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The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was WP:SNOW keep (non-admin closure) Elli (talk | contribs) 19:45, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Halyna Hutchins

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Halyna Hutchins (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log)
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WP:BLP1E; WP:ONEEVENT . Article created on the day the news broke about her death. While I am sure the women in red gang would disagree, to my mind, from the body of her article it's not evident there are any achievements in her life for which she would have been notable for wikipedia had she not been killed by Baldwin. Daikido (talk) 10:45, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Actors and filmmakers-related deletion discussions. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 11:48, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Women-related deletion discussions. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 11:48, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Please see WP:OTHERSTUFF. Wyliepedia @ 12:41, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • The onus is on the article creator to demonstrate it passes WP:GNG, not the other way round. They haven't done that, and doesn't look like she does. If in 1 month, 6 months or a year's time, she does for some reason, the article could be recreated at that point. But this is an article created in reaction to her death. Joseph2302 (talk) 12:58, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Question - There is no doubt that the article was created in reaction to her death, but how is that a problem? Just because there is one event that triggers an article creation doesn't mean that WP:ONEEVENT applies, or does it? Renerpho (talk) 16:56, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Ribbet32, that might apply if the article was not created immediately and obviously in reaction to a particularly major incident, which by itself does not establish notability. Display name 99 (talk) 15:18, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
That would just repeat the information from the Rust article. Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 15:13, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per Eastmain, Sandstein, Ref, Knockdomney, Hunter Kahn and Ribbet32. Halyna Hutchins is without a doubt sufficiently notable to be the subject of a Wikipedia article. She has 32 credits as a cinematographer as well as a number of other film credits and won the Jury Prize for Best Cinematography at the 2019 English Riviera Film Festival. —Roman Spinner (talk • contribs) 15:01, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    I absolutely agree. While she isn't super-notable, even without her death, she would still be borderline notable enough for an article. EytanMelech (talk) 15:17, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    I am not sure this obscure festival is a criteria for notability: does Boris Hallvig have a Wikipedia page ? He is the only other winner of the Cinematography prize in the history of this festival, that only added a cinematography prize in 2019, quite a reference... --Mayfoev (talk) 17:02, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep per editors before me. She has many notable credits. It's true that the article was mostly like created in response to her death, but as Ribbet32 points out "because articles must wait for someone who is interested in the subject to notice they are missing before they are created, a lot of articles do not exist that probably should." She should have already had an article before her death, but it took her death for an editor to realize that we didn't have one for her. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 15:22, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Move to "Death of Halyna Hutchins" as that is what was notable enough to cause this article creation. Warren Dew (talk) 15:25, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with this. Trillfendi (talk) 15:31, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@Warren Dew and Trillfendi: As I said before, a "death of" article would simply repeat the same information as the Rust article. She is notable enough to have an article about her career. Some Dude From North Carolina (talk) 15:35, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I strongly disagree with this. She has several notable credits. Yes, her death is what brought attention to the fact that she was lacking an article, but it's not what makes her notable. JDDJS (talk to me • see what I've done) 15:37, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Besides, looking at the list of obituaries published by „The...Reporter“, are there any other insignificant persons, to be excluded?☆☆☆—PietadèTalk 16:29, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep The article is not a day old and there’s significant coverage in the media. The other alternative would be just moving it to "Death of Halyna Hutchins". Keivan.fTalk 16:14, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: Given the amount of info the article has now, it seems that the individual is notable enough to merit an article, even putting aside the increased notoriety due to the unfortunate circumstances of the individual's death.--EdgarCabreraFariña (talk) 16:17, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Redirect to Rust (upcoming film)#Shooting incident. No independent notability for the individual, just the event. WP:BLP1E and WP:NOTMEMORIAL apply. Only deep coverage of her came after her death. – Muboshgu (talk) 16:20, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: Body of work substantial enough to justify keeping, aside from today’s tragic eve. yorkshiresky (talk) 16:35, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - From what others in the film industry have said about her, she was notable for her work where men typically have dominated the field. [1] JungleCat Shiny!/Oohhh! 16:42, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: Enough information for her notability as per now--Noel baran (talk) 16:45, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep, without redirect. She would have been notable enough without the events leading to her death. This was merely an opportunity to create an article that should have been created a long time ago. Renerpho (talk) 16:52, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: We can debate the importance for her career alone (I think it would be fine for a Wikipedia article), but the combination of her career and the circumstances of her death absolutely make this a clear keep for me. It is an important historical moment in filmmaking, and it will give future people a chance to learn about her life's work and legacy. Electricmaster (talk) 16:56, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Delete, or move to "Death of Halyna Hutchins". She doesn't seem notable, but her manner of death perhaps is.--A bit iffy (talk) 17:01, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Redirect to Rust (upcoming film)#Shooting incident or move to "Death of Halyna Hutchins". She was probably as talented as tributes seem to say, and a promising artist, but nothing in her body of work was notable at the time of her death (otherwise many obscure cinematographers would have a Wikipedia page). Mayfoev (talk) 17:09, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep, without redirect. She would have been notable enough without the events leading to her death. This was merely an opportunity to create an article that should have been created a long time ago. Renerpho (talk) 16:52, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: Of course this should be kept. I will never understand this desire on the part of some editors to delete articles! We want more information, not less. And who's to judge whose career is and isn't notable? She was the DP on Darlin', that is enough for me, as I very much like that film, and it's part of The Woman series of films that are cult favorites. Jmj713 (talk) 17:24, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: So that others may know the dangers of using prop guns; this is not the first death that has resulted on a movie set. Her life was as important as any other person. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 63.105.50.19 (talk) 17:37, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep: If the upcoming film is/was important enough to include A-list actors, the cinematographer tragically killed on set is certainly notable enough to have her own Wikipedia page. Phineas Gage (just a random construction foreman) would not have had a Wikipedia page had he not been impaled by an iron rod while working. People will want to know who this person was and her body of work. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2600:8806:1100:4C0:8C59:8AD3:4219:A0BB (talk) 17:57, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep - she appears to have had WP:CREATIVE notability before her death due to her collective body of work, and she now appears to have further WP:BASIC notability due to the in-depth coverage of her and her career from multiple independent and reliable sources. Beccaynr (talk) 18:01, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Move - Moving to "Death of Halyna Hutchins" would seem to be option most consistent with similar events. While at this time most of the information would be repeated between this article and "Rust" as the event develops and more information becomes available and subsequent fallout occurs, this would be likely be better suited for this article and not an article about the film. 2001:8003:2360:2400:D17E:68E8:B250:54F6 (talk) 18:07, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Comment: Is it too soon to note that it's WP:SNOWing? – Athaenara ✉ 18:30, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
    • Since this is not a vote tally and some of the "keep" votes are non-policy based, such as So that others may know the dangers of using prop guns, yes, it would be too quick to close this now. An admin will need to take their time parsing this. – Muboshgu (talk) 18:35, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep she was even described in the main Dutch news programm: NOS Journaal. SportsOlympic (talk) 18:34, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
  • Keep. (Rephrasing after edit conflict.) Note arguments put forth by Eastmain, Sandstein, Knockdomney, Hunter Kahn, Roman Spinner, JDDJS, Yorkshiresky, Junglecat, and others. (Is it too soon to point out that it's WP:SNOWing and time to speedy keep?) – Athaenara ✉ 18:41, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Ukraine-related deletion discussions. Spiderone(Talk to Spider) 18:34, 22 October 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.
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