Talk:Barbie (media franchise)

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Requested move 15 July 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Moved. This article has been renamed back to the proposed title herein by the editor who began the page moves in the first place. Under the circumstances it seems better to continue from this point with more discussion in a new thread about the highest and best title for this article. Thanks and kudos to editors for your input; good health to all! P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^put'r there 20:44, 15 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Barbie (film franchise) → Barbie (franchise) – Per WP:COMMONNAME, Barbie (franchise) is historically widely known as the preferred home for films with the Barbie name included, which gets adequate sourcing verification. However, articles covering audiovisual media and their associated soundtracks also having that name included in their titles are an adequate reason for this move, also citing the progress of the High School Musical, The Cheetah Girls, Toy Story and Spy Kids articles as examples. Intrisit (talk) 15:23, 15 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

When I saw the new article name, I thought the article was being changed to be about the Barbie toy franchise, since that's what comes to mind when people hear the Barbie franchise. I was wondering if the page should be named something different, like Barbie (film franchise) or named back to Barbie (film series). Even though this page covers the related media that aren't technically part of the film series, it's still the main focus, and makes the topic clearer upfront. Either way, I think "film" should be in the title to avoid confusion with the toy franchise. Lockejava (talk) 21:48, 12 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

@Lockejava: First of all, I've corrected some incorrect grammar in your opinion question. (No need to thank me — that's why I'm on Wikipedia in the first place!) And now, as I already stated to you on your talk page and the move request box above this text, this current page move was rushed, and that it should be reverted back to Barbie (franchise). Consider that should there be an article on just the films, where would unrelated articles like Barbie: Life in the Dreamhouse, Barbie Dreamtopia, Barbie Dreamhouse Adventures and Barbie: It Takes Two fit into/go to? Have a look at High School Musical (franchise), The Cheetah Girls (franchise) and Toy Story (franchise), all of which started out as film series articles like this one, but got expanded into web series, TV shows, theatricals and soundtrack albums. Even Monster High, made from the same company as Barbie, is noted for its toys, but also there is a media franchise consisting of a web series, about 17 films, about 15 soundtrack albums and an upcoming TV series.

Secondly, if you're talking about/looking for the "Barbie toy franchise" here on Wikipedia, see List of Barbie's friends and family, which shows you the list of the related components — toys, dolls and accessories — and the perceived real-life friends of Barbie with a few trivia about each of them, which I simply term it as the Barbie fictional and non-fictional universes. That article, I must admit though, lacks sufficient inclusion and adequate sourcing and needs a major overhaul/revamp anyway. The main article, Barbie, already talks about the history and expansion of that one doll/toy into the toy franchise it is now. If that alone isn't enough for you, have a look at its corresponding template.

Last but not the least, to avoid confusion, I've included clear and precise introductory notes about this confusion on this article and at Barbie. Reply if still unsatisfied!! Thanks for your attention!! Intrisit (talk) 15:23, 15 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

More specific title?

Thanks everyone for participating in the discussion above. As mentioned by Paine Ellsworth "it seems better to continue from this point with more discussion in a new thread about the highest and best title for this article." In my opinion, the title of Barbie (franchise) is a little too confusing/vague, mainly because the main Barbie franchise is the toy line, while the film/media franchise came later and isn't the primary franchise. I'm OK with "Barbie (film franchise)" and "Barbie (film series)" because the related media (like the TV series) can be listed under a "Related media" section. (They are connected after all, especially with Dreamhouse Adventures being connected to the recent movies.) Either way, I just think "film" or media or something should stay in the name to clear up confusion. Lockejava (talk) 02:36, 16 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I moved the page. I think that the Barbie (franchise) title should redirect to the Barbie doll franchise. The title of Barbie franchise refers to the doll franchise overwhelmingly. Film franchise (with main films, spin-offs, and all) are under the film franchise umbrella, so this title works. If changed, (media franchise) fits, but there definitely must be a disambiguation since the doll is the first and foremost franchise. TheFallenPower (talk) 17:22, 17 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Bloated article section & re-curation of article

@Lockejava:, @TheFallenPower: & Bianca Anne Martins, the "main films", "cast" and "reception" sections of this article could be on its own article — the original "Barbie (film series)" article — since they all point to the same direction in terms of documentation and appearance. The "related media" connotation should rather be used to refer to productions featuring Barbie as a character (main, recurring or minor/cameo) and its corresponding article titles not having the "Barbie" name attached to it/them. These 3 aforementioned sections are what is making this article more of just "focus on the films", looking at the infobox depictions, and not "the media franchise" everyone — excluding me — agrees/has agreed with. With that in mind and per WP:SPLIT, I've invoked these actions with the evidence of the splitting of Monster High and its former section (now a standalone article) of its based-on films/TV specials.

Also TheFallenPower and Lockejava, "Barbie (franchise)" is of course vague and it looks like I was confused seeing all opinions, both yours and others, but I get the point. My grudge with this confusion is that, editors and visitors alike could be looking for the Barbie franchise with respect to its composition of characters like Skipper, Stacie, Chelsea, Nikki, Renee and Teresa, but, as of now, they would rather be taken to the main Barbie page instead of List of Barbie's friends and family. With these two valid points raised/mentioned, I've DABbed "Barbie (franchise)" not only to clear all vagueness but also to point to the specifics of what they're actually looking for. Intrisit (talk) 10:02, 24 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Request for comment on bloated article content sections

Should the "Main films" and "Reception" sections of this article be kept here although they distort this article's main focus? Intrisit (talk) 06:29, 25 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, the "Main films" and "Reception" sections should remain and NOT be removed on this article. Under the "Reception" section, information that would include the related media should be added soon, so that it does not solely talks about the DVD sales. Of course, the films are definitely the main focus of the Barbie media franchise; these started it all anyway. But these are and will always be part of the media franchise as a whole; Mattel said it themselves that they are already expanding from more than just releasing these films and has become more obvious in the recent years with the release of a few animated series. If other media franchises on Wikipedia should be checked (similar ones like Toy Story, Shrek, Frozen, etc.), they are already under one article with (franchise) attached to the title, not (film series). Thus, the Barbie media franchise should conform to this for the sake of uniformity here in Wikipedia. This article, however, has (media franchise) attached to it instead, to avoid confusion with the brand/toy franchise; similar to the React (media franchise) article. Creating a separate article for the film series would only add to the confusion once more since, again, Mattel is now intending for Barbie to be a media franchise. Removing the main films section (and all the details related to it) on this article would ruin the whole purpose of this article; the films are the heart of this media franchise in the first place. If there should be a film series article, it would solely be a home for the summaries of each of the 40 plus films, while the list of the "Main films" should remain here. Thank you! Bianca Anne Martins (talk) 13:30, 25 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- The Reception section had serious problems. Much as I would like to WP:PRESERVE the good faith efforts put in, large amounts of information had to be removed more than once. Please read WP:TVRECEPTION. Please also read WP:USERGENERATED because audience scores and user voted scores are not normally allowed. It may be very difficult or even impossible to write a Reception section based on a very limited amount of reliable sources WP:RS being available, but maybe if you dig deep or can find some books on you can find some other way write something that is within the rules of this encyclopedia. To be clear, Rotten Tomatoes user scores and IMDB votes are not allowed. -- 109.79.167.102 (talk) 23:46, 28 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, the "Main films" and "Reception" are a huge part of the franchise and deserve a space on this page. I disagree with the original RfC's claim that "they distort this article's main focus" and note that the RfC in question isn't neutral. Pickalittletalkalittle (talk) 23:00, 4 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]