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October 27

WP:RSP table loss of color

Is it just me or is the table background color all the same color? It's supposed to have a different background color, but it's showing up in the same color even if I check several different recent revs. Graywalls (talk) 00:21, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@Graywalls: Looks like this diff, which adds a sticky header class, removed the cell background colours. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 02:33, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

I think I got it back to how it was before... did I restore it correctly? Since there's been no consensus, I think it should stay this way. Graywalls (talk) 03:15, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Updating/Adding photos & description to Australian Big things

What is the simplest way to add/update photos and description to Australian Big things? I have only been able to see information in relation to creating articles. Little Shan (talk) 00:57, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Little Shan, if you think that a photograph that you took would benefit the article Big things (Australia), then you go to c:Special:UploadWizard and carefully follow what this tells you. -- Hoary (talk) 02:11, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@Little Shan Thanks for uploading your photo File:Big Redback Spider.jpg. Images of items like sculptures can be tricky because in some countries a work like that is considered the copyright of the artist and your photo would be what is called a derivative work. Fortunately, in Australia there is an exemption called freedom of panorama. I've added that tag to your file, as you'll see on its page on Commons. You can add that tag if you decide to upload similar photos later. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:00, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the information:) out of interest how long generally does it take before I’ll see the Big Red Back appear in the list of Big Things Western Australian? 2001:8003:840A:5B00:14ED:CF56:1748:C817 (talk) 23:43, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

If you register to Wikipedia, be bold and add that image to the article where proper. 2601AC47 (talk) 23:48, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Share the same IP Address as a notorious sock puppet

I'm scared. As a new user to Wikipedia, I'm still warming up to the rules and what not, but that's when I discovered the term "sockpuppet" which is apparently used on people who make multiple accounts to use edits. This is my first account ever, I've just started editing on Wikipedia today, but just to be safe, I looked at my IP Address and came to the realization that a sockpuppet shares it. This is scaring me. I've never had an account on Wikipedia and am just here to fix some articles that weren't in the best of condition. What can be done about this kind of thing? Am I a sockpuppet for sharing an IP address with a nefarious editor, who my guess, is using a VPN? Am I gonna get banned now? ThePainkiller90 (talk) 02:29, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi! Welcome to Wikipedia, we're so excited to have you here!!

The important thing is that no, you won't get in trouble just for sharing the same IP as a vandal or sockmaster (someone who runs sockpuppets) - especially now that you have made an account.

From our policy on investigating sock puppets: "An editing pattern match is the important thing; the IP match is really just extra evidence (or not)."

If you have any other questions please don't hesitate to ask here, at the teahouse or at my talk page. :) MolecularPilot 02:34, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Now, that's relieving! I was scared for a second there, haha. Thanks for your kind words and I'll continue to look around and read on Wikipedia's policies. I just learned how to do citations and did one for myself, so I'm getting there in terms of being a good editor. ThePainkiller90 (talk) 02:41, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@ThePainkiller90: Welcome to Wikipedia. It's very likely you're on a dynamic IP, which can change users every once in a while. I wouldn't worry about it; just remember to adhere to the policies and guidelines. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 02:41, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Political bias

Why does Trump's page have so many negative facts and Kamala's page praise her and all she did to fight Trump? 2600:6C60:5400:ACF:DAA6:1E15:9708:6A3D (talk) 12:30, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Please address concerns about an article to its talk page, such as Talk:Kamala Harris Talk:Donald Trump. If you find that sources are not being accurately summarized, please detail the specific errors. If sources are being accurately summarized, but are in error or you disagree with what they say, you'll have to take that up with the sources. 331dot (talk) 12:51, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Why does Trump do so many negative things? Clarityfiend (talk) 10:02, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

article

Hi i had nominated this article Talk:Battle of Thorgo for GAN previously and was a failed. I had done quite many edits keeping in view the problems pointed out and later tagged the Reviewer, he said that there were still sentence structure issues and the block quotes should be summarized, I'm unable figure out how can i solve this ?

Another thing that I was wondering if I could add upload image taken from book for under the license "With a photograph, copyright subsists until 50 years from the beginning of the calendar year next following the year in which the photograph is first published." As per rules written in

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Copyright_rules_by_territory/Pakistan

any picture from books can be uploaded? Example from this book which was published in 1970

https://books.google.com.pk/books/about/Raiders_in_Kashmir.html?id=Ab8tWjdbWf4C&redir_esc=y

Rahim231 (talk) 13:11, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

There are some odd things in Battle of Thorgo. There are three very similar maps of the site of the ambush. There's an officer whose name is sometimes "Cootes" and sometimes "Coutts", while he's sometimes a major and sometimes a colonel. There's a statement that the relief column, while under cover of darkness, stopped for lunch. There are two similar versions of the final paragraph of the article. Maproom (talk) 14:47, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Haha forgot to remove that previous version of paragraph. I have kept Major and Coutts spelling since that's what their side calls him. I have also removed a map, wasn't looking odd until you pointed out. Thanks a lot, if you find any other issue please inform me. Rahim231 (talk) 20:00, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Copyright questions require rather specialised knowledge to answer, so they are better raised at WP:MCQ. ColinFine (talk) 17:39, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Sure I'll ask it here. Thanks. Rahim231 (talk) 20:01, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Would this past muster with WP:BANDMEMBER?

Hi friends, hoping to get some opinions here on whether or not this person would pass WP:BANDMEMBER notability guidelines.

The subject in question is a singer who recently left their band due to controversy and fan bullying. My first thought was "no way this meets WP:BANDMEMBER" but I keep seeing significant coverage about the subject himself and now I'm like "weelllll..... maybe."

A lot of the coverage is large pieces on the subject, examining the cultural expectations of K-pop idols within South Korea, the circumstances surrounding his exit, and what is perceived by some as a toxic cancel culture within the industry as a whole.

Examples: NBC News, South China Morning Post, The Express Tribune, Resonate Magazine, Times Now, Manila Standard, The Post

I'm going back and forth on the question, so I just wanted to get some second opinions to see if I'm way off base before I put some effort into writing an article that will just end up at AfD. Thoughts? RachelTensions (talk) 14:37, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@RachelTensions You clearly have plenty of decent sources that would normally be fine for WP:NBIO, ignoring his specific band history. The problem is that it now falls foul of WP:BLP1E if all the furore is coming about because he was fired from the band. Let's see what other editors here think. You could always write up something via WP:AfC, which would get expert eyes on your draft. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:06, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@Michael D. Turnbull Thanks for your input. I thought about WP:BLP1E but thought it might not be applicable because he is notable as a member of his band in addition to this event.

Anyway, happy to have more opinions. I'm not bothered either way, but I'd hate to put effort into an article that will immediately fail at AfD because I was off with my interpretation of the guidelines. RachelTensions (talk) 15:14, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

My 2c is an article is definitely called for. Whether it would pass muster with the community I don't know, but my guess would be yes, because:

• WP:BIO (basically WP:GNG) is the operative rule, trumping WP:BANDMEMBER. And there's no question that the guy passes BIO and punts it thru the goalpoasts.
• Sure its a WP:BLP1E, but that is not necessarily a deal killer, depending on how notable/important the one event (that is why we have articles on Arthur Bremer and so on).
• And I would not judge this event to not be emphemeral at all: it ties in with larger issues of K-Pop operations and public facing, and 21st century Korean culture and world pop culture generally. Some non-zero number of people will probably want to read about in future years on those grounds.
• And beyond the one event, his band looks pretty notable. That is not an automatic in, but it doesn't hurt, and I would expect that there are Korean fanzines etc. that have some coverage of the guy generally -- favorite color, that sort of thing -- you can find using google translation. Coverage is coverage, teen-girl-oriented websites are judged mostly by their reliability and circulation, not how important they are to the scientific community etc. (Altho you will run into people who disagree.)

Bottom line, IMO yes we want this article, we need this article, we would be grateful if you volunteered to create this article, and it should pass muster easily. My 2c. Herostratus (talk) 17:54, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Fatal exception of type "InvalidArgumentException" on Wikipedia UI

For the past day at least I've had a pending notification on my Wikipedia UI. When I click through to it, it says no notifications are available. Then when I click on "all notifications", I get this:

[e5e4adfc-8db0-4c19-acbd-43f4a3cd84ae] 2024-10-27 17:51:35: Fatal exception of type "InvalidArgumentException"

Logging in and out and trying different browsers has no effect. It seems to be a back end issue with PHP. How do I fix this and clear this? -- Very Polite Person (talk) 17:53, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

@Very Polite Person Several others have reported this: see Wikipedia:Village pump (technical)#Notices not working for the latest details. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:39, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks! -- Very Polite Person (talk) 17:34, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Quotes + Italics

Hey y'all, I have a pretty specific style question about quotes/italics/foreign languages, feel free to send me elsewhere if this isn't the place to ask.

I'm using a quote in an article (Cady Noland), the full portion being used is as follows: "serve as a kind of 'flag manqué'"

Running into a bit of trouble as the single apostrophe quotes around "flag manqué" are from the source, but the MOS says foreign words like manqué should be italicized. When I try and italicize the word "manqué," though, the additional apostrophe sourced from the text disappears.

Here's how it renders: "serve as a kind of 'flag ''[[manqué]]'''"

When formatting something like this, what's more important, the apostrophe from the quote or the italics for the foreign language word? Or is there a workaround to get the italics to work without swallowing up the closing apostrophe quote?

Thanks! 19h00s (talk) 18:29, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Presuming French:

serve as a kind of '{{lang|fr|flag manqué}}' → serve as a kind of 'flag manqué'

When marking up non-English text, use the appropriate {{lang}} template so that browsers and screen readers know how to properly render/pronounce the non-English text.

I nowiki'd your example because bad formatting is bad formatting and that breaks some users' syntax highlighting.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:18, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! 19h00s (talk) 19:36, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

19h00s, a general related tip: for English language text requiring italicisation plus apostrophe, Template:' will output an apostrophe, and {{em}} will italicise the text passed to it. Some combination of these templates should always let you avoid the unmatched triple apostrophe that breaks formatting, even when a {{lang}} template does not apply (and, in case anyone wonders, {{lang|en}} retains the standard upright text styling). Folly Mox (talk) 20:11, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

You should only use {{em}} for text that is to be emphasized, as it produced the em HTML tag. If you need to italicize text for other reasons, use the normal double single quote wikitext, which produces i. -- Maddy from Celeste (WAVEDASH) 10:34, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Good point; I forgot about that. Folly Mox (talk) 10:45, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Header for non-numbered archives

Is there a variant of {{archive}} that generates links to adjacent monthly, non-numbered archive pages of the sort indexed by {{Archives by months}} (like Wikipedia talk:Deletion review/Archives/2020/September)? Or, failing that, at least one that would let me manually put in links to the next and previous archive pages as parameters? —Cryptic 22:45, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Im having trouble to move an article called 'Vetëvendosje'. So i need help..

It would be more correct to use the full name of this known kosovan party, actualy the leading party of the Kosovan government, like it has been the case for all other kosovan parties as far i saw.. The full name is this: 'Lëvizja Vetëvendosje' (Vetëvendosje, in itself means self-determination, without its explanatory part its non-sense)..

So It could be 'The Self-determination Movement' or 'Lëvizja Vetëvendosje'. Otherwise the name is half-hearted..

I am more known and active in the albanian wikipedia, If someone helps, i appriciate it. Leutrim.P (talk) 23:36, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

Leutrim.P I see you have moved the article yourself. I would have suggested a discussion at the article talk page first as other editors may disagree. TSventon (talk) 23:58, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

So i should of have started this same topic there?! Leutrim.P (talk) 23:59, 27 October 2024 (UTC)

I started it i hope someone responds to the discussion.. Talk:The Self-determination Movement#Moving 'Vetëvendosje' to 'The Self-determination Movement'??, thanks for the fast response. Leutrim.P (talk) 00:04, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

It is better to use WP:RM if the move is likely to be controversial, I don't know if that is likely. If another editor disagrees, they may move it back. TSventon (talk) 00:12, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

October 28

Is there a way to grab the theme choice of a user for template purposes?

There must be a way to know which theme a user is using. Is there a template or something? Just curious. Cessaune [talk] 06:26, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@Cessaune: Do you mean the skin? You cannot know the skin for performance reasons. It would require multiple versions of the page to be cached if the produced wikitext is different. With TemplateStyles you can use skin-specific classes to make code which only styles a chosen skin. See for example body.skin-monobook and body.skin-timelessin Template:Fake heading/styles.css. PrimeHunter (talk) 09:58, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

This is definitely helpful, but I mean the dark/light theme. Cessaune [talk] 10:29, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

I guess last month's thread on this topic wasn't helpful enough? I don't see that you've asked at VPT in the interim (a search for your username in the archives returned no hits), but you've already got PrimeHunter in this thread; few if any editors are more technically knowledgeable about the software, so maybe he can give a definitive answer this time. Folly Mox (talk) 10:59, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@Cessaune is there something specific about the dark mode you wish to resolve? – robertsky (talk) 10:59, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@Cessaune: Wikipedia:Theme usually refers to skins. Light/dark is called mode. The situation is similar to skins. You cannot know the mode but you can use TemplateStyles to target it. MediaWiki's Light/Dark setting for Vector 2022 and the mobile version gives classes which can be targeted with html.skin-theme-clientpref-day (rarely used) and html.skin-theme-clientpref-night. See mw:Recommendations for night mode compatibility on Wikimedia wikis. Search for examples. Other desktop skins currently have no dark mode made by MediaWiki and neither of the classes are present. The English Wikipedia has made an older "Dark mode toggle" at Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-gadgets but it can only be enabled by registered users and works differently. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:10, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

The article about us is wrong

Hallo

the article about us : Bellona Foundation - Wikipedia really needs an update. It contains a lot of outdated - and wrong- information. How can this be done? Can we do the edit ourselves?

Signy

Head of Communications

Bellona SF Bellona (talk) 10:17, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

SF Bellona, thank you for asking. Best is to make one or more edit requests at Talk:Bellona Foundation. Please provide references to published sources (sources that generally should be independent of the Foundation). -- Hoary (talk) 11:35, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

SF Bellona, please see Wikipedia:Plain and simple conflict of interest guide for the rules we'd like you to follow. For basic factual information (like number of employees, current officers, revenue), sources published by your own organisation are acceptable per WP:SELFSOURCE. Anything beyond the basic facts meeting the six criteria listed at that uppercase link— that will require third-party sourcing, as Hoary mentions above. Folly Mox (talk) 12:42, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

You added "We are solutions-oriented and have a systems-thinking and scientific approach to assess the economics, climate impacts and technical feasibility of the climate actions we need." That is absolutely 100% inappropriate promotional editing and your user name suggests a conflict which you need to disclose ASAP. Theroadislong (talk) 12:53, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Yikes! Save the ad copy for grant proposals: this is an obsolete portal speedy deletion criterion an encyclopaedia! Folly Mox (talk) 13:05, 28 October 2024 (UTC) edited 12:26, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

@Folly Mox: I assume you meant to link to WP:5P1 – WP:P1 is an obsolete portal speedy deletion criterion. jlwoodwa (talk) 18:57, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Yep 🫠 Fixed. Folly Mox (talk) 20:59, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Concerning MOS: PRONPLACEMENT

Hello.

I have encountered this unique case in a BLP's lead where the person has (a) a stage name different from the actual name, where (b) all words in both names have pronunciations obvious from their respective spellings, except for (c) a common word having a pronunciation that is not-so-obvious. I am seeking clarification on MOS:PRONPLACEMENT regarding situations like this.

That is exactly the case with one article I'm currently working on, which is Glaiza de Castro. She is one of those people with a separate stage name who has a single word (Glaiza) with varying pronunciations (as tested with some of my friends from abroad and text-to-speech voices) present in both legal and stage name while all other words (de, Castro, Galura, Rainey) are obvious from their spellings.

The lead's first sentence currently reads: "Glaiza Castro Galura-Rainey (born January 21, 1988), professionally known by her stage name Glaiza de Castro (Tagalog: [ˈglɐjsa dɛ ˈkaːs.tɾo]), is a Filipino actress."

I plan to remove the [dɛ ˈkaːs.tɾo] part of the IPA transcription since "de Castro" has a generally obvious pronunciation. From here, I am stumped. If only the [ˈglɐjsa] part (for "Glaiza") were to remain, there are two possible ways to place the IPA: (a) after "Glaiza Castro Galura-Rainey", her full name OR (b) after "Glaiza de Castro", her stage name.

MOS:PRONPLACEMENT states that "Opening of lead — Transcriptions are frequently placed immediately after the head words of the article in dictionary format". What are the "head words" in this case? Do they refer to her actual name, "Glaiza Castro Galura-Rainey", or her WP:COMMONNAME or stage name, "Glaiza de Castro"?

I appreciate and look forward to your guidance in rare cases like this lead. Thanks! Ramkarlo82 (talk) 11:55, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Ramkarlo82, for multiple varying pronunciations of Glaiza, you can follow the guidance under the § Footnote subheading at the uppercase shortcut you've linked. While the term head words unambiguously refers to the first bolded words opening an article, in this case the head words of the article – Glaiza Castro Galura-Rainey – do not match the article title Glaiza de Castro (since July 2020). Since you're only planning on providing pronunciation guides for the subject's forename (consistent across personal and professional names), you could either leave the {{IPA}} transclusion where it is after the article title; or move it up, placed immediately following the opening words, consistent with MOS guidance. Folly Mox (talk) 13:01, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@Folly Mox, thank you. I actually add that I'm not adding the variation transcriptions of "Glaiza" but rather only have the widely prevailing one there (as currently reflected in the article). Following your advice in a while to move the IPA transcription up after the opening words. Ramkarlo82 (talk) 13:10, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Help in re-reviewing an article

Hello, is it possible for someone to re-review Global Ikhwan child abuse scandal? It has been in start class for a while now. N niyaz (talk) 12:48, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

You are free to review it yourself. Theroadislong (talk) 12:51, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Tak nak N niyaz (talk) 13:10, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

N niyaz, WP:RATER suggests B-Class. Installing Rater and using the default suggestions and edit summary can avoid the impression of personal bias towards articles you've contributed heavily to. Folly Mox (talk) 13:10, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you for the help everyone!! N niyaz (talk) 13:21, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Asking for help in 2001:2D8:0:0:0:0:0:0/32 range.

I'm the person who made User_talk:2001:2D8:E3EE:CB33:31BD:9EB7:3411:C2EC this unblock request, and I'm at home now. I can edit wikipedia or create an account now, but I feel worried about all the other editors in that range, since this range is a SK telecom, a South Korean carrier's entire IP range and it has millions of people on it. I think this block should be reduced in scope/duration. I intended to post it on WP:ANI but that page seems to be protected, so I leave a message here. I will be grateful if someone forwards this message to appopriate board. 221.148.179.216 (talk) 13:29, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

The same issue as WP:T-MOBILE likely applies, mobile carriers with frequently changing IPs would be difficult to limit collateral on. I'm not on the account creation team any more due to inactivity but I understand they are still processing requests fairly fast these days (which is pretty much the reason for the inactivity), and a generic vandalism rangeblock is something they will ignore, so if any of those millions of people aren't able to get to a network that isn't blocked, they should be able to have an account created within a few days or less. Alpha3031 (t • c) 14:15, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

I want to add a bio of my community king

I want to put a citation of my king here on Wikipedia Lan4sure (talk) 13:36, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @Lan4sure.

If your "community king" (whatever that means) is notable in Wikipedia's special sense - roughly, that there has been enough independent reliably published material about him to base an article on - then Wikipedia could have an article about him. Note that nothing written, published, commissioned, or based on the words of, him or his associates, would be relevant to that question: Wikipedia has little interest in what the subject of an article says or wants to say about themselves, or what their associates say about them. Wikipedia is almost entirely interested in what people who have no connection with the subject, and who have not been prompted or fed information on behalf of the subject, have chosen to publish about the subject in reliable sources. If enough material is cited from independent sources to establish notability, a limited amount of uncontroversial factual information may be added from non-independent sources.

If he does not meet those criteria, then it would be a waste of time for anybody to try and create an article on him.

If he does meet the criteria, then somebody could. Ideally, this would not be you (or anybody else in the community) because of your conflict of interest. You may post a request for an article at WP:RA - but, frankly, the chances of a volunteer picking up your request are probably not large.

You are not forbidden from trying to create an article about him; but writing an article is extremely hard for new editors, and even harder when they have a conflict of interest. My earnest advice to new editors is to not even think about trying to create an article until you have spent several weeks - at least - learning about how Wikipedia works by making improvements to existing articles. Once you have understood core policies such as verifiability, neutral point of view, reliable, independent sources, and notability, and experienced how we handle disagreements with other editors (the Bold, Revert, Discuss cycle), then you might be ready to read your first article carefully, and try creating a draft.

I recommend you also read an article about yourself isn't necessarily a good thing ColinFine (talk) 14:18, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Can I edit an article of myself, when some info is missing?

Can I do that when people don't know some things about me, so that I can add more info? Gnu779 (talk) 14:11, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Please read WP:AUTOPROB.

In short: you should not edit an article about yourself, but you are welcome to raise edit requests for changes to the article.

But note that the article should not contain one single thing that is not verifiable from a published source. Your knowledge, even about yourself, is irrelevant unless readers can in principle go and look up the source and verify the information. ColinFine (talk) 14:20, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Looking to edit/add to Charlotte Hornets wiki page

I work for the Hornets and I am looking to add/change the ownership group on the Charlotte Hornets Wikipedia page. Mramirez1979 (talk) 14:30, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Please read WP:PAID for the guidelines on paid editing if you have been contracted to write the article, and read WP:COI for guidelines on conflict of interest. Edits to the Charlotte Hornets page by editors with a COI should be made on the talk page (Talk:Charlotte Hornets) and must be verifiable to a third-party source - there must be a third party to prove any claim before it gets added to the article. GeorgeMemulous (talk) 14:36, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Where are user's uploaded images?

I uploaded image some time ago, spotted mistake/misspelling today, corrected it but can't see it any more. It's gone. Now, I can't 'edit' it (I mean upload corrected version), nor delete, nor anything.

I could upload new one, but can't see the point if there is old one, to be corrected. It can also be deleted, but I cannot see it at all. Like all my uploads' list is empty. Osetnik (talk) 17:14, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Only thing I can see is that you uploaded this to Commons (not Wikipedia) - X201 (talk) 17:19, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@ 109.245.35.63 (talk) 17:16, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

That's it, but I cannot see that from user/contributions/uploads.

I can see nothing.

Where did you find it?

And, as it's been found, how does one edit/correct it? All I can see is description edit box. Osetnik (talk) 17:58, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Last question is answered - found Upload a new version of this file at the bottom of the page. Osetnik (talk) 18:17, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

@Osetnik: Files uploaded to Commons can be shown in Wikipedia but Commons and Wikipedia have separate logs. If you find a Contributions link in the interface then it only applies to the wiki you are at. commons:Special:Contributions/Osetnik and commons:Special:ListFiles/Osetnik show the upload. PrimeHunter (talk) 01:15, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Cross-language articles with many-to-one correspondence?

Is there a way to report cases where there is one article in one language and two articles in another? The English article dignity links to the German article [de:Würde] (the literal translation), but I think it should link to [de:Menschenwürde] (human dignity, as opposed to dignity for animals, etc.). I've noticed this problem for a few philosophical/religious topics with the boundary-work delineation problem. Is there a particular help page or project I should be viewing? 100.19.66.49 (talk) 17:18, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello. On Wikidata (which is where most interlanguage links are implemented) this is known as the "Bonnie & Clyde problem". The main current approach is explained on d:WD:Sitelinks to redirects. The other approach sometimes used is WP:LOCALLINK ColinFine (talk) 17:29, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Formatting a link to an author-published copy of a journal article

Hi, another formatting question here!

I'm citing a journal article from the 1990s that's only available online via a PDF copy uploaded by one of the work's authors. I presume that it's not a copyright violation to link to the PDF version, as the copyright owner is the one who published it there. But how should I format the URL within the journal citation? Should I just include the link in the url value without any additional formatting, or does there need to be some sort of identifier to note that it's not a link to the original publication entity?

Here's the full citation for the article, and the links for the author-uploaded version I've been referencing. Any help is appreciated, and feel free to send me elsewhere if this isn't the right forum. Thanks!

• Kremer, Mark; van Winkel, Camiel (January 1994). "'Metal is a major thing, and a major thing to waste': Interview with Cady Noland". Archis (in Dutch and English) (1). Amsterdam: Netherlands Architecture Institute: 75–80. ISSN 0921-8041. OCLC 13226833.
• Link for the PDF version, freely available via Camiel van Winkel's website.

19h00s (talk) 17:43, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

There are those who will tell you that interviews are not WP:RS. Is Archis really a scholarly or academic journal? Or is it a magazine or some other kind of periodical? I suspect the latter. So, were I writing a template for that source, I'd likely write:

{{cite interview |interviewer-last=Kremer |interviewer-first=Mark |interviewer-last2=van Winkel |interviewer-first2=Camiel |subject-first=Cady |subject-last=Noland |date=January 1994 |magazine=Archis |issue=1 |pages=75–80 |title=Metaal is iets substantieels, net als de verspilling ervan: Interview met Cady Noland |trans-title=Metal is a major thing, and a major thing to waste: Interview with Cady Noland |url=https://user.fm/files/v2-161a7d7f64c80df65cde1af998fce507/CADYNOLANDINTERVIEW.pdf |oclc=13226833 |language=nl, en}}

Noland, Cady (January 1994). "Metaal is iets substantieels, net als de verspilling ervan: Interview met Cady Noland" [Metal is a major thing, and a major thing to waste: Interview with Cady Noland] (PDF). Archis (Interview) (in Dutch and English). No. 1. Interviewed by Kremer, Mark; van Winkel, Camiel. pp. 75–80. OCLC 13226833.

I left out |issn= because that is a mostly pointless parameter; |location= and |publisher= because periodical citations typically omit them; |via= because the delivery service (https://user.fm/) seems to be just an unnamed dumping ground for files that users don't care to host at their own websites.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 18:44, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, not gonna argue on the RS thread, this source is referenced and cited in at least 5 other reliable, notable publications (ARTnews, Artforum, NYTimes, etc.). I originally read it as an excerpted re-print in a book published by Bard College's Center for Curatorial Studies. I just wanted to be able to correctly attribute the original source, with notes referencing where it was quoted in other sources.

Thank you for answering my question: there is no need to add any additional identifiers for the link hosted on a site that isn't the original publisher. 19h00s (talk) 19:04, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Banned user just continued editing without being signed-in as an IP

Hello, a recently banned Wikipedia user has started editing again as an IP without signing-in. How can I prevent them from doing-so? MaplesyrupSushi (talk) 19:20, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

You can ask an admin to block the IP. Readingpro256 _{talk to me contribs} 20:35, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

If it's simple vandalism, you can report at WP:AIV. If it's ban evasion but not simple vandalism, then WP:SPI is a more appropriate venue. --Chris | Crazycomputers (talk) 20:46, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

How do I create a location map like this?

How do I create location maps like this? Do I just cite the source in the photo description when uploaded? or is there anything more I need to know? Ras al Ghoul (talk) 19:25, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Have a look at Wikipedia:Maps for Wikipedia for information on how to do so. Generally speaking, they are locator maps. 2601AC47 (talk) 13:13, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks. Ras al Ghoul (talk) 13:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Uploading a picture

I have been attempting to upload a photo I took and it's been over an our and every attempt has been met with failure, I have been using unique names even those recommended and no luck, what can I do? Krys Cee (talk) 20:35, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Are you receiving a specific error message when this happens? Otherwise it might be hard to say what the exact problem is. See also WP:UPIMAGE.--♦IanMacM♦ ^{(talk to me)} 20:40, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi Krys Cee. It appears from [1] that you tried to use an upload option while editing a page. That method has restrictions. If you will release the photo with a free license and it isn't a photo of a copyrighted work then try uploading at commons:Special:UploadWizard, and insert it in the page later. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:45, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Find real full names

Hi, I discovered on Wikipedia that some Indian characters have only initials in their names (for example K. S. Puttaswamy and G. Puttaswamy Gowda)! I can't find their full names anywhere! Where can I find them?! Do you know?! Thank you! 78.211.32.145 (talk) 23:29, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Do you mean these two: K. S. Puttaswamy and G. Puttaswamy Gowda? 2601AC47 (talk) 23:31, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

These are usually people from the south, especially Tamil Nadu and Karnataka, and often they go exclusively by the initials to the point where there is no way to find their full names. If you can find them, feel free to add them to the articles! Readingpro256 _{talk to me contribs} 00:29, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Only add the names if you have a published reliable source, and if they are living then see Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons#Privacy of personal information and using primary sources. PrimeHunter (talk) 01:08, 29 October 2024 (UTC).

I received a time limited email requesting a donation. I was not able to respond during the timed email. Is it possible for you to send it to me again when I have time to respond?

I tried to create am account but was not able to satisfy the info. 2600:8807:40C7:5E00:4599:6A8D:18B6:8089 (talk) 23:32, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

Please do not include contact details in your questions. We are unable to provide answers by any off-wiki medium and this page is highly visible across the internet. The details have been removed, but if you want them to be permanently removed from the page history, please email oversight-llists.wikimedia.org. 2601AC47 (talk) 23:45, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

This sounds like a scam to me. 331dot (talk) 23:47, 28 October 2024 (UTC)

If you want to donate, please use https://donate.wikimedia.org, which you can also access through the "Donate" link on the side of the page. That is the only legitimate link for donating to the Wikimedia Foundation. jlwoodwa (talk) 16:29, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

October 29

Struggling to create an article; am I shadow-locked or something?

Hi,

I'm trying to create a page on the Russian editor Lyudmila Feyginova—-she edited many of Tarkovski's films and seems to have contributed heavily to the look and feel of his movies in the editing process—-but I can't even see options to create a page, or even for the sandbox to experiment... am I just looking in all the wrong places, or has some sort of lock been placed on my account limiting what I can do? Thanks. Titanc13 (talk) 01:09, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

A Wizard is available to walk you through these steps. See the Article Wizard.

Thank you.

Before creating an article, please search Wikipedia first to make sure that an article does not already exist on the subject. Please also review a few of our relevant policies and guidelines with which all articles should comply. As Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, articles must not contain original research, must be written from a neutral point of view, should cite reliable sources which verify their content and must not contain unsourced, negative content about living people.

Articles must also demonstrate the notability of the subject. Please see our subject specific guidelines for people, bands and musicians, companies and organizations and web content and note that if you are closely associated with the subject, our conflict of interest guideline strongly recommends against you creating the article.

If you still think an article is appropriate, see Wikipedia:Your first article. You might also look at Wikipedia:How to write a great article for guidance, and please consider taking a tour through the Wikipedia:Tutorial so that you know how to properly format the article before creation. An Article Wizard is also available to walk you through creating an article. 2601AC47 (talk) 01:12, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Also, you were not "locked" or blocked. 2601AC47 (talk) 01:14, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

@Titanc13 She exists in Wikidata, which shows that there is an article about her in French. It wouldn't pass muster here if translated directly, since it doesn't establish her wikinotability by our English-language standards but it may be useful. Mike Turnbull (talk) 16:02, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Article citing the same website for the whole article

si:මහමෙව්නාව භාවනා අසපුව article is about a monastery. Every citation in the whole article is from the monastary's website. Sometimes with the link to the homepage, not to the relavent part the information contains to be verified. Its an article in the sinhala wiki project but brought it here to get an unbiased opinion since this is a religious institute. What tags should i add to the article? primary sources? need more citations? VihirLak007^hmu!/_duh. 05:57, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

You'd have to ask over at the Sinhala Wikipedia. Each language project is independent, and has its own rules. AndyTheGrump (talk) 06:02, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

For change of name to Anangpal Tanwar from Anangpal Tomar

Not an issue for Help desk. Referred elsewhere.

IT is Anangpal Tanwar not Anangpal Tomar change it for page :

extremely long link not on en.wp

https://hi.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E0%A4%85%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%82%E0%A4%97%E0%A4%AA%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2_%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%B0#:~:text=%E0%A4%85%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%82%E0%A4%97%E0%A4%AA%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2%20%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%B0%20%E0%A4%A8%E0%A5%87%201052%20%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%82,%E0%A4%95%E0%A5%87%20%E0%A4%AC%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%87%20%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%82%20%E0%A4%AC%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%B9%E0%A5%88%3A%E0%A5%A4&text=%E0%A4%A2%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%B2%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%B2%E0%A5%80%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%96%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%AA%E0%A5%81%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%80%20%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%B0%20%E0%A4%A4%E0%A5%8B%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%88%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%B8%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BF%20%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%A4%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A5%A5&text=%E0%A4%85%E0%A4%A8%E0%A5%81%E0%A4%B5%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A6%3A%E0%A4%B9%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A3%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%95%20%E0%A4%A6%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%B6%20%E0%A4%AE%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%82,%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%95%20%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%97%E0%A4%B0%20%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%BE%20%E0%A4%A8%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%B0%E0%A5%8D%E0%A4%AE%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%A3%20%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%E0%A5%A4%20%E0%A5%A4

103.120.30.202 (talk) 09:36, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

We cannot help you with issues on the Hindi Wikipedia, you'll need to ask there. 331dot (talk) 09:47, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

How do I find categories easily?

How? Who am I? / Talk to me! / What have I done? 12:46, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

What categories were you trying to search for? 2601AC47 (talk) 12:48, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Not like that. In general, for a page, how do I find fitting categories? Who am I? / Talk to me! / What have I done? 12:51, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia has hundreds of thousands of categories. Wikipedia:Categorization#Categorizing pages has some tips on how to find suitable categories for an article. For example, find similar articles and see which categories they are in. 2601AC47 (talk) 12:58, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks! Who am I? / Talk to me! / What have I done? 13:00, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

I really can't say enough about how much easier this is if you use WP:HOTCAT. Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 18:22, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Another approach is to start from a higher, encompassing category, see what subcategories it holds, and work your way down. Clarityfiend (talk) 10:00, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Referencing errors on Saudi Exchange

Reference help requested. Hi

I received the below asking for a title parameter after I pulled a statistic from the official website in order to move figures from 2020 up to something more current, 2024, from the introductory paragraph. I don't intend anything incorrect but it seems I might have mis-cited my source (https://www.saudiexchange.sa/wps/portal/saudiexchange/home/!ut/p/z0/04_Sj9CPykssy0xPLMnMz0vMAfIjo8ziTR3NDIw8LAz83Z29TAwC_Rx9DSxdLY0MDAz1C7IdFQHxxULx/ -- specifically a photo on the bottom right.), if I have not done this appropriately any assistance or guidance would be appreciated.

Gregory

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudi_Exchange

CS1 error on Saudi Exchange

Hello, I'm Qwerfjkl (bot). I have automatically detected that this edit performed by you, on the page Saudi Exchange, may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows:

A bare URL error. References show this error when one of the URL-containing parameters cannot be paired with an associated title. Please edit the article to add the appropriate title parameter to the reference. Thanks, PilotsGlobal (talk) 15:37, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

PilotsGlobal, the bot complained because you cited it saying "title= ", without supplying a title. A more serious failing, not noticed by the bot, is that the source you cited does not support the statement that you cited it for, "It lists 239 publicly traded companies on the main market". Maproom (talk) 15:50, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Donations

I have been donating to Wikipedia for more than a year now. For some reason I can't find any link to my donations or my account. Please advise. Bkesp526 (talk) 16:06, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Welcome and thank you for your question about donations! To hide the fundraising banners, you can create an account and uncheck Preferences → Banners → Fundraising. The Wikimedia Foundation does not track the identity of IP addresses, so it doesn't know your age, income level or whether you donated in the past.
None of the Wikipedia volunteer editors here who add and improve content in articles receive any financial benefit. We all simply contribute our time because we care about building a great encyclopedia for you and innumerable others around the world to use.
If you cannot afford it, no one wants you to donate. Wikipedia is not at risk of shutting down, and the Wikimedia Foundation, which hosts the Wikipedia platform and is asking for these donations, is richer than ever.
You are welcome to communicate directly with the donor-relations team by emailing donate@wikimedia.org. Thank you! Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 18:20, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Bkesp526, please be aware that no link exists between your Wikipedia account used for editing, and any financial donations you choose to make to the Wikimedia Foundation. They are entirely separate. Cullen328 (talk) 19:00, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you so much for letting me know. 2600:1700:9B80:12D0:3F61:824C:E148:4213 (talk) 19:02, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Feedback sought on separating U.S. sections from lengthy articles/lists

WP articles often cover broad topics from a worldwide perspective, devoting separate sections to all possible countries where notable entries can be included. While I support this approach, in many cases, the U.S. sections dominate the coverage and are substantial enough to warrant separate pages, for example, when they account for 50% or more of a lengthy article.

A few questions: Is there a guideline regarding "separation" based on length or similar consideration? What is recommended for seeking input from editors who have made significant contributions to the articles/lists in question? What is the procedure should a clear consensus favor creating a standalone page from a U.S. section?

I know how to make the move, add a new name, set up the link within the existing article, and so forth. My concerns are in regards to editorial standards, community support, and usage (prirmarily navigability). Allreet (talk) 19:10, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Allreet. You should find the information that you need at Wikipedia:Splitting. Cullen328 (talk) 19:48, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Perfect. Thank you. I'm going to invite discussion on Talk pages where I have splitting in mind. The articles are not high profile, so I expect only minimal feedback and don't anticipate any significant opposition. Allreet (talk) 22:45, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

@Alreet: it might be worth posting a neutrally worded notice at relevant Wikiprojects pointing to said talk page discussions. Mjroots (talk) 15:48, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

New article link

Hi, I recently created an article for Delainey Hayles, but accidentally redirected my sandbox to that page in the process. Could someone help me to clean up the link? Elinoria (talk) 22:42, 29 October 2024 (UTC)

Request help in unlinking a redirect from my sandbox to a new article.

I’ve just created a new article, Delainey Hayles, and with that, my sandbox, where I created the article, now redirects to it. Thus … any changes I now make to my sandbox now affect the article, and the edit history for the article now includes my entire edit history, including edits on other articles. Can anyone offer any advice? Many thanks. Elinoria (talk) 00:24, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

You can remove the redirect by going to [2]. Tutwakhamoe (talk) 00:41, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Hi, I can access that page, but I don’t know what to do to cancel the redirect. Do you know how that can be done? Elinoria (talk) 00:58, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Just edit the page so that it no longer includes "#REDIRECT...". (Indeed, simply deleting this would be sufficient.) -- Hoary (talk) 01:00, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

A very quick look suggests that versions down to and including this one are irrelevant to Delainey Hayles. These can be deleted (with the rationale "uncontroversial housekeeping") if you wish (though this isn't something that you can do yourself). Would you like it done? If so, please confirm which versions should be deleted. -- Hoary (talk) 01:06, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Anything older than 25th October has nothing to do with Delainey Hayes, and is the history of my sandbox.

It would be great if you can delete that.

Also … because I started this article in my sandbox, I had no idea that all the edits from the beginning would appear on the live article. It’s full of notes-to-self etc, and a bit of a mess.

So … if you have the means to delete the history up until the article went live, (22.32 GMT) I would be really grateful.

Thanks for your help regardless. Elinoria (talk) 02:53, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Done, Elinoria. Believing that "Anything older than 25th October" was a mistake for "Anything older than 28th October", I deleted the edits of 25 October as well. -- Hoary (talk) 03:31, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you, I appreciate it. Elinoria (talk) 03:54, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

October 30

Clarification on QML Terminology

Hi Wikipedia Team, I hope this message finds you well. The terminology used for QML in the documentation. QML is often referred to as "Qt Meta-object Language" rather than "Qt Modeling Language," as it utilizes the Meta Object Compiler (MOC) for object handling and GUI development. This distinction is important for accurately representing its functionality and role within the Qt framework. I believe updating the terminology to reflect this would provide greater clarity for users and developers referencing the documentation. 180.151.40.106 (talk) 04:57, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

The best place for pointing this out would be Talk:QML. -- Hoary (talk) 07:16, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Do “anonymous experts” in non-political news affect credibility?

As a user without much editing experience, I have some questions about some of the media reports I usually read. I believe users here have a lot of experience in distinguishing the credibility of sources, so I'm writing here and asking for guidance. I personally find it difficult to tell whether the words of these anonymous experts are credible. Relatively speaking, it is very common and understandable for experts in political news, or insiders, to choose anonymity, because doing so may cause them a lot of trouble. But in contrast to these contents, in some social, climate, and economic reports, experts who express their views or opinions are also unsigned.

From my daily reading experience, in social news, for example, 1 mentioned that "some experts said"; 2, gave an "expert's" nickname on twitter, which is also equivalent to anonymous; 3 only mentions "experts who specialize in urban flooding" without mentioning names. In other stories, unnamed experts are used to presuppose the discussion, such as an article on human health, 4 which mentions "Every few months the same comment ismade by experts 'BMI is flawed'. "

I would also like to ask you how to judge whether the information is worth quoting or not when encountering such a situation. Thanks a lot.--HelenAtkinson2002 (talk) 07:18, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Generally speaking, don't use 'social news' sources at all. Reliable news sources can be useful in certain circumstances, but they should always have a byline saying who wrote the article, an editorial process etc. But for subjects where they need to refer to 'experts', don't use a news source - go to proper academic sources. Girth Summit _(blether) 07:25, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Girth Summit,Thank you very much for your answer, which made me realize the importance of academic sources. Maybe I should really try to be more academic and avoid these seemingly unreliable social sources as soon as possible.--HelenAtkinson2002 (talk) 01:52, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

HelenAtkinson2002, your last example is from medicalnewstoday.com and is about a medical issue. Very rightly, en:Wikipedia has particularly high standards for the sourcing of medical material. Please read and digest Wikipedia:Identifying reliable sources (medicine). A search in WP:RSN for "medical news today" brought this three-year-old discussion, which didn't really have a conclusion but seems to me to tending towards "Not good enough for some purposes; probably good enough for others". If you were thinking of citing the website somewhere, you'd be wise to ask at WP:RSN about the wisdom of doing so, specifying the precise page within medicalnewstoday.com you wanted to cite, the en:Wikipedia article in which you were thinking of citing it, and the assertion(s) for which you were thinking of citing it. -- Hoary (talk) 07:52, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Hoary, Thank you for reminding me of this page. I never noticed it before. Maybe I should pay more attention to these discussions when I edit articles in the future. I also feel that my personal knowledge, or as a general user, is not qualified to determine the reliability of this medical information. I will be more careful in future editing. Thank you again for your help!--HelenAtkinson2002 (talk) 01:56, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

HelenAtkinson2002, the three examples that you chose seem to be in Chinese not English. It is certainly true that references to reliable Chinese language sources are permitted if English language sources are lacking, but it is also true that the vast majority of English language Wikipedia editors will lack the ability to evaluate the reliability and appropriateness of such sources, even with the assistance of machine translation. And as already pointed out above, medically related content requires especially rigorous evaluation of the cited sources. So, you must make a very convincing case that your references are solid, which is not an easy task in a case like this. Cullen328 (talk) 08:12, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Cullen328, Thank you very much for your reminder! Unfortunately, my English level is not very good, so I mainly read Chinese sources on a daily basis, and even the entries I edit are subject to this limitation. Maybe I should improve my English level as soon as possible. But I would like to ask you again, how should "a very convincing case" be provided? Thanks a lot.--HelenAtkinson2002 (talk) 02:01, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

HelenAtkinson2002, if you cite a source on the English Wikipedia and another editor challenges it, then you must be prepared to convince other editors that it fully complies with the Reliable sources content guideline. If your English is not good, you may want to consider editing in the Wikipedia version of the language you speak best. Cullen328 (talk) 04:02, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Please consider editing the Chinese Wikipedia. Cullen328 (talk) 04:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for your advice very much, I took a look at the link you mentioned just now, and some of the media ratings there seem to be somewhat different from what I understand. May I should probably look a little deeper into the reliable sources you mention. As for the Chinese Wikipedia you mentioned...They are arguing all the time...It's noisy just looking at it. Well, thanks a lot again, I will try my best to study how to write good English articles! HelenAtkinson2002 (talk) 11:18, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Choosing a language

Hello, I have tried to find a way to choose a language on the start page, i.e. before I have made a search, but I don't seem to find it. Up till now I have had to make a search in my starting language for a topic that's likely to exist in the desired language and then switch that article to that language, whereupon I can search in the langauge I wanted to search in from the beginning. That's a very roundabout way, and I reckon there must be an easier way that I am missing? Leongut (talk) 10:04, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello, Leongut. Each language version of Wikipedia is a separate and largely autonomous project, although there are interlanguage links in some cases. The English Wikipedia is not the boss version or the master version. If you want French articles, search the French Wikipedia and if you want German articles, search the German Wikipedia. And so on. Cullen328 (talk) 10:16, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Leongut, since Wikidata has an item for each article on every language Wikipedia, you might try searching there first. From what I gather about your current methodology, Wikidata seems to have a dedicated function to do the same: search for pages on specific projects at d:Special:ItemByTitle. Folly Mox (talk) 12:13, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

There's a pretty navigable list of all the Wikipediae in the Wikimedia ecosystem at meta:Wikimedia core free-knowledge projects, if you want to start there instead of here or Wikidata. Folly Mox (talk) 12:18, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

@Leongut: You didn't say what you mean by "the start page". Please link pages you refer to. The language code for English is en so the English Wikipedia is at https://en.wikipedia.org. Our Main Page at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page and all other pages at the English Wikipedia have a search box which searches the English Wikipedia. The language code for Swedish is sv so the Swedish Wikipedia is at https://sv.wikipedia.org, and so on. https://www.wikipedia.org is the front of all Wikipedia languages. It has a language selector in the search box. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:28, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Is OP maybe meaning 'switch in chrome/whatever'? Valereee (talk) 13:40, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

I guess "switch that article to that language" means they click an interlanguage link on a Wikipedia article in the language they started at. PrimeHunter (talk) 13:59, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Oh, so 'switch to the article in that language'? Gotcha. Valereee (talk) 14:12, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

@Leongut: Perhaps you meant to go to this page that has a dropdown menu (Read Wikipedia in your language) that lets you see all the different language projects on Wikipedia, as PrimeHunter pointed out? —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 14:42, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Wow, Cebuano Wikipedia, who knew? Valereee (talk) 15:01, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Cebuano Wikipedia is the kingdom of bot-translated articles, Valereee. Cullen328 (talk) 17:29, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Question

I have a translation ongoing from Simple English --> English. The simple english page has no references what so ever. I have hence requested speedy deletion for now. Is this required if I am only translating the page? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Cooldudeseven7 _{join in on the tea talk} 14:02, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

@Cooldudeseven7:, Wikipedia policies such as Wikipedia:Notability do apply to translated articles. If the article is Golden Edge, you could make it a Wikipedia:Redirect to TelevisaUnivision#Cable. TSventon (talk) 14:35, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

So, why doesn't the simple english wikipedia XfD it?

Another problem- One entire part of the article, Universalplus, has no reference. (a majority) But it still has a reference. Can I just place the "Unreferenced Section" tag? Instead of deleting the Golden Edge page why dont I just place the tag? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Cooldudeseven7 _{join in on the tea talk} 14:47, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Why doesn't the simple english wikipedia XfD it? The answer could be that no one has noticed it, or that simple english policies are different.

You can tag Golden Edge as unreferenced, but it would still be unreferenced and a new page patroller or another editor might nominate it for deletion. TSventon (talk) 15:37, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Every language version of Wikipedia is a separate project, with its own policies, procedures, and admins - this is as true of Simple as it is of Arabic.

Few people here are familiar with the policies of any other given Wikipedia, even Simple: you need to ask there about why an article has not been deleted. ColinFine (talk) 17:46, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Alright, thank you. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) Cooldudeseven7 _{join in on the tea talk} 17:50, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Template trouble

The section Contern#Rivers_and_Streams includes a table with 4 templates. The first 3 work fine and when clicking on "show" for the 4th (Schleederbaach) that looks fine, until I try to edit it. The V T E tabs give me Template:River Thames bridges, Template talk:River Thames bridges and Editing Template:River Thames bridges respectively, nothing to do with Schleederbaach at all. The article's edit page looks correct, and the data for the "show" must be somewhere. Any ideas? (I only want to change "Resevoir" to "Reservoir") - Arjayay (talk) 15:30, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

@Arjayay: I've fixed the V T E links with this edit. -- John of Reading (talk) 15:36, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks John of Reading - My bad, I was only looking at the article edit page - Arjayay (talk) 15:39, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Bat For Lashes Article

I work for BFL / Natasha's team, and trying to update some incorrect parts of her Wikipedia page. Amends I'm trying to make are: 1. Removing "and the stepdaughter of singer and actress Salma Agha" - her father is divorced from Salma and so Natasha has no family affiliation to the Agha family. 2. Removing "Khan was subject to racial abuse during secondary school due to her Pakistani heritage." - this is incorrect information 3. Addition in Other Projects of "Light Beings" https://batforlashes.fandom.com/wiki/Light_Beings 4. Addition in Other Projects of the film "The Dream of Delphi - A New Transmission" https://www.imdb.com/title/tt32535994/ 5. Amending currently status to: "After 6 years living in Los Angeles, Khan has returned to London with her daughter Delphi" 92.21.195.137 (talk) 16:44, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

It is not a page, its an article. Page is the software construct the article sits on and is the internal name the WMF uses for the thing. Don't use any of these for references. They are not reliable sources. scope_creep^Talk 16:50, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

It's an article. It's a page. Let's not hector people, especially when they arrive to politely make requests. -- Hoary (talk) 20:29, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

IMDB and Fandom are user-generated sources and considered unreliable for Wikipedia's sake. Therefore, they cannot be included as references. If there is third-party reporting in secondary sources, you can use those. As you have a conflict of interest as a paid editor, you are strongly advised 'not to edit the article directly - instead use the talk page Talk:Bat For Lashes to request the inclusion or change of any information. Unsourced assertions, such as claim number 2 you are trying to change, will be reverted unless they are cited to a reliable source, as will those to unreliable user-generated sources. Departure– (talk) 16:53, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Yes. If you a coi, declare per WP:DISCLOSE. If you do have a coi, then use the Wikipedia:Edit requests mechanism to request edits on the talk page of the article. An uninvolved editor will come by, look at them and if they are good, add them to the article. scope_creep^Talk 17:20, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Process

Hi Folks!! What is the process for editor who have an article on Wikipedia have done particular work on Wikipedia and want to mention in their own article. It was mentioned in the article via a wikipedia reference, which would normally be illegal and I removed it. How would that work normally be referenced in light of fact that it is unlikely somebody externally is going to write about it. What is the process there. Thanks. scope_creep^Talk 16:48, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

A conflict of interest? 2601AC47 (talk) 16:52, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

If secondary sourcing details that person's work on Wikipedia, it can be added. I strongly advise against using Wikipedia to back up any claim, even one directly concerned with one's edits to the platform. Departure– (talk) 16:54, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

How Do I Get a Wikipedia Profile

How do one go about getting a Wikipedia profile. 2603:7000:9F00:1E46:9C22:B0F:68D5:E313 (talk) 17:19, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Special:CreateAccount. Departure– (talk) 17:26, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Wikipedia does not have profiles.

If you mean "an account" (from which you can edit most articlezs) see the link from Departure.

If you mean "an article about you", please read an article about yourself isn't necessarily a good thing. An article about you, whoever writes it, will not belong to you, will not be controlled by you, will not necessarily say what you would like it to say, may be edited by almost anybody in the world except you and your associates, and should be based almost entirely on what people wholly unconnected with you have published about you, not on what you or your associates say or want to say.

And writing about yourself is very strongly discouraged. ColinFine (talk) 18:19, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Greetings, and welcome. To answer a question with a question, what do you mean by "profile"? Wikipedia does not have profiles. If you mean a user page, once you create an account, you are free to create a user page for yourself, but this is intended for you to provide information about yourself as a Wikipedia editor--it is not intended to serve as a more general social media profile, as that is not what Wikipedia is for.

If you were meaning an article, then what is required is that the subject of the article meet our standards of notability, which in turn means that they have received significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject. Wikipedia is an encyclopedia which summarizes reliable secondary sources, so without these sources, there is literally nothing upon which a proper encyclopedia article can be based. If you're were referring to an article about yourself, it's highly unlikely that you meet that standard, as is the case for most people--I certainly don't qualify for an article, and I hope I never do.

Hope this helps. Feel free to ask further questions. --Finngall ^talk 18:21, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

IRK

What are the details of prohets Muhammad — Preceding unsigned comment added by 197.231.206.81 (talk) 20:04, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Not exactly sure what you mean by "details", but in any case, see the talk page for reasons about that. 2601AC47 (talk) 20:21, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

You can find all the details you could possibly want at Muhammad. Shantavira|^{feed me} 11:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

What happened to the "expand all" button?

I know about the setting on mobile, but on desktop there used to be a button in the sidebar that expanded all the sections in an article, until it disappeared one day. Was it something I did, or is it gone for everyone? TheLegendofGanon (talk) 22:08, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Can't say I remember that but it was probably a result of a WP:SKIN change. You can go back to older ones if you prefer. (I'm using an old one right now, I'm just more familiar with the layout) Just Step Sideways ^{from this world ..... today} 22:19, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

I found it. Turns out I had inadvertently moved the tool section off of the sidebar. TheLegendofGanon (talk) 14:03, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Regarding Module sandbox creation

How to create a Module:Sandbox/User name? பொதுஉதவி (talk) 23:30, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

You already should know: Module:Sandbox. 2601AC47 (talk) 23:35, 30 October 2024 (UTC)

Hello, @பொதுஉதவி. I've just replied to nearly the same question on the Teahouse. Please don't ask the same question in multiple places (unless you are specifically advised to - I suggested you ask at WT:Lua). ColinFine (talk) 17:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

October 31

Compliance with MOS:FOREIGNQUOTE

'When editors themselves translate text into English, care must always be taken to include the original text, in italics'. Is there any way to do it that isn't an eyesore? The only ways I have seen this done is just wholly providing the original language text following the original in the body, which is a massive waste of text. I guess you could use footnotes. But I think those are both eyesores, especially when it's on a page that has a decent amount of quotes. Is there any better way to do this? What is the recommended way? PARAKANYAA (talk) 00:06, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@PARAKANYAA The recommended way is at MOS:FOREIGNQUOTE. I don't see why this would be an "eyesore". We might be able to provide better advice if you could please link to the article in question. Shantavira|^{feed me} 11:07, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Shantavira It's an eyesore because having to duplicate the full text again in the body of the article after every quote is too much. Effectively the only tolerable option is to include no quotes.

It's not one page, it's just generally. PARAKANYAA (talk) 11:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@PARAKANYAA. Quotes in articles should be few and short. Please provide an example of the supposed problem. Shantavira|^{feed me} 14:12, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Help with archiving Talk Page

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Aesthetic_Realism Can someone please help me create Archive 14 for this Talk Page? I thought it was supposed to auto-archive after 14 days of inactivity when more than 4 threads were present but that is obviously not working because the thread at the top is from 2019. When I tried to manually archive it, a message came up stating "This page is on the title blacklist, so only administrators, template editors, and page movers can create it."

Can you please archive the current Talk Page as Archive 14, or alternatively, direct me on a way I can do it using an automated script? Thank you. Lore E. Mariano (talk) 01:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano the bot is configured to only archive discussions on that page when there are more than 4 sections present. You could change that in the source code, or manually archive using tools like one click archive. '''[[User:CanonNi]]''' (talk • contribs) 01:39, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano: Talk:Aesthetic Realism only has 4 threads. As you said, it's supposed to auto-archive when there are more than 4. Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14 is not on the title blacklist. Is that the page you tried to create? Do you get the quoted message when you click that link? PrimeHunter (talk) 02:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Probably you tried to create Talk:Aesthetic Realism\Archive 14 (wrong kind of slash), which is on the title blacklist. It should show an error message about that, but the infra in this area has a few holes. * Pppery * _{it has begun...} 02:14, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Yes, that's the page I tried to create--maybe I had the syntax wrong. I just tried again, using your Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14 link, and it's working now.

I had tried copying and pasting "https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Aesthetic_Realism/Archive_13" and changed the 13 to a 14, and that's when I got the message. But your Talk link worked, so thank you! Lore E. Mariano (talk) 02:18, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

It's almost perfect now except that Archive 14 isn't showing in the Talk page Archive Index list. Does it get automatically populated? I couldn't see how to include it as a link in the Index. Lore E. Mariano (talk) 02:33, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@LoreMariano: You haven't created Talk:Aesthetic Realism/Archive 14. Special:Contributions/LoreMariano doesn't show any recent page creation. PrimeHunter (talk) 02:45, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Visual editor and 2017 wikitext editor side by side? / Show preview?

Hi! I've (finally) been trying the visual editor, and have also enabled the 2017 wikitext editor. One thing I noticed is that when using the 2017 wikitext editor, a live preview doesn't appear next to it like it did before I enabled the visual editor, even though I have "show preview without reloading the page" enabled in my preferences.

Is this option incompatible with the visual editor? Is there any option to show the 2017 wikitext editor and the visual editor side by side, which would serve the same purpose as a live preview?

Also, I'm wondering what "show preview when starting to edit" and "show preview before edit box" mean, as I don't see any differences whether I enable or disable these preferences?

Thanks from an irregularly active user :) Helpful Cat (talk) 01:44, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Helpful Cat Slightly off-topic, since you ask about the 2017 wikitext editor, which means using wikitext mode inside the visual editor, I would recommend just using the standard source editor. That has a "Preview" toggle to the right of the menu bar and on any device with a reasonably wide viewing screen like a PC works fine: the preview part can be scrolled independently of the editing area. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:59, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Please help me

I wanted to add an addition to a harmless article about a Dutch ambidextrous artist in the English section of Wikipedia, when trying to save it, the following warning came out: You've exceeded your rate limit. Please wait some time and try again. At the same time, I have not ruled anything at all up to this point. I made several attempts to save, but no, it failed. Maybe who knows what it is? I've been writing on the Russian-language Wikipedia for 4 years, but I've never seen this. Please help me. Thanks! Znatokgoroda77 (talk) 07:41, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hey Znatokgoroda77, until you are autoconfirmed, which is 4 days and 10 edits here (I understand it's 15 on ruwiki?) there is an IP-based rate limit, which you may have run into if you're using a shared IP and there are other people editing from it. You have probably never run into it because you would have been autoconfirmed on ruwiki for a few years now. Alpha3031 (t • c) 08:58, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Hey Alpha3031! Thanks for the answer! There are 20 edits and two weeks of experience in the Russian-language section, as you said correctly. It's difficult to make 10 edits here. I have been trying to send you an answer for more than 10 hours now, but this strange limit does not allow me to do this. Thanks again for your reply. With best wishes, Znatokgoroda77 (talk) 18:22, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

I am trying to add this page to Wikipedia but getting an error

I am trying to add this page to Wikipedia but getting an error and I think it is an error, Saifurrahman is a beacon of creativity and innovation in the graphic design industry and has received many rewards and soon receive the Padma award. I think this information should be included in Wikipedia. Could you help me to resolve this issue?

I am recieving following message

"Welcome to Wikipedia!

Your edit has triggered an automated filter and has been disallowed. It looks like you're trying to add an email address to this page. Doing that, especially with a personal email address, is usually a bad idea as it can attract large amounts of spam. Though there are a few legitimate reasons to include an email address, in most cases Wikipedia will remove email addresses that are added to articles or discussion pages.

If you want to communicate with a particular user via email, Wikipedia has a built-in email function you can use. If you would like to request general assistance, the fastest way is usually to post a question at the Help Desk. Wikipedia also provides a guide to asking for help — including via email — if you feel that is necessary.

If you are attempting to add a link to a Mastodon account, and this filter is preventing you from doing so, please do not file a false positive report. Instead, please follow the instructions at Template:Mastodon user to add a link to the account. If you are experiencing trouble using the template, please visit the Teahouse for assistance in doing so. If you believe you received this message in error, you may report it here." Saifurrahmanprof (talk) 09:43, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

You need to remove the email address from your text in order for you to be able to submit it. 331dot (talk) 09:48, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: Remove the email address as said, and also all the phone numbers. Wikipedia articles do not give contact information. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:19, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: I looked at the rest of your attempted text. It's extremely promotional with no sources and totally inappropriate for Wikipedia. It has no chance of being accepted. I suggest you just drop the whole thing. See Wikipedia:Autobiography. PrimeHunter (talk) 11:30, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Saifurrahmanprof: This sentence: "Saifurrahman is a beacon of creativity and innovation in the graphic design industry" is a big red flag indicating you're not the right person to write the article. Please see WP:What Wikipedia is not, especially the WP:PROMOTION part. You need to familiarize yourself with Wikipedia key policies WP:CONPOL as well, most important of them right now IMHO are WP:Neutral point of view and WP:Verifiability. Also, as other said above, WP:AUTOBIO and also MOS:PUFFERY (the last one strictly related to another policy on WP:Neutral point of view). Additionally, as you are clearly a living person, your biography must comply with WP:BLP, whether it's you or anybody else who will eventually write it. --CiaPan (talk) 12:54, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Add/Update a Corporate Logo

The company that I work for has rebranded with a new logo. I would like to update the Wiki listing so that it is current and correct, but as an employee I am barred from making any changes to the listing. Can someone look at www.rjleegroup.com to see that the logo is new and update the wiki listing? Dtel77 (talk) 14:35, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

(another conflict of interest, please.) So long as this isn't non-free, promotional or leaning towards paid edits, you may upload that logo on Wikimedia Commons. 2601AC47 (talk) 14:40, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Logos are rarely appropriate for Commons, as by uploading a logo to Commons you are making it available for anyone to use for any purpose with attribution(like competitors). You should upload it to this Wikipedia locally as a "fair use" image, see WP:UPIMAGE. 331dot (talk) 14:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Dtel77 You will need to make the Terms of Use-require paid editing disclosure. 331dot (talk) 14:49, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dtel77 The existing logo is the file File:RJLG 2 Color Logo no tagline 031711.png which is uploaded here on English Wikipedia as WP:NONFREE, with an interesting comment (see file page) that the combination of text and simple geometric shape would make it public domain in the U.S. However, it is tagged as not being suitable for Commons because of the doubt about whether it is non-free in its home country, which is odd given that RJ Lee Group is clearly American. Your new logo seems to have the same issues, so I suggest you also upload it only to English Wikipedia. Once incorporated in the article (which I'll do if you WP:PING me to its Talk Page after you've uploaded the file), the old logo will be automatically deleted by a bot. Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:57, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dtel77: That isn't a PD-logo. The design that precedes the text doesn't consist of "simple geometric shapes" but rather complex curves that cannot be reconstructed using simple geometric shapes. It should be non-free fair use, at lower resolution. I have made the corrections. ~Anachronist (talk) 15:54, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Serbia's gdp for October 2024 is still not updated!

I want to make change. Dzon Dzouns (talk) 15:36, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

October isn't even over yet, so how can we already have an accurate GDP figure for it? I suspect such figures are only calculated by (competent and/or official) economists weeks to months after the end of the month in question, but I may be mistaken. What is your Reliable source for the figure you want to change, and exactly where in which article(s) do you want to change it? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.6.86.81 (talk) 15:46, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

If that's so, be bold and edit such subject's article. 2601AC47 (talk) 15:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

On further investigation, I find that the article helpfully linked by 2601AC47 has a figure for 2024 sourced to an official (National Bank of Serbia) monthly report dated October (so it's a figure for 2024 up to October, not for October 2024), that was added by Gmiletic on 26 October, 5 days before Dzon Dzouns's request. If this is not the article you meant, Dzon Dzouns, which is it? {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 94.6.86.81 (talk) 16:09, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

metadata hunt

Hello! I am a big fan of Wikipedia (occasional donor and minor editor). I have a curiosity/research-related question, and I need help finding either the answer or a tool to process metadata from Wikipedia for the answer. My question: How many references (i.e. links to unique source materials) does each and every Wikipedia article have?

So all I need, really, is a list of all article titles and the number of referenced sources in each. If the list could possibly be broken into groups (persons, events, technology, concepts, creative productions, or any pre-existing categorization of articles you may use), this would be even more helpful for my statistical purposes, but it's not strictly necessary.

Hollyfeld (talk) 18:43, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

By that, do you mean every reference counted in all 6 million or so articles that have them? In that case, the math is complicated, but you're welcome to try (and help out while at it). 2601AC47 (talk) 19:13, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Search box typos

When doing a search on the term Rusķ,I find a typo in the Rusk, Texas entry, sear for seat. Where do you go to edit? DMc75771 (talk) 18:47, 31 October 2024 (UTC)

Be bold and edit it... But anyway,  Already done myself. 2601AC47 (talk) 19:10, 31 October 2024 (UTC)