User talk:RJCraig/Archive 1

Recovered talk

Revision as of 10:13, 30 July 2005

Welcome!

Hello, RJCraig, and welcome to Wikipedia! Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are some pages that you might find helpful:

I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! Please sign your name on talk pages using four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically produce your name and the date. If you need help, check out Wikipedia:Questions, ask me on my talk page, or place {{helpme}} on your talk page and ask your question there. Again, welcome!

Sincerely, Ryan 10:13, July 30, 2005 (UTC)

Japan - Family names

You added some great, enlightening information on family names in Japan on the article Family name. As you may know, the Wikipedia motto is "[[Be bold"...so, you should feel free to edit the text taking the fact into account as best as you see fit...that is every Wikipedian's right...and the truth will out, in the end! --Dpr 04:03, 2 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

(More to recover later, starting here!) (See also this page.)

Content moved from main Talk page ca. 15:40 JST, 3 June 2006

English Passive Voice page

Hey, go crazy with English passive voice. I'll contribute if I have time. Akhilleus 19:17, 21 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I liked your new edit to English passive voice. You're right about "will" and "have" being tense/aspect markers, and not part of the passive construction as such, but in general, I think it's helpful to think of auxiliary verbs + participle as a single "verb," which makes it easier to figure out that "will be said" is a passive future, etc. Treating the verb phrase as a single "word" is especially helpful if you're teaching a bunch of English speakers an agglutinating language where most verb forms are single words (e.g. classical Latin or Greek).

I'd like the article to include a section along the lines of "Misidentifications of the passive voice"--common misidentifications are 1) calling the passive a tense instead of a voice; 2) identifying every use of "to be" as a passive--e.g., saying that "John is swimming" is a passive, when it's just a present progressive in the active voice; 3) calling every sentence where agency/cause isn't expressed clearly a passive sentence, as "The word takes on a new meaning in this light." Many people who think they know something about grammar will call this a passive sentence, but "takes on" is in the active voice, even though it's not clear who is giving the word a new meaning.

Anyway, just some thoughts, I'd appreciate your reaction. Thanks, --Akhilleus (talk) 03:01, 31 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Your rule of thumb "involves two words = syntax" isn't a bad one, but we're analyzing the passive verb as a single form, periphrastic though it may be. In other words, the third person singular present passive of "to write" is "is written". If we take that tack, "is written" is a single morphological unit. Syntax doesn't come in until we start supplying arguments, i.e. a subject, agent, etc. --Akhilleus (talk) 06:25, 23 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Any news on the Prograph history

I just got your note over on DevWiki -- sorry about the tardyness, I got into German jet engines for a while -- about the "alternate history" that I originally used in the Prograph article. It seems that it was likely writen by Cox, so that leads me to believe it should be fairly accurate. Anything new? Maury 21:05, 18 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Re. ...the gods...

Hi there! Thanks for the note. It's unfortunate that the topic seems to attract hostility from some people, but I don't plan to give up on the language soon. I guess it comes with the territory. Anyway, it's always nice to meet other people who are also interested in the subject. — Zerida 08:05, 1 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Zeus is back

Hi, remember me - the idiot who thought he could persuade Zeusxxxx about discrepancies in the Dune novels? Anyway, he has popped up again and I have requested comments. I hope to get a once-and-for-all acceptance of the view that FH's jihad was not about evil robots. See Talk:Discrepancies (Dune) Lundse 08:43, 28 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Zeus is indeed back and will continue to patrol these pages until the dispute is resolved, the ignorance receded and the biases removed. Hell hath no fury like Zeus scorned.

Zeus69962 19:10, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

All things in time

Brother RJ, you wrote "It bloody well took you long enough, what?" on my page - What is this refering to?

All the best

-Zeus

(yawn) Oh, sorry, just getting up. I remember many years ago at OSU my professor of Ancient Greek telling me that the phrase Zeus huei, describing precipitation, really meant "Zeus pisses". Do be a good mythical entity and rain off elsewhere, eh?

Si Zeus urine n'importe quoi... C'est la vérité - Une douche d'or de vérité. Vous ne pouvez pas le nier. N'insulter pas... C'est grossier. Merci... Nous sommes tous les frères dans la lumière de Dune.

Have you ever heard the quote "When two elephants fight in the grass, the grass suffers."

Zeus69962 04:40, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hmmm...golden showers, denial, a continuing emphasis on brotherhood, muscular beasts tussling...interesting imagery. Pity my French isn't up to completing the couplet!

Has anyone ever computed the planet's albedo, do you know? I wonder if it would differ greatly from 0.16...

It means that if Zeus is urinating anything its a golden shower of truth... You brought up the pee, insulting me, I changed it around since that is not true. The Elephant quote is an old Liberian quote (I think) that has no homosexual basis what-so-ever... Not that it is relevent to the subject at hand but my sexuality is very heterosexual. What is interesting is your view on it... Just like your view on Dune... hint, hint... The elephant quote means (in this context) that the only thing that this is beng hurt is Frank's legacy, which you are trampling on... I don't want to bring up the inconsistancies in the original Dune series because that actually has many... I am trying to keep off the grass... Although, if you wanted to put that, you can; I cannot fight against that... Those are actually there unfortunately... Frank focused on the writing more than the continuity... Although, I believe it has no purpose in an encylopedia. However, there are NO inconsistancies in the prequels. Yes, Frank's writing is much better than Brian or KJA (I have never disputed this and have allowed it on the Frank Herbert page) but they are decent writers in their own regard and do not deserve this... They have worked hard to make it consistant. I want to see you do a better job... Sure, you'll probably say you can but you'll have no proof of that... Look at the awards and recognition that both of the authors have had... Don't be jealous my brother in Dune.

Zeus69962 21:54, 30 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

My, but you DO get worked up, don't you?

I am passionate about my beliefs/interests and Dune is one of them... I get really angry when someone screws up a story (for example, most of the comic book movies); likewise, I believe someone should get kudos when they do something properly and when they take the time that is needed in order to make sure that it is inconsistancy free or at least as close as they possibly can to how it should be. I have discussed these matters (which come directly from that alt.fan.dune site)with KJA personally a while back and together we have found no errors in his story. I initially had some questions myself with the story which I could not answer but he showed me that he was right with the proof that I am now showing you. Trust me, there are answers to everything Brother RJ and rest assured, those questions that 'have no answers' (yet) WILL be answered in upcoming volumes. Things about Rhombur and other characters... Things which you are not yet allowed to know. You are angry because you had a preconcieved notion about something and were unhappy with the truth... I'm sorry but that's how life is my friend. I on the other hand, left myself open to many different possibilities so I had no problem accepting the truth of the story.

Don't be a hater... Make peace not war! ;)

LL&P

Zeus69962 06:28, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, Honored Fratre, how I envy you your simple faith!

But then, you have spoken directly with the Son of the Maker himself! Tell me, how exactly does one gain an audience with Herbert Minor? No doubt one much approach as supplicant, groveling before Greatness?

As I read the threads of the tangled weave over at "PsychoFant Central", I wondered which of the stalwart there was you. ???

If I am "angry" it is because some people were too greedy to leave something alone, or, unable to "leave the legs off the snake" (Japanese saying), they were unfit for the task undertaken. Truth? Ah well...

Charis soi, kai eirênê

This will not be dignified with an answer. Zeus69962 22:49, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It just was. Cheers!

Dune Timeline Discussion

I'm all for setting aside differences and working on a timeline... However, there is already a great timeline that was created by Dr. Attila Torkos who does the Hungarian translations and assists KJA in continuity. As far as I know, that timeline is fairly accurate.

Here is the website to the Timeline by Dr. Torkos:

http://sslx.orl.szote.u-szeged.hu/timelines/duchro.html

All the best

Zeus69962 19:27, 1 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Take out the Timeline from the Dune Encyclopedia... Dr. McNelly has admitted to writing things that are definately untrue, just to show that history can be tampered with. As well much of what he wrote (that wasn't totally untrue because that part wasn't written yet) was disregarded entirely by Frank and then after by Kevin and Brian. It if you insist that it be here then entitle it "The Dune Encyclopedia Timeline: A tampered with view on Dune's history" (or something like that) and put Dr. Torkos' as the "Dune Timeline"; it is cited and pretty damn accurate, if I do say so myself. Moreover, KJA has approved of Torkos to me personally so I stand by that timeline.

Zeus69962 18:58, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Try not to let this "Father of the Gods" stuff go to your head, will you? I don't take well to having imperatives directed at me. Show me the citation for McNelly's admission. (He's no longer with us, by the way.) I am well aware of the non-canonical status of the DE...a fact you would be aware of as well if you had bothered to read anything I wrote on the timeline page. To repeat: the DE timeline entries were used as a starting point. EVERYTHING has to be verified.

Your saying that Kevin J. Anderson has personally approved Torkos' timeline ALSO needs some sort of proof. I'm sorry, but your word is not enough for me.

Oh ye of little faith... Ask and you shall be given that which you ask; look for Torkos in this official blog written by KJA who verifies his credibility.

http://www.dunenovels.com/dune7blog/page41.html

Proof enough?

Zeus69962 20:59, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's usually spelled "ye", the old nominative/vocative form ("you" is the oblique and supplanted the nominative for some reason).

I'll forgive you this one because rereading what I myself (mis)wrote, your glee over this cheap point is understandable. You wrote:

Moreover, KJA has approved of Torkos to me personally so I stand by that timeline.

I left out to you when I wrote:

Your saying that Kevin J. Anderson has personally approved Torkos' timeline ALSO needs some sort of proof.

Sorry, this was my bad. However, a blog entry is not a personal communication. You have not proven your original statement.

Nor, more importantly, have you provided a citation for the McNelly statement.

Sorry, slip of the finger... Nonetheless it makes its point. I suggest renaming that timeline and putting this one up. I need not prove anything... Strike the former from the record if need be (although it is true, on more than one occasion) but the blog entry stands as proof of Torkos' timelines authenticity. I will look for the mcnelly statement.

Zeus69962 22:18, 2 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

(Rather pointless correcting "yee" since it will remain in the history. Yee, unto the ending of the wiki! ... Or was that "Yea"?)

I'm not interested in keeping the Torkos timeline as is because there are (well, let's be blunt about it) some mistakes in the English and it's a bit too detailed with respect to New Canon plots (I'm not sure we need to note every marriage and birth of every second daughter, for example); filling it out to the same degree for the Old Canon would be a waste of time and memory, since there are already synopses on the pages for the individual books.

Actually, whenever you make a statement of any kind you need to be prepared to back it up with some kind of proof. You have been on our planet long enough to have learned that much, right?

I explained why I put yee instead of ye... It was an accident. About Torkos' timeline, Spelling alterations (on your part) are acceptable, keep in mind that he is multilingual. Having the dates of births (et cetera) couldn't hurt. Regarding the proof, I could say the same about you. However, since I've provided the proof, only I would be the one telling the truth. Contemplate that. Zeus69962 04:10, 3 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Moved to temporary archive page 15:32, 20 June 2006

Dune Discrepancies

Thanks for the welcome. A couple of months ago I finished re-reading all 12 Dune books and could only agree that the prequels (regardless of whether or not they were based on F.Herbert's notes) are next to worthless simply due to their complete lack of depth and change in storytelling focus when compared to the original novels.

I'm sorry I didn't check this wiki earlier as I picked up numerous inconsistancies (some of which I was reminded of when reading this page) amongst the prequels during my last readings. I've added another (regarding Liet Kynes and Gurney Hallack) I remembered in the "Other Discrepancies" list although I forgot to log into my account before doing so. Hopefully more will come to mind in future.

Cheers

Size of discussion archive

When archiving discussions, I don't pay particular attention to size so much as pruning dead branches, meaning large sections that are no longer active, and are getting in the way in terms of page length.

I'm not sure if Zeus is more clueful about Wikipedia now--the last time I did it, he accused me of 'disappearing' his disagreements with our edits. So be prepared for a backlash.

Justin Johnson 19:32, 5 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Be extremely prepared... That would be a direct violation of our neutrality agreement... and an action of war! Zeus69962 03:48, 6 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

YAWN. Get a life already.

Delete all of your lies and I will... Until then, I must do what is right and that is taking out all of this garbage!

Zeus69962 16:35, 10 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ah, you've let it pile up, have you? I get that way sometimes, too. Always makes it a hassle when company drops by. (Or is this an indication of your occupation in the real world, waste management professional?) XXX

Archived 17:01 January 8, 2007 (JST)

Coal Grove Photo

Thanks for the message about my Ironton photo. Sorry, I don't have a photo of Coal Grove. I was planning on taking one, however. I will the next time I am in the area. My hometown is Ashland, but I currently live in Virginia. - Campaigner444 21:05, 16 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hanko

Aw, thanks. Yeah, I was unsure of that a while ago, back when I resented any use of my talkpage and used it just to make fun of the people who would revert it when I'd "vandalize" it. I like how there are people on Wikipedia who actually police when I "Vandalize" my own page. Go figure.

Thanks again. --Nathan Soto Piazza Alabaster Pimsleydale Saint Croix (N. S. P. Alabaster P. St. Croix) 00:47, 11 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Archived 6:37 February 2, 2007 (JST)

English language This page shows that the number of English speakers as the mother tongue is about 354 million. This means that English will be the 3rd place next to Chinese and Hindi. Also, the total number of English speakers is 1.3 billion to 1.8 billion. This means that it is going to be 1st. You can also look at List of languages by number of native speakers.--219.125.6.244 07:54, 14 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ohio

Nice to meet you! I've been to just a few of the counties on the Ohio River, one is the one the Serpent Mound is in (I think Adams). I'm not sure where Lawrence is but I'll look now. Some good old-time music in those areas, particularly Gallia. Badagnani 05:12, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, I see, it's where Ironton (ARN-ton, I'm told it's pronounced) is. You ought to expand the Lawrence County, Ohio article; it's pretty bare bones. Is there a university there? Or other attractions? Badagnani 05:17, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Old Chinese

Apparently Old Chinese had all kinds of consonant clusters, including "rz", "sz" , "cz", "prz", "trz," etc. I wonder how it all got smoothed out. The flute 籥 (old Chinese: "yak") is now called "yue," but see the Cantonese, Korean, and Japanese readings to see that they've retained the "-k" ending! When you say you have Chinese students, does that mean they're students from China, or students in a Chinese-language class you teach? Badagnani 05:15, 19 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Archived 23:41 May 26, 2007 (JST)

About Rokkoku

The answer is simple. It is easier to pronounce than kokuroku for native Japanese speakers. --Oda Mari 09:42, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Rokkou again

Isn't it easier for you to say? I'm not sure but kokuroku is a 4 syllable word. You have to say like ko-ku-ro-ku. But rokkoku could be a 2 syllable word in native's sense when speaking. Something like rock-cock. Anyway, it's easier! Accept it, please. --Oda Mari 10:19, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Rokkoku additional

Why easier? The sound pattern of the word rokkoku is very very familiar to Japanese people. Lots of words share the pattern. Both in intonation and accent. Like 早速（さっそく、immediately）とっても（very）まったく（quite）etc. That's why it's easier.

As for kokuroku, it doesn't have such sound pattern. You may think it's similar to 極力(きょくりょく/kyokuryoku, as possible), but you cannot say kokuroku cock-rock. The sound is not Japanese. So the native speakers automatically choose 4 syllable pronunciation when they have to say the word.

Understand? And who choose the difficult pronunciation when they want to say it in quicker,shortened form?

By the way, the hiragana table in Japanese language page is not perfect. Where is ga, gi gu, ge, go, za, ji, zu, ze, zo, da, zi, du, de, do, ba, bi, bu, be, bo, pa, pi, pu, pe, po?

I'd like to edit. But I don't know how to do it and too busy. Sorry! --Oda Mari 15:10, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I'm getting tired

穀物　is just a noun. You cannot shorten kokumotu. This is the basic form of the word. Like you cannot shorten a noun like grain, book, dog, cat etc.

But 国道六号線 is a combined word. 国道 plus 六号線. you can use 国道 alone. Or 六号線　alone too.

When you want to shorten a combined word, take one from the first noun and take another one from the second one. So take 国 from the first noun and take 六 from the second. Then combine again. And change the place. Like Latin, word order is not important in Japanese. Now you have ROKKOKU! You see the two elements are still there in the shortened form.

I don't think I can think of convincing explanation any more. I'm not a linguist. Find one and ask him/her yourself!

What do you think of my name? I'm really tired and want to have a hot bath. Bye for this time. Write me if you have any question. But easy one, please. --Oda Mari 16:15, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

やっぱり too tired

Why kokumotu cannot be reversed? As I wrote last time, the reason is this is the basic form of the noun. Of course people intentionally do like that speaking with friends. Like なおん（女、おんな), but that is not going to the standard usage.

People don't think how to shorten a word for speaking all the time.国道六号線　is kind of a typical word most of the Japanese feel like making it short. --Oda Mari 16:35, 8 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Additional 2

Not only intonation and accent but the rhythm of the word is familiar to the native speakers. It's ‘tan, ta ta’ as in ‘わっしょい’ or ‘Pop goes the(weasel)’.

So Rokkoku is very comfortable to the Japanese.

Maybe the comfortableness is related to 促音/double consonant but I have no idea about it. Don't ask me any more. --Oda Mari 06:57, 9 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

OK.

OK. You are a linguist. Find a native Japanese linguist, that's what I meant. But I guess you already know a lot.

I'm just a language-conscious native Japanese, working as an English fiction translator. Have native language sense, will help. But please don't use too many linguist terms.

...near the mid-point of your fifth decade? Not OK. Be honest. You are well past the mid-point. ...near the big five is more accurate and better, isn't it? Ha ha ha.

OK. You are an Ohioan, aren't you? But don't tell me you're from Yellow Springs.

By the way, why don't you write me in Japanese? --Oda Mari 15:21, 10 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

PS

You'd insist 45 or 46 is nearer to the mid-point. OK. But in the Japanese sense, the ‘near’ in this case is taken as 43 or 44. まぎらわしい！　You should write ‘I'm in my middle forty’ or ‘I'm past the mid-point...’. Now I think you'd insist you wrote for English readers, not for the Japanese. OK. Well, maybe that's the difference between 2 languages.--Oda Mari 07:11, 11 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Archived 07:40 November 3, 2007 (JST)

Me again

Sorry, it's me again. I think it's Dawson's Creek what's you are looking for. I read the Japanese grammar page & its talk page. Both were interesting. Especially aru/iru topic. Which do use when the subject is body or ghost? --Oda Mari 15:11, 26 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I still don't know which page is preferable to post my reply message. Mine? Or the sender's? 教えてください。Please take a look at my talk page. And I'd like to know your idea about ‘あまり' in the Grammar page.--Oda Mari 04:47, 27 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for the answer of the Wiki practice. I'm feeling すっきり. As I've not studied Japanese linguistics, I never thought of amimacy and never knew that there are various ways to analyze Japanese. But I doubt if it could be possible to analyze any language 100%. Well, I'm going to proof correct here and there in Wiki. I don't trust my English writing at all. --Oda Mari 14:17, 31 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject Japan taskforces

In order to encourage more participation, and to help people find a specific area in which they are more able to help out, we have organized taskforces at WikiProject Japan. Please visit the Participants page and update the list with the taskforces in which you wish to participate. Links to all the taskforces are found at the top of the list of participants.

Please let me know if you have any questions, and thank you for helping out! ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 01:32, 8 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]