update: I see the history has been copied to the discussion page. Good enough. anthony (this comment is a work in progress and may change without prior notice) 01:19, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
FWIW, I found the name of the accuser in a matter of seconds through Google. Her name is already in the open, so why continue to hide it? — Jor (Talk) 12:32, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Possibly due to legal reasons in the US, but IANAL and I am not sure. Pfortuny 13:44, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
There was much discussion on VfD on this issue. - IMSoP 14:59, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
And there is currently much discussion on Talk:Kobe Bryant's accuser. If you have an opinion, please come post it there. moink 17:36, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Umm, above Anthony says that copying and pasting an article rather than moving results in a copyright infringement. I know that there are different views -- but if we take his position serious, most translations from one language wikipedia to another would be as un-lawful as mergers of articles. We should clarify our interpretation that this doesn't violate GNU FDL somewhere quite visible. -- till we *) 01:42, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
I'm not sure it is our interpretation that this doesn't violated GNU FDL. If you make a translation from another language wikipedia you should be crediting the authors in some way. If someone is seen doing this, it should be fixed. One of the solutions, as was done in this case, is to copy the history onto the talk page. While technically perhaps in violation, that at least is compliant with the spirit of the GFDL. anthony (this comment is a work in progress and may change without prior notice) 01:48, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
See Wikipedia talk:Submission Standards#Section 4B. Angela. 02:23, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)
What does this have to do with Section 4B? This is about 4I. Yes, wikipedia might also be in violation of section 4B, however there is also an argument that Wikipedians agree to release Wikipedia of that requirement. anthony (this comment is a work in progress and may change without prior notice) 02:26, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
I think the issue is about attributing authorship, so 4B is relevant. We don't have a history section, so 4I is irrelevant. There's nothing in wikipedia:copyrights which says the page history is equivalent to a history section. Angela. 02:44, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)
By not having a history section, Wikipedia is in technical violation of the GFDL. At least with the page history Wikipedia is in compliance with the spirit of section 4I, if not the letter of it (the only minor problems are that the section isn't entitled "History", but is entitled "Page History", and that the publisher is not listed, and the fact that the publisher is not listed is problably moot anyway because Wikipedia is the publisher, and they're not going to sue themselves). 4B is about attributing authorship, but Wikipedia is already in violation in letter and in spirit with it, so that's not relevant. anthony (this comment is a work in progress and may change without prior notice) 02:51, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Just for your information - this is hardly a new question, but it seems that some on English wikipedia say making clear where the text is from in summary comment area is enough.

There has been discussion on virtually the same question at Japanese Wikipedia over these three months. We may come to a concensus on one particular interpretation of GFDL so that there is enough clarity about what is okay and what is not.

Currently, it seems to me that we are going to say simple cut-n-pasting from one page to another is in violation. Some more details are in meta:User:Tomos/Legal discussion on Japanese Wikipedia#GFDL and Wikipedia in general.

If there is going to be any similar solution, I hope you can announce it at wikilegal-l so that we (en. and ja.) do not end up with having two incompatible interpretations.

We are also talking about the possibility to introduce within-site public domain license so that every edits after the introduction could become dual licensed and they can be archived, copied, translated, integrated, etc. without worrying strict compliance in GFDL. The gist of license is that the contributors allow any modification or reproduction of their contributions within wikipedia of any languages and possibly to other projects supported by Wikimedia Foundation.

Another solution is to introduce a new function by which a user can copy an entire page (text + history). See, meta:MediaWiki feature request and bug report discussion#Copy this page.

Tomos 03:34, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

The film of the book

When a book is adapted into a film should there be one article for the book and one for the film? Sometimes on Wikipedia theres one page for the film and one for the book (Trainspotting (movie) and Trainspotting (novel)). Sometimes there both covered in the same article (One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest). Is there a policy on this? My own personal view is that they should be in the same article unless theres a very big difference between them (although I admit that thats a very subjective question). Saul Taylor 06:37, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I agree with that. It of course depends on how faithful the film is to the book, and if differences can be addressed without taking over the entire article. — Jor (Talk) 12:31, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Wiki as Language Learning

I might have asked this before, but I don't remember receiving an answer--is there any special program for using Wikipedia as a way of learning foreign languages? (I am thinking specifically as a way of learning several languages simultaneously). Mjklin 15:04, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

No, but there are several language textbooks in progress at Wikibooks. Tuf-Kat 17:27, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)

Im looking fo an athelte

During the games there was a negro athelte in the 400 meters that when he got half way around pulled a muscle. He didnt stop he got up and limped to the finish. I was wandering if you had his name or any information for me where i could please find more out about this moving experince.

I really would like to hear anything you had or know please. I rember there was a commercial with Robin willams that featured this guy.

Thanks for your time

Matthew Scott

Matthewscott1@hotmail.com

  • This seems to match your description[1]. Niteowlneils 23:02, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Image Authorization

How can you get the right to use these images Boeing X-43 on Wikipedia in such a short notice? I am new at Wikipedia and would like to know how you get in touch with the owners, in this case NASA, and get their authorization so fast. Am I totally lost or what, please help me?

As I understand it, images on USA government sites (TLD .gov as in nasa.gov) are free for use. A note of course should be given where it is from on the image page. — Jor (Talk) 16:22, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
One should be careful though; all images which credit only NASA are PD. NASA may however include pics from individual astronomers/space agencies in their articles, and they are not free, just like our 'fair use' images are not GFDL — Sverdrup 19:29, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
If you do find that permission is needed, check out Wikipedia:Boilerplate request for permission. -- Wapcaplet 23:32, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Log-in problems?

A couple times already today I found I was logged-out for no apparent reason. Did anything change on the Wikipedia end (in other words, is this affecting more people)? — Jor (Talk) 16:49, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

  • It was happening (often) to me, so I finally used the 'remember across sessions' checkbox so it's not happening any more. Niteowlneils 23:09, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Wikipedia jabber chat room.

After setting up a chatroom for the Italian Wikipedia comunity on Jabber (Free and Open Source Instant Messenger) I noticed that the majority of the people that enter the room asking for information are English speakers. So here we are: I made another chatroom en.wiki@muc.jabber.org with the purpose to host the English Comunity chats. You are all welcome to give discuss the concerns and problems of wikipedia and give advise to the chat voyageurs that enter the room. I think it is a good way to find new adepts, what do you think about it?

Schopenhauer 17:21, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I think this might fragment the #wikipedia IRC room, but hey some people hate IRC, so it might be a good idea. Dori | Talk 17:35, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)

Searching

Is the text search of Wikipedia permeanently disabled? Every single time I go to use it, it says:

"Sorry! Full text search has been disabled temporarily, for performance reasons. In the meantime, you can use the Google or Yahoo! searches below. Note that their copies of Wikipedia content may be out of date."

Or am I doing something wrong? LUDRAMAN | T 17:31, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

It was disabled prior to the arrival of the new (fast) servers, but has not been re-enabled. — Jor (Talk) 17:37, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Suggested changes to wikipedia:Copyrights

Pursuant to a related discussion on #wp (b/t sethIlys & imran), here is a suggestion for improving compliance of well-meaning parties with our copright reqs:

  • Move the following bits from the 'Example notice section up to the top, above the TOC and after the first introductory sentence:

Here is an example notice which complies with the GFDL, for an article that uses the Wikipedia article Foo. Note that it links directly to a copy of both the GFDL and the article:

This article is licensed under the <a href="http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html">GNU Free Documentation License</a>. It uses material from the <a href="http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foo">Wikipedia article "Foo"</a>.

("Foo" and the Wikipedia URL must of course be changed to match the article you are using.)

For other acceptable notice formats, and more information on your rights and responsibilities under our copyright license, read on.

  • Then change the Example notice header to say "Copyright Notices and Citations" and include a couple lines referring back to the intro and mentioning alternate notice formats in general, also merging in some info about how to cite sections taken from WP articles.

+sj+ 18:03, 2004 Mar 29 (UTC)

Table tutorial

Recently, someone came up with the brilliant idea of the Wikipedia:Picture_tutorial. Could someone do the same for tables? I'm totally confused here, and I'm sure there are many other Wikipedians who would appreciate one as well. LUDRAMAN | T 20:03, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

see m:Wiki markup tables. IMHO the image tutorial should be moved to meta too. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:09, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
oops, m:MediaWiki User's Guide: Using tables -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 20:58, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
Well, it' good to hear that someone liked my picture tutorial :) →Raul654 20:47, Mar 29, 2004 (UTC)
IMO all the tutorials inc. the picture and table tutorials should be put on the Wikipedia:Tutorial so you have one main tutorial instead of lots of scattered ones. What do other users think? LUDRAMAN | T 21:13, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Who can nominate for deletion?

I'm sure I've seen something written about who can nominate for deletion, and who can vote on VfD, but I can't actually find the reference to it, if it exists. Anyone? DJ Clayworth 22:51, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

There is no rule. In practice the sysop who "actions" a VfD day has a degree of latitude with regard to which votes they choose to count as valid (a latitude mitigated by the inevitable recriminations should they be felt to misstep). Obvious sockpuppets tend to be discarded out of hand, and in general most other votes seem to count. An imperfect scheme for an imperfect world. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 23:00, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)
I agree with Finlay. Obvious sock puppets and anonymous votes are not counted. Unsigned votes are almost never counted (unless the admin decides to check the page history and try and find out who it was -- a rare thing, usually not done, I think, unless the vote might tip a page one way or the other). In general, any account that has not edited beyond voting on VFD is ignored (even if it can't be traced as a sock puppet to a particular user) under the reasonable (I think) assumption that it's either a sock puppet we haven't identified, or a banned user wreaking minor havoc. Jwrosenzweig 23:09, 29 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Calling all Junta members

Junta Oath
Out here in the wiki
I fight for my edits
I get my back into my reverting
I don’t need to quickpoll
To prove I’m right
I don’t need to be forgiven

All right members. Let's congregate at the usual place and time. We've got business to discuss, don't forget to switch codes every once in a while; we were almost found out last month.

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